Towing a sailing boat with a sailing boat.

[Old Swampy]

I haven't towed while under sail, but I've been towed by a boat that was under power, but not in a big sea. Having a steersman on the towed vessel makes it whole lot easier. Consider the problem of having a side force on the towing boat when it wants to change direction (tack). In my experience the towed boat wants to follow the path of the towing boat closely. This suggests a short tow line, particularly if maneuvering is involved. Does the bridle go on the towed or towing boat? The towing boat needs maneuverability, so I don't think a bridle helps at that end. Presumably, a bridle on the towed boat keeps it in line.

[StuM]

Originally Posted by exMaggieDrum

We had a Whitby 42 with a Ford Lehman 80hp motor and it was agreed that we would pick up the tow
...
So I guess, in the right circumstances, you can tow another sailboat.

Interesting story, but you missed the key part of the original post:

"particularly with a sailing boat as the towing vessel, without using the engine of the towing boat."

If the towing boat is under power, that's a totally different matter - of course you can do it with with appropriate precautions and techniques for the conditions.

[wesevans]

I have done this. Towed a sail boat from east of the Azores to just off the port of Cadiz Spain. We were under sale most of the time with a favorable wind. When necessary we motor sailed. Cost us some time and fuel, but at sea you render aid when necessary.

[SkiprJohn]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

You ever towed anything with a motorcycle?
I bet it a lot like that, as long as the vessel under tow is directly behind you , all is good, but let the thing get off to one side and it starts steering you and pulling you sideways, it might get ugly.

I've done it under sail and it's not anything like towing with a motorcycle which I've also done.

If the towed vessel is unmanned you must lash what's left of tiller and rudder to midships and count on the vessel wandering a bit. It must be as dry as possible and no sails up. Having some crew is s big help and a towing bridle is absolutely necessary.

Get a friend out sailing sometime to try it out. Take turns. Figure out what works and doesn't.

Remember that every time there is no slack in the towing line the stern of your boat will point to your tow wherever that is in relation to the wind. You must keep a steady eye on the tow and make course corrections constantly.

In motorcycle towing its best to have a rider on the cycle being towed otherwise your fuel consumption will be quite high.

[GILow]

Originally Posted by grantmc

Matt raises an interesting question. As I read through the posts I recalled watching a video of a single hander on a passage from New Your City to Bermuda. He hears a pan pan of another sail boat, close by, having problems. So he stands off in case their situation worsens. Eventually, and reluctantly he takes her in tow for 150 miles.

GrantMC, thank you for the most interesting YouTube video I have yet seen. So much to take away, mainly watching the fatigue build was the most engrossing thing for me. The towing line certainly looked a little short to me, but not so much so that I was not very surprised that the boats managed to collide. I wish there was more explanation for the circumstances of the collision.

It certainly appeared that ChaCha was ill prepared for the journey, perhaps through financial constraint? The reality is that we cannot all afford to set to sea in a perfect boat but I was left with the strong feeling that they should not have been out there. I say that from the comfort of my arm chair with zero long distance cruising experience, but the early comments about the engine being likely to overheat rang alarm bells and overall I got the impression of a run down boat falling to pieces. Very little support for this assertion I know, but it is how it felt to me, and my apologies to the Cha Cha if I am wrong.

Full kudos to the skipper of Paragon who strikes me as a genuinely good soul trapped in a horrible dilemma. I hope I never find myself in his position, I should I do so, I hope I live up to his moral and ethical standards.

As a small aside, I could listen to the sound of that Ford Lehman on Paragon for hours. That is without a doubt the sexiest sounding boat engine I have ever heard. If I cannot make my Nissan sound like that I shall obtain a recording of one and rig the boat stereo to play it whenever I start the engine.

Matt

[secrabtree]

Originally Posted by zedpassway

Don't. Very dangerous for both boats.

If you've ever been rescued by the US Coast Guard(and I have), you sill know that they never tow anyone. Its even dangerous for their specially designed boats. They pull up along side, and raft you to thier boat, and then use their big 200 HP engines to move you as one.

If you could raise your board, take down your sails then it might be possible for another boat to tow you like a dinghy, but even that is dangerous. Dinghys can easily overturn in rough seas as most sailors know.

