Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by malbert73

Here’s their boat based on google but looks like pic on go fund me
Attachment 163962

Well, it matters little, but I based my assumption on the fact that the boat in the photo appears pulled up onto a beach, which you could do with the 31 but not the 28. The cabins are very similar.

[JPA Cate]

I agree with dewedeking that crowdfunding is an interesting phenomenon of modern society.

I am one of those folks who lived frugally and saved, and eventually went cruising, where our ability to be independent really mattered. I can REALLY understand where Mikado is coming from, as he sees freedom becoming clearer in his sights.

And so, I am watching what is happening with Lagniappe's young couple. Here, they had no "disaster fund." Given that this is the 21st century, and not the days of debtor's prisons, turning to crowd funding makes sense to me, and can be seen as perhaps the only responsible way for them to handle the necessary cleanup after the fact of the abandonment of the vessel.

Did they make mistakes? sure. So what? Who among us has not? So what I would ask those of us who think we should be insured, is this: supposing one is not insured; supposing one has no convertible nor fiduciary assets-- how else should they accept their cleanup responsibilities?

Ann

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by Don C L

Well, it matters little, but I based my assumption on the fact that the boat in the photo appears pulled up onto a beach, which you could do with the 31 but not the 28. The cabins are very similar.

the boat on the beach is their boat. Look at the pulpit and danforth anchor hangers. Now look at the pulpit and anchor nest in the background of the picture of them and their dog on the go fund me page same boat.
( remember I'm a highly trained observer )

[Don C L]

Huh. So it does seem to be the 28. And I guess they have (had) been in the habit of (somehow) getting it beached. BTW, I looked at the comments folks have left at the gofundme page.... pretty rough, some are

[surf_sail]

Originally Posted by JPA Cate

Given that this is the 21st century, and not the days of debtor's prisons, turning to crowd funding makes sense to me, and can be seen as perhaps the only responsible way for them to handle the necessary cleanup after the fact of the abandonment of the vessel.





Ann

I also have a lot of sympathy for this couple. They went against the grain and took risks to live their dreams. If Lady Luck had treated them better they would be praised for having "the guts to live their dream". A lot of their mistakes could easily have happened to anyone (e.g. poorly placed markers). Although I would never attempt what they did without liability insurance, I can't blame them for this either because: 1) if you had everything people say you "need" to go cruising one would never leave dock, and 2) I've never considered liability insurance for my hobiecat nor my 23ft San Juan - so admittedly there is a judgement call in when it's truly required. For those that say they should have had a pre-purchase survey - if I understand correctly they paid $5,000 for their boat, a pre-purchase survey would have been ridiculous...

BUT:

The thought of the gofundme does seem like an unreasonable request. It seems similar to a phenomenon a sales lady in Alta recently pointed out to me: western kids sitting around Khaosan Road in Bangkok with a sign begging for money to fund their backpacking world travel. The thought of asking for money when you're clearly much more privileged than so many around you seems unconscionable to me. Same is true for this able-bodied young couple. Saying that the go-fund me is the only thing they can do to clean up their misfortune is silly (especially since we don't have debtors prisons). Here are a few other options: 1. Credit cards, 2. Peer-to-peer lending (e.g. Lending club) 3. Ask friends/family to front the money and pay them back (soon).

HOWEVER, i can't fully blame them for the gofundme either since it seems to be the trend of our times and I'm sure a lot of people have suggested to them they should do so. Also a lot of people have already parted with hard earned cash to help them - so I'll admit maybe my view is wrong here.

Nevertheless, I think with some introspection they would also reach the conclusion that the gofundme isn't the right thing to do since there are many people/causes that are more deserving of a donation.

I really think gofundme should offer a way to crowdfund a no/low interest loan. That would seem like a better option for helping this couple and many other causes on the site.

[boatman61]

And folks dont donate to Oxfam and other charities so their officials can abuse minors.. but they do.. And it happens.
Seem to remember another Go Fund Me that only raised £5..
Ranting for or against and frothing at the mouth on CF does not affect the outcome..

[Sailorbob8599]

Originally Posted by frozenhawaiian

totally different thing, RNLI provides a valuable service to the community and thus there's a very good reason to donate to them. 2 clueless novices who didn't bother to get any sort of instruction and managed to sink their boat provide zero service to the community

Did it occur to you the "2 clueless novices" ARE a part of the community?

[Steadman Uhlich]

Amazing!

As of 0100 on Feb 12th...

In just 3 days they raised $10,500 from donations by 234 people.

[double u]

it is not the risk-taking I object to. it is the preparation (or the lack of it) that I find idiotic. with 26/24 not having saved more than $10.090 smacks of "instant gratification"-urge.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by double u

it is not the risk-taking I object to. it is the preparation (or the lack of it) that I find idiotic. with 26/24 not having saved more than $10.090 smacks of "instant gratification"-urge.

Been doing that all my life.. so do Macdonald customers.

[surf_sail]

Originally Posted by double u

it is not the risk-taking I object to. it is the preparation (or the lack of it) that I find idiotic. with 26/24 not having saved more than $10.090 smacks of "instant gratification"-urge.

Fair point, but who knows how much they saved. They bought a boat for $5k and spent $??? on refitting and living expenses in the marina. Maybe they went over budget on the refit and were moving the boat to Key West to earn more money there. We don't know the full story to pass judgment.

[Sailorbob8599]

Originally Posted by Robert Tilbury

I 100% agree ,
I work hard , i have insurance andto