Do we need to be preparing for Arctic cruising strategies because of Global Cooling

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by GoingWalkabout

The hysterics and lies are so pervasive that I choose not to participate in the craziness.

We're still waiting for you to no longer participate.

[Exile]

Originally Posted by StuM

Yep, every time I see the expression "climate change denier", I know that I am dealing with someone who either doesn't understand the argument or is arguing from vested interests.

A little history:

The whole thing started with warnings about "Catastrophic Anthropogenic Global Warming" (CAGW). There were a number of scientifically well educated people who doubted the validity of the "Catastrophic" and openly said that they were sceptical of the alarmism.

Those in the CAGW alarmism camp dropped the word "catastrophic" from the name because of the obvious dubiousness of that claim, but continued with exactly the same alarmism under the brand AGW. The sceptics recognised that the name may have changed but the message hadn't and continued to express their doubts about that C.

When it became apparent that warming wasn't occur as predicted, the AGW alarmists changed the name again to Man Made Climate Change (MMCC) and started to blame every extreme weather event on it, while still continuing the "catastrophic" meme. The sceptics recognised that the name had changed but the the message still hadn't and continued to express doubts about that C.

The alarmists then stopped using the words "man made" and just shortened it to "Climate Change". The sceptics recognised that it was still exactly the same old CAGW alarmism under yet another name and pointed out that climate change has always been happening and continued to express doubts about that C.

Then along came the master stroke: some genius came up with the concept of calling the sceptics and doubters "deniers" with the obvious adverse connection to "holocaust deniers".

So we end up with the scientifically educated people who are justifiably sceptical of the C in CAGW now being accused of being scientific morons who deny that climate changes. And among the more strident of these accusers are certain "scientists" who keep trying to flatten out both Holocene and 20th Century temperature reconstructions and records to hide the climatic variations revealed by them. The most infamous of them being of course the "Hockey Stick"

A masterpiece of deceit by the spin doctors of the CAGW promulgators.

A masterpiece indeed. Not necessarily because the CAGW promulgators may ultimately be proven right or wrong, but because they've managed to convince so many people that the science is totally "settled," and therefore those who continue to challenge it are motivated purely by politics, money, religion, or even race & gender. In other words, the skeptics are marginalized for reasons that have nothing to do with the actual science.

I, for one, don't have the personal background nor expertise to reach a definitive conclusion, but have at least studied it enough to credibly believe that the science remains unsettled. But that sort of conclusion requires stepping outside "party lines" and doing some indpt. study. Unfortunately, that sort of needed study is often stymied by highly politicized & partisan individuals, organizs., and websites. Imho, and despite its length, the other thread has done a pretty good job of exposing many of the biases on both sides of the debate. And there have been many time-consuming contributions from people with more scientific/engineering backgrounds like Jackdale & StuM who have probably educated many on the actual science, incl. laymen like myself.

But with over 2600 posts, you definitely have to separate the wheat from the chaff.

[boatman61]

My...!!
Amazing how a bunch of sheep Farting in OZ and NZ in the last century has matured...

[SV THIRD DAY]

Originally Posted by Exile

But with over 2600 posts, you definitely have to separate the wheat from the chaff.

But it's the Chaff that's entertaining....
The Cold Truth Initiative

[Exile]

Originally Posted by boatman61

My...!!
Amazing how a bunch of sheep Farting in OZ and NZ in the last century has matured...

Methane. Very bad for the environment, so say some. But Stu can actually give you the exact chemical breakdown if you want.

[StuM]

Originally Posted by SV THIRD DAY

But it's the Chaff that's entertaining....
The Cold Truth Initiative

That guy is brilliant at what he does!

That is a text book example of "How to sell subcription based services on the Internet to Joe Sixpack".

It's cherry picking scammers like him that give the real sceptics a bad name.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Exile

Methane. Very bad for the environment, so say some. But Stu can actually give you the exact chemical breakdown if you want.

So technically.. if we kept all cattle and sheep in individual pens exercising them for 1 hour a day to keep em fit.. sheep dogs will do that..
The rest of their time could be in the stall feeding/cudding whilst a hose is stuck up their butts.. all gases and waste's would be stored in tanks and gases drawn off for fuel.. and the solids used for manure...
Whoopee... 2 in one.. Climate change .. and Monsanto..