I have been rescued by the Coast Guard both on boats that I have been delivering and a couple times on my own boat. I have been told by the Coast Guard boat on a long line from their stern to my bowel on a side tie off their forward steering fluid starboard quarter and on a side tie off the stern starboard quarter. These have been boats that I have been delivering and as you can expect boats that you're delivering may surprise you by not working at times. I have never evacuated by boat when being told by the Coast Guard I have always been aboard and always been requested by the Coast Guard to be able to maneuver the runner as they direct. Situations are different and the requirements to meet those situations are different I know that and the Coast Guard knows that.

[secrabtree]

One of the thing I have never been requested by the Coast Guard to disembark from my boat have always been required or requested by the Coast Guard to be able to maneuver my helm as they have suggested.

[secrabtree]

The first couple years that I have this boat I used to enjoy sailing out and on the opening day fishing season hand pulling in power fishing boats that have run out of gas or have a dead battery under sail. I would drop the sail and motor in the last little bit into the marina but it was fun picking up a power boat under sail that was that was enjoyable.

[Oceanride007]

Hi Matt, I helped crew a towed vessel between Penang and Langkawi, towed vessel was 65' Aluminium Helsal, (4 I think) with a failed propeller. Towing vessel a 40' Steel yacht. by motor, nothing special with bridles or tying to mast, but they did have time to prepare ie plenty of candilabra length of cable. Calm seas. No real problems.

I once read a story of a ship pulled off a reef by another ship that actually ranged its anchor chain from the anchor still in the hauser the chain along the deck and enough room to get a bit of run up. (back in the 1950's in New Guinea ie remote) it worked.

[GILow]

The more I read about this, and the more I think about it, the more I reckon it is something worth trying in suitable conditions. Heaven forbid that it should ever be necessary, but it would be good to have resolved the issues involved beforehand. I shall ask around a couple of mates and see if anyone is game to try it this summer. Obviously the trick will be to manage the risks by having a VERY long tow line, and perhaps leaving both boat engines running in neutral so that a potential collision is more easily avoided. Ann, I acknowledge your point about only in Dire Straights, so I shall put Love Over Gold on the stereo during the tests. :^)

Boatman61 makes a good parallel of treating the towed boat much like a drogue. I reckon that might be the secret to getting this to work well.


Matt


P.S. My wife, who is a nurse, watched the video posted by GrantMC and made a typically nurse-like observation that the sailor in question was dehydrated by the second day of his journey. I won't gross you out by the reasoning but these sorts of observations are priceless and worth considering as sailors. We don't function well when sleep deprived, and even worse when dehydrated. I don't for a second think his dehydration was due to a lack of available water, probably just forgetting to drink with everything else he was going through.

[EX Wanabe]

I towed a Tayana 37 over 180 nautical miles with my Islander 44 in the Sea of Cortez. I used 200' of double braid 1" nylon line. The sea conditions were from dead calm to 18 kt's. The tow was mostly under sail with the full main and a 130 Genoa out on the Islander and only the jib out on the Tayana. We were both cutters, but found this the easiest and most proficient combination. In my opinion it is important to use only nylon line for towing, due to the stretch to act as a shock absorber.

[exMaggieDrum]

Originally Posted by hamburking

I really enjoyed the story above. But I can't help but wonder why you didn't simply give him a few gallons of diesel in a fuel (or other) container?

That's a very good question. I didn't have any diesel in a separate container at the time and neither did the other boat. And I honestly can't remember why we didn't pursue that more. He really should have just asked for a rescue boat but that would have been some very expensive fuel and he would have had to stay anchored all night where he was at. And he was under tow by the time I got in the vicinity and all I did was take over the tow. I always carry extra fuel now.

I do have a story of getting 30 gal of diesel transferred over to a boat I was crewing on off the Oregon coast. Jugs tossed over the side, picked up and diesel poured in. Not recommended either. We were lucky it was good weather. I always ask skippers how much fuel they have (for sure) before going out on their boats.

[Cadence]

Steering the towed boat can be a detriment. It may cause the towing vessel to yaw. Lash the tiller amidships or just leave it alone.