Anchor Chain Twist Nightmare

[GMac]

I've also seen them, all were on boats already, but sorry don't know where to aim you. I'd have a suspicion most were custom made as they all were a little different than each other.

Be easy to make if you could score a wildcat cheap.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by jkleins

s/v Jedi, where did you get the G7 galvanized chain? You mentioned in one thread you ordered it from the company and I can't seem to find it in any of the literature. Was it something you had to special order? Did you have to have a special wildcat for it or did Maxwell have one that fit it? I like the idea of stronger, smaller and lighter chain so I can carry more of it and wanted to look at all the options.

Thanks,
Jim

I ordered it from Marine Warehouse in Miami (and they got it direct from ACCO chain) and yes it was special order because of my requirement for bigger end-links (you need those to match the shackle WLL) and hot-dip galvanizing. This chain is normally not galvanized. But... I saw it in a West Marine catalog galvanized so I guess it's easier now. You still need special order for the bigger end links. I paid way less than half the WM price but that was in 2004...

cheers,
Nick.

[GMac]

If I remember correctly Acco won't put on enlarged end links anymore and will suggest you use a big tested shackle.

But no harm in asking, you just never know.

And while it may appear that way, No I'm not stalking you Jedi. I just seem to be a few minutes behind you on the same path Like to catch up for a beer and a chat with you one day. Be very interesting I'd expect.

[cat man do]

I just got onto a large chain manufacturer in Australia about some chain lengths with the large link ends.

The quote?

10mm SL Grade ‘L’ Galv Chain with End Links Each End $770.00 Each + GST (for 50m)

They assured me that this was the correct price.

I can get exactly the same chain (and they confirmed this) through a reseller for less than $400, but without the 2 extra links of chain.

So with GST, that $447 for 2 links of chain

Ouch, something tell me they aint interested

[s/v Jedi]

So, what is the working load and breaking strength of that grade of chain? I don't know anything about "grade L" ...

May be you don't need bigger end links for that grade of chain?

cheers,
Nick.

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

So, what is the working load and breaking strength of that grade of chain? I don't know anything about "grade L" ...

May be you don't need bigger end links for that grade of chain?

cheers,
Nick.

Perhaps you can tell me?
This was not the crowd who quoted me, but are the ones who have info on their site.
PWB Anchor Grade L Chain specs

It would seem to be 1.2 tonnes

I also see they have Fathom Chain, with large links already in
PWB Anchor Fathom Chains-Grade L

[s/v Jedi]

I have no clue. I would want to know the breaking strength and exactly which chain fits the chainwheels etc. This stuff is completely different than US grades like from ACCO chain.

cheers,
Nick.

[GMac]

Grades are the same world wide. The US 'BBB' or '3B' is a Grade L.

Grade 30 is the old name for Grade L. Grade 40 is now Grade M. Grade 50 is Grade P and it continues.

An Aussie made Grade L 10mm has a break load of 5000kg and a SWL of 25% of that which is 1250kg.

A Grade 40 has a break of 6400 and a SWL of 1600kg. None of that is made and I don't think commonly available in Aussie but is commonly available in NZ even if not made there either.

The BBB load numbers will be a little different as that is a imperial 3/8" rather than a metric 10mm.

Yes Cat, it does very much appear someone can't be bothered fitting enlarged end links and has priced accordingly. I'm pretty sure if the ladies you asked won't do it PWB probably won't either. They do seem to be more willing to do strange stuff in the northern manufacturer than the one in Vic.

Most manufacturers have stopped doing it these days. Get 2 16mm 'Regular link' links and go to a good welder. They could fit those and then smother the buggers in cold galv. I say regular links as they have bigger internal dimensions so you can fit things in a lot better. Strength won't be an issue but if you get a enlarged link each end remember you have to fit one end through your winch and in many they probably wouldn't fit.

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by GMac

I'm pretty sure if the ladies you asked won't do it PWB probably won't either.

I did link this a few posts back


PWB Anchor Fathom Chains-Grade L

[GMac]

They do those but when asked seem very reluctant to do one offs, a bit strange.

Maybe score the 60 fathom one and chop it in 1/2? Sell 1/2 or keep as the secondary maybe?