[Exile]

Originally Posted by boatman61

So technically.. if we kept all cattle and sheep in individual pens exercising them for 1 hour a day to keep em fit.. sheep dogs will do that..
The rest of their time could be in the stall feeding/cudding whilst a hose is stuck up their butts.. all gases and waste's would be stored in tanks and gases drawn off for fuel.. and the solids used for manure...
Whoopee... 2 in one.. Climate change .. and Monsanto..

In the midst of an episode of chaff on the other thread, there was a rather amusing discussion about this very thing, i.e. all that wasted potential energy! But then someone posted a link that said it was more belching than farting that was creating all the methane. I suspect your solution would simply be doubling up on the hoses then, right? Guess ya gotta find a work-around on the feeding & cuddling part, though.

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Exile

In the midst of an episode of chaff on the other thread, there was a rather amusing discussion about this very thing, i.e. all that wasted potential energy! But then someone posted a link that said it was more belching than farting that was creating all the methane. I suspect your solution would simply be doubling up on the hoses then, right? Guess ya gotta find a work-around on the feeding & cuddling part, though.

Beat me to it

[jackdale]

Here is someone's Arctic cruising strategy.

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ed-163297.html

It looks like a good year for a passage.

Arctic Sea Ice News and Analysis | Sea ice data updated daily with one-day lag

[GoingWalkabout]

News Flash. Latest oceanic research report shows ocean levels have fallen every year for the last 4 years. Sounds like we need a new thread to discuss the impact of falling ocean levels on navigation. :-)

[jackdale]

Originally Posted by GoingWalkabout

News Flash. Latest oceanic research report shows ocean levels have fallen every year for the last 4 years. Sounds like we need a new thread to discuss the impact of falling ocean levels on navigation. :-)

Interesting - have a link to the original source?

[GoingWalkabout]

Like a good Washington Post journalist I never disclose my sources. Sources in journalism are like good sources in cooking. The best ones you keep secret.

Well since you asked and your a good guy I'll share my source. http://www.examiner.com/article/nasa...sea-level-rise

This was from a report posted by AFP written based on a just released report by NASA.

Regards,
Chaya

[boatman61]

Buy one of these.. been using them for years.. Bludi Brilliant...

[jackdale]

Originally Posted by GoingWalkabout

Well since you asked and your a good guy I'll share my source. NASA discovers that climate change is slowing and not hastening sea level rise | Examiner.com

This was from a report posted by AFP written based on a just released report by NASA.

Regards,
Chaya

Um - nothing about falling sea levels over that past four years in your link or in the the original.

How much of an effect does terrestrial groundwater storage have on sea-level rise? Reager et al. used gravity measurements made between 2002 and 2014 by NASA's Gravity Recovery And Climate Experiment (GRACE) satellites to quantify variations in groundwater storage. Combining those data with estimates of mass loss by glaciers revealed groundwater's impact on sea-level change. Net groundwater storage has been increasing, and the greatest regional changes, both positive and negative, are associated with climate-driven variability in precipitation. Thus, groundwater storage has slowed the rate of recent sea-level rise by roughly 15%.

Abstract

Climate-driven changes in land water storage and their contributions to sea level rise have been absent from Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change sea level budgets owing to observational challenges. Recent advances in satellite measurement of time-variable gravity combined with reconciled global glacier loss estimates enable a disaggregation of continental land mass changes and a quantification of this term. We found that between 2002 and 2014, climate variability resulted in an additional 3200 ± 900 gigatons of water being stored on land. This gain partially offset water losses from ice sheets, glaciers, and groundwater pumping, slowing the rate of sea level rise by 0.71 ± 0.20 millimeters per year. These findings highlight the importance of climate-driven changes in hydrology when assigning attribution to decadal changes in sea level.

A slowing of the rate is not a falling sea level.

A decade of sea level rise slowed by climate-driven hydrology | Science

Sea level continues to rise.

A report on the study

http://phys.org/news/2016-02-parched-earth-sea.html