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Old 21-06-2010, 15:48   #16
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Hiracer, could you explain to me how the ocean currents are going to push this stuff up for decades to come? How does that cold water at 5000 ft rise(and mix with relatively much warmer water nearer the surface)? I'd like to hear your explanation of how this would happen.
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Old 21-06-2010, 15:53   #17
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Was your op another* "drug induced question"?

* http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ion-18551.html
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Old 21-06-2010, 16:12   #18
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I know several guys who work offshore in the vicinity of the spill and they tell me its a mess out there in the immediate vicinity of the spill but not bad if you are 15 miles away. (ie the spill is nasty but somewhat localized)

When the Ixtoc spill covered the beaches in South Padre Island, Texas, the Gulf and the land affected recovered very quickly but the topography was quite different (desert sand dunes vs. marshes and bayous) so I would not draw too many conclusions from how South Texas did to predict how Louisiana will do.
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Old 21-06-2010, 16:18   #19
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15 miles? Wouldn't 150 million gallons spread out on the surface to a much much much bigger slick. Why would that much oil drifting in the currents stay that close to the site? The one link shows that they have recovered 23.9 million gallons of oil/water mix so far. Meaning some of this number is water. Where is the other 125 MILLION GALLONS?
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Old 21-06-2010, 16:32   #20
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15 miles? Wouldn't 150 million gallons spread out on the surface to a much much much bigger slick. Why would that much oil drifting in the currents stay that close to the site? The one link shows that they have recovered 23.9 million gallons of oil/water mix so far. Meaning some of this number is water. Where is the other 125 MILLION GALLONS?

Let me clarify - 15 miles from the slick, not the well. IOW, either you are in the soup or the water is not bad - there is not much transition zone.
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Old 21-06-2010, 16:42   #21
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Ude, I have many of the same questions as you.

Two days ago I noticed a tar ball on Panama City Beach that was smaller that a quarter.

The oil spill is not what the media is telling us it is. I don't know what it is, but I do not believe what is being presented.

Fear is what is being sold!

If it is what we are being told, then I am embarrassed to be considered human.
What would I tell our animal friends? Sorry...but I had to travel 55 to get to my job. It was cold this winter and I had to heat my huge home because I didn't want to skin you to keep myself alive.

I have used oil and will continue to use oil so I have responsibility.

BP, Corporations, Governments are not responsible because they are nothing but an idea (a sword and a shield).

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Old 21-06-2010, 16:55   #22
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How does that cold water at 5000 ft rise(and mix with relatively much warmer water nearer the surface)?
No experts here, but this seems to be a valid and potentially very important point that we cannot recall being addressed amidst all the 'noise' around this episode. Surely the fact of this 'spill' being at the ocean floor whereas all previous spills being on the surface (that we can remember anyway) is not merely incidental and irrelevant?

To the extent that the oil actually does make its way up to the surface currents, then it may soon be a case of 'Hello Europe!' as the oil may be sucked around the tip of Florida and into the Gulf Stream...
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Old 21-06-2010, 17:31   #23
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You're right. There is no oil spill. This is all a giant hoax and the videos you see are special effects filmed in the same studio where "they" filmed the fake moon landings.
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Old 21-06-2010, 17:50   #24
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...Also, where's the armchair physicists out there? How would it surface anyway? It's under 3000 PSI down there pushing it down...
Hydrostatic pressure is isotropic (acts equally in every direction). The pressure of deep water is not pushing the oil down at all: it is simply squeezing it in from every direction. So long as the oil has sufficient energy to enter the water column from its source below (which it clearly does from the videos of it gushing out), once the oil is in the column its lower density will naturally make it rise, regardless of the water (and resulting oil) pressure.

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...could you explain to me how the ocean currents are going to push this stuff up for decades to come? How does that cold water at 5000 ft rise(and mix with relatively much warmer water nearer the surface)? I'd like to hear your explanation of how this would happen.
The cold water does not need to rise through the warmer water in order for the oil to move from one to the other. The oil is of lower density so will naturally rise through the water column. Although a temperature differential may slow that movement, and allow the oil to pool temporarily before surfacing, it will eventually make its way up as the temperature differentials fluctuate.
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Old 21-06-2010, 17:56   #25
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You seem to suppose that since the pressure at 1 mile depth is high, the oil will simply gather on the ocean floor. This is incorrect. The density of oil is less than that of seawater. It will rise, and drift about.

