Why Use Shackles to Attach Halyards?

[skipmac]

I've been using shackles on my halyards for 40 years and have had one pop open. It was 30 years ago so cannot remember the type but it was due to the design of that particular shackle and possibly because it was undersized.

Like Jim Cate, since the head of the sails is attached to mast or stay I don't see a problem with the sail flogging and potential injury from a flying shackle. Sheets on the other hand are an entirely different matter.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by delmarrey

You know the OP only mentioned "attaching to sails" but failed to say where. I assumed halyards. I can't imagine anyone attaching shackles to the clew, that's committing suicide.

Well, Del, the title of the thread is : Why Use Shackles to Attach Halyards?".

As to the risk associated with shackles at the clew -- our sails have big s/s rings, welded up out of 3/8 inch diameter rod as the clew cringle. Adding a shackle doesn't add all that much danger IMO, but I like the soft shackles better anyhow!

Jim

[Jman]

Depending on the design of the headboard on the main, they can often have sharp edges that would quickly eat a line passed right through. So if you want use knots on that you would probably have to have a permanent bow shackle attached to it in any event., so why not use the a quicker version (not snap shackle, but probably what is already there).

Jib is probably different at the head, and a knot would be fine. However knots are significantly weaker than a properly done splice.


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[savoir]

Tylaska shackles are great for halyards and don't come undone. Look after one and it will last 30 years. I won't use anything else.



They also make the best captive pin halyard shackles.

[model 10]

[QUOTE=savoir;1613749]Tylaska shackles are great for halyards and don't come undone. Look after one and it will last 30 years. I won't use anything else.

How do you open one of those shackles?

[roverhi]

Have been using knots to sercure halyards to the head of sails for 40 years and many thousands of miles without a problem. Nice thing about attaching halyards with bowline or buntline hitch is you can move any wear point just by tieing the knot differently or cutting a few inches off the halyard if you want to go whole hog. Any sharp edge from a metal headboard could be rounded off easily with a file if necessary, The only reason to have a shackle on a halyard is to keep Schaeffer, Harken, etc. in two martini lunches.

For my almost always bent on 135 roller furling genoa, used a Brummel splice. Has worked super as the line no longer hangs up on the shrouds and sail moves through the tack with no issues.

Originally Posted by Jman

Depending on the design of the headboard on the main, they can often have sharp edges that would quickly eat a line passed right through. So if you want use knots on that you would probably have to have a permanent bow shackle attached to it in any event., so why not use the a quicker version (not snap shackle, but probably what is already there).

Jib is probably different at the head, and a knot would be fine. However knots are significantly weaker than a properly done splice.


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[delmarrey]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Well, Del, the title of the thread is : Why Use Shackles to Attach Halyards?".

As to the risk associated with shackles at the clew -- our sails have big s/s rings, welded up out of 3/8 inch diameter rod as the clew cringle. Adding a shackle doesn't add all that much danger IMO, but I like the soft shackles better anyhow!

Jim

You got me there!

I never was much of a proof reeder.

[savoir]

[QUOTE=Guy;1613801]

Originally Posted by savoir

Tylaska shackles are great for halyards and don't come undone. Look after one and it will last 30 years. I won't use anything else.

How do you open one of those shackles?

Put your finger in the center hole and pull the trigger. Under big load you will need a fid but with halyards that is unlikely.

Tylaska products are justplain the best.

[CAELESTIS]

Consider these Softie® Shackles and Hanks - Colligo Marine - Synthetic Rigging

I use the Colligo shackles to attach the genoa sheets. The sheets have a tight eye spliced in, and the shackle goes on that. No clunky bowlines to hang up. No need for a spike after they have been loaded up.

[Weyalan]

Originally Posted by CAELESTIS

Consider these Softie® Shackles and Hanks - Colligo Marine - Synthetic Rigging

I use the Colligo shackles to attach the genoa sheets. The sheets have a tight eye spliced in, and the shackle goes on that. No clunky bowlines to hang up. No need for a spike after they have been loaded up.

For the penny-pinchers (like me), Colligo have a great U-tube video on their site that shows you how to make these soft shackles yourself.

[Ex-Calif]

Originally Posted by roverhi

Have been using knots to sercure halyards to the head of sails for 40 years and many thousands of miles without a problem. Nice thing about attaching halyards with bowline or buntline hitch is you can move any wear point just by tieing the knot differently or cutting a few inches off the halyard if you want to go whole hog. Any sharp edge from a metal headboard could be rounded off easily with a file if necessary, The only reason to have a shackle on a halyard is to keep Schaeffer, Harken, etc. in two martini lunches.

For my almost always bent on 135 roller furling genoa, used a Brummel splice. Has worked super as the line no longer hangs up on the shrouds and sail moves through the tack with no issues.

The other argument for knots is that you can get the sail higher to the top sheave and not lose the length of the shackle.

Minor nit (like .005% sail area) but "racing" guys are like that...

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by Ex-Calif

The other argument for knots is that you can get the sail higher to the top sheave and not lose the length of the shackle.

Minor nit (like .005% sail area) but "racing" guys are like that...

And a reason not to splice. (Splices can hang in the sheave and are not much fun in used line. Someone made a comment about strength, but since halyards are sized for stretch and not strength, the point is irrelevant. They only fail due to chafe.

[Jman]

Originally Posted by thinwater

And a reason not to splice. (Splices can hang in the sheave and are not much fun in used line. Someone made a comment about strength, but since halyards are sized for stretch and not strength, the point is irrelevant. They only fail due to chafe.

Well that may be the case for for you, it is an absolutely false statement to say halyards are sized for stretch. Depending on the line used stretch can be minimal regardless of size. Fact: knots ( of any kind ) reduce strength by at least 40% and sometimes as much as 60% depending on the fibers used. Add a little chaff into your equation and it could be far worse.

The reason your splices are jamming is probably because your line is way oversized for sheaves.

Also in response to pulling your sails higher, you can't go above the black band while racing, regardless of how you attach it.


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[Ex-Calif]

Originally Posted by Jman

Also in response to pulling your sails higher, you can't go above the black band while racing, regardless of how you attach it.


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Sometimes I wonder what people are debating. No one said to break any rules.

Also a knot is lighter than a shackle.
Also a knot is free.


OP asked specifically - "Why use Shackles on a Halyard?"

Answer - You don't need to...

He also asked, "What are the advantages of a shackle for a halyard?"

Answer - Arguably quicker attach and release.

Who cares? Do what ya'll want. I am not advocating anything...

[MangoCats]

Originally Posted by Ex-Calif

...a knot is lighter than a shackle.
Also a knot is free.

OP asked specifically - "Why use Shackles on a Halyard?"

Answer - You don't need to...

He also asked, "What are the advantages of a shackle for a halyard?"

Answer - Arguably quicker attach and release.

Dredging up an old thread, but sharing my 0.02, I've got a main headboard that looks like it would chafe through a rope in short order, putting soft line through those sharp edges never even crossed my mind.

Otherwise, sure, all of the above.