[Extemporaneous]

Anyone know where the stresses are the least within the perimeter of the chain link when in tension?
Just curious where in the link one should make the X cut when putting on a larger link.
My farmer sense thinks it would be somewhere along the round end (45 degrees?) when in tension due to a larger cross section in relation to the force. Perhaps not less stress just more strength?
But I'm just guessing .

Anyone?

Extemp.

[GMac]

Assuming you have a chain link with the long sides pointing to 12 and 6 O'clock i.e. round ends pointing up and down. When you bust a good chain it will usually go at 2, 4, 8 or 10 O'clock type position. Just a bit into the bend after the straight sides, if that makes sense.

So that would suggest those spots are the weakest when at big loads so don't muck with them incase you weaken them further.

We tend to cut the weld out and replace that working on the theory 'fiddle with the bit that's already been fiddled with'. As yet we have had zero issues doing that.

There is nothing scientific about that, more just that's what we do and have had no problems doing it.... where a bit of wood to touch

We proof load (twice the SWL) each one we do, just in case. So far all good.

If it's a chinese made chain do the weld, you'll probably only improve the chains strength. Chinese made chains often will not break rather than just open up at the 'weld', that's assuming they did remember to actually weld that link. Don't laugh, it happens a lot more than you would expect where one or 2 links just haven't been welded.

[Extemporaneous]

Originally Posted by GMac

Assuming you have a chain link with the long sides pointing to 12 and 6 O'clock i.e. round ends pointing up and down. When you bust a good chain it will usually go at 2, 4, 8 or 10 O'clock type position. Just a bit into the bend after the straight sides, if that makes sense.

Well, I guess I had that just about EXACTLY WRONG.
Rethinking Considering your experience, perhaps it is in this straight section of the link that the most true/straight (no diagonal forces) tension is and hence the stronger?
Thanks for your experience.

Originally Posted by GMac

So that would suggest those spots are the weakest when at big loads so don't muck with them incase you weaken them further.

Got it.

Originally Posted by GMac

We tend to cut the weld out and replace that working on the theory 'fiddle with the bit that's already been fiddled with'. As yet we have had zero issues doing that.

I would have thought this would have induced work hardening.
When thoughts are guesses sometimes there wrong .
Can't argue with results!

Originally Posted by GMac

If it's a chinese made chain do the weld, you'll probably only improve the chains strength. Chinese made chains often will not break rather than just open up at the 'weld', that's assuming they did remember to actually weld that link. Don't laugh, it happens a lot more than you would expect where one or 2 links just haven't been welded.

Nope it's ACCO.

Thanks for the insight.
Extemp.

[GMac]

Ya Whot!!!! You mean you've seen unwelded Acco? He asks with a gasp. That would be unusual I would expect, very much so. Then again when you make millions if not billions of links a year some surely have to sneak through with the odd issue.

All good chains are 'normalised' or 'stress relieved' during the manufacturing process so in theory all of the link should be relaxed and be the same all over.

Hence the weld zone should be the same as the rest. Again theory but sounds like a pretty good one.

Quite impressive to watch the normalisation process. Cold chain goes into a 3-4ft long pipe like thing covered in big wires and comes out the other end almost white hot and into a plunge bath. The process is repeated a couple of times. Massive power wires, hot metal, steam and so on, all a bit much for a lad who like playing with stuff like that. Chuck in some diesel and hydraulic fluid and I'd be like a pig in a big pen of pooh

[s/v Jedi]

But but but... if that Assie chain is the same grade as BBB why bother with enlarged links? Regular shackles of same SWL fit the normal link... puzzled...

When I ordered my new chain at ACCO after hurricane Ivan, I specified 350' single piece 3/8" G7 chain (SWL 6,600 lbs), enlarged end-links on both ends welded on before hot-dip galvanize and full x-ray (each link) and SWL test. They charged $350 extra for that and included a full test report.

Recently I found "chain couplers" for 3/8" chain with a 6,600 lbs SWL... in the West Marine catalog, of all places. I have a couple and will soon test how they pass the chainwheel when used for coupling two chains, plus I will measure the jaw openings to see how big a shackle can be attached to it. I'll also see what size line could be spliced to it.
They aren't galvanized unfortunately, but have that "gold" coating instead. I'll spray that galvanize stuff on it and hope for the best if I start using them.

cheers,
Nick.