Tests Confirm Spreading Oil Plumes in the Gulf - NYTimes.com

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Descriptions of the plumes from the two groups of scientists are filling in details of one of the most remarkable findings to come from the disaster: the realization that much of the oil in a deepwater blowout may remain below the surface.
The scientists say the plumes are not bubbles of oil, as many people have imagined them, but consist of highly dispersed or dissolved hydrocarbons. In some spots, enough oil is present to discolor the water, but in most places, water samples come up clear. Yet the dissolved hydrocarbons show up vividly on instruments, and they can be smelled in some samples.
“This so-called invisible oil, which people tend to have a hard time grasping, is detectable clearly using analytical methods,” said Ernst Peebles, a University of South Florida oceanographer who helped carry out the research.
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Old 21-06-2010, 20:08   #26
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Skipmac,
I am not saying that there is no oil spewing into the Gulf. Not even arguing about the estimates(150 million gallons). I am talking about the news reports that talk as if there is a 'giant oil slick the size of Vermont(and growing)' and the pictures and amount of oil that has shown up on the beaches(after 62 days) don't add up to what we are being told. If there were that much oil on the surface and heading for the beaches then all the skimmers on Earth wouldn't be able to catch all of it before it hit the shores. I grew up in Southern Cal and had to clean tar off my feet everyday(yeah there is lots of oil in California). The tar balls shown on Panama City Beach is about the same as on the So Cal beaches. Where is the 150 Million gallons?
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Old 21-06-2010, 20:28   #27
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Beaches are not the problem. They are relatively easy to clean. No one can know how this oil will behave, due to dilution and current, and how much wetlands will be affected. But ask the locals whose fishing and shrimping grounds are now off limits, and who are now working for BP cleaning up their mess, and I'm sure they will tell you where to shove your tarballs.
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Old 21-06-2010, 20:40   #28
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That oil floats on salt water is Petroleum Engineering 101 and the basis for many of the world's oil fields.
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Old 21-06-2010, 20:56   #29
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If oil floats in saltwater then where is the 150 million gallon oil slick? Are tarballs(coagulated oil) really less dense than seawater? Is some of the 'pressure' we are seeing at the wellhead is partially the differential of temperature(the oil and gas being a lot warmer than the surrounding water) with the oil(warmer than the water) rising initially due to this? Yeah oil does float on seawater when it's at the surface....but at 5000' deep it doesn't appear to be true.
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Old 21-06-2010, 22:49   #30
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Beaches are not the problem. They are relatively easy to clean. No one can know how this oil will behave, due to dilution and current, and how much wetlands will be affected. But ask the locals whose fishing and shrimping grounds are now off limits, and who are now working for BP cleaning up their mess, and I'm sure they will tell you where to shove your tarballs.
Hey Jerry- How did these become MY tarballs??? This is the problem, an attitude like that. And aren't the 'tarballs' really all of ours as we all are equally using oil and that's why BP(and the rest) are drilling for oil. Because we demand it and will pay lots of money for it so they are willing to search the world to find it, take all kinds of risks bringing it up from incredible depths our forefathers would never dream we could even drill to, then transport it to us in various forms where we all will line up with our hands full of cash to buy it. That's why there is oil spewing at ungodly rates into the depths of the Gulf of Mexico(It's just not coming to the surface at great rates relative to the overall spill). Until we all own up to that part of the blame we are talking out of both sides of our mouths when we are pointing fingers all over the place and like many things, nothing will change. It's sort of like the drug cartel problem in Mexico, without an incredible US demand for the drugs that transit through Mexico, there would be no drug cartels in Mexico as they only exist due to the demand here. Get rid of the demand(for drugs), get rid of the problem(Mexican drug war). Stop using oil, no more oil spills. What's a good solution for one problem(Mexico) is a dumb solution to the other(Oil).
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