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Old 13-04-2010, 10:44   #16
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Knots reduce the strength of a line by about 50%, a splice retains 90% of the line strength.
Splicing Three Strand Rope by Don Casey


I do splices infrequently enough that I'm staring at the instruction sheet carefully each time, but my jib and main halyards are spliced. If I wasn't going to splice, I would lash or stitch the bitter end of the line to the standing part so for that 1 in a 1000 scene of a flogging sail shaking an unloaded knot out while you're reefing in a big wind doesn't add to your troubles.

I'd think any of the halyard shackles appropriately sized for your boat would work from this page:
APS - Shackles - Halyard, D, Bow, Twist & Swivel
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Old 13-04-2010, 10:59   #17
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I sail a lot of charter boats, most shackles (foresail and main) are spliced in.



Ensure that pin is a captive type.

If you are using a bowline to attach the halyard, I would recommend using a safety half hitch in the tail.
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Old 13-04-2010, 16:30   #18
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G'Day All,

I've started replacing Buntline hitches with an un-named knot recommended by the folks at Selden Spars. I don't have any link to this, but if you can find any of their instruction manuals (like for a Furlex furler ar one of their single-line reefing booms) they show how to tie it. Easy to tie, and much less prone to jamming than the Buntline.

And come on guys, doing a simple eye splice in double braid ain't that hard... just follow the directions and presto -- it's done!

Cheers,

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Old 13-04-2010, 17:11   #19
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The single biggest argument for splicing as opposed to knotting is, in my opinion, strength. A bowline will, in general, reduce the breaking strength of the rope by roughly 50% whereas a good eye-splise (with a thimble where applicable) should only drop the breaking strength by maybe 15%. Obviously not all the lines on the boat are loaded to within a bull's roar of the breaking strength - sheets, for example, are often oversized, from a strength point of view, in order to provide good handling / feel. Nevertheless, considering that eye-splicing is not a particularly difficult or arcane art, the arguments for splicing where possible are, to my mind, compelling.

I do tend to over-size the headboard shackle and the clips on the other halyards, just because it is such a pain in the butt if you do lose a halyard... I avoid going up the stick (or, more accurately, sending Lisa up the stick - she weighs 100 pounds less than me, and I am stronger than her for winching) where possible.

I agree that captive-pin shacles are the way to go.

The one shown above is a thimble shackle (obviating the need for a thimble in the eye-splice). I think the picture is of a Wichard Part # 1494 (8mm - 5/16" pin) or 1495 (10mm - 3/8" pin) which retail for about $43 and $67 hereabouts.

Tylaska do a nice thimble shackle too, only even more expensive.

If you don't mind splicing a thimble into your eye-splice, something like a Ronstan RF1034 is a fraction of the price of those above and just as good.
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Old 13-04-2010, 17:35   #20
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Knots rule, shackles druel!!!!!!!!
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Old 13-04-2010, 17:42   #21
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Shackles? We don't use no steenkeeng shackles! We have about a dozen of these; Softies XL Large Boat Series Soft Shackles | Colligo Synthetic Systems | Colligo Marine lying around the boat. It takes about 5 minutes to make one for the price of the line (not cheap). They have pretty much replaced shackles on our boat. Although for the main halyard I just tie a buntline hitch with the end tucked back along the bight a soft shackle could be used through an eyesplice.

There is a method of using the end of the halyard itself to make a similar shackle. I don't have a picture but it's basicly done by making a loop a few inches from the end of the line by passing the line through itself using a fid. The polyester cover is then removed from the end and a stopper knot is tied. This is then passed through the loop and cinched tight.

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Old 13-04-2010, 18:02   #22
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Stunsail Tack Bend

Quote:
Originally Posted by roverhi View Post
Have mostly used bowline but have switched to the buntline hitch because of the more slippery nature of the modern low stretch ropes.

The Buntline Hitch

Be sure and leave a good tail on any knot but especially a bowline as they can shake loose without it.
That's what I use too, except I've learned it as the "stuns'l tack bend". It's a nice, compact knot, doesn't come loose, and it's reasonably easy to untie.
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Old 13-04-2010, 18:26   #23
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Originally Posted by mikereed100 View Post
Shackles? We don't use no steenkeeng shackles
It's the Aussie Bowline (or is the Kiwi?). From my 11:Metre match racing days. We wanted to save weight aloft, fudge the rules a little bit, and be absolutely sure the halyard didn't come off any sail at any time.

Ya tie a stopper knot near the end of the halyard. Push a bight thru the sail or headboard kringle, insert the stopper knot thru the bight, pull the halyard tight. It won't ever come undone. Not even after the race. Kinda eats up the halyard, but the sponsor paid for those. Won't work if the kringle is big enough to pass the stopper.

Bowline are known to shake out. And in our case would sometimes jam in the masthead. This knot won't.

Definitely NOT a cruising technique.
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Old 13-04-2010, 18:44   #24
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(Having just returned from the afternoon lecture, it saddens me to announce that it does not appear that Mark and I will be trading lives anytime soon.)

The reason I'm willing to go the extra length to splice a halyard is because it's not just sails that go up on those lines--it's me.

Regardless, Mark, in your special situation I think a knot will do. Is it a main halyard? Do you own a bossun's chair? In that case, I understand that a slipknot is superior to the buntline hitch. Resolves all those complaints about never coming undone.
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Old 14-04-2010, 00:27   #25
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A good discussion

I wanted the shackle because I want the halyard to be the exact same length each time so I can put pen marks on it and the reefing lines of my brand new mailsail! Up for the first time today and doing wonderfully with 7 knots up the butt at 120 degrees as we drift along under the early Mediterrasnean sun..

Oh, gotta go, Nic has just made breakfast.


Bash... are you still there????????????
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Old 14-04-2010, 02:40   #26
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Hi - we use shackles and buntline hitches with the ends whipped. To use the ,ines to go up the mast, either take the hitch off or feed the shackle through the harness ring and then tie a knot (bowline with stopper hitch).

It's done for us and indeed RG's previous owner for a long way. I like the softies, and used their equivalent in traditional rope on the previous boat, but they're too dear for replacement at the moment.

MarkJ - are you coming further west this summer?
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Old 14-04-2010, 03:26   #27
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MarkJ - are you coming further west this summer?
Yes. All the way west. Wherever we can find a free anchorage in the western Med we will be there after Greece

Will we be bumping into you??

Then Caribbean for christmas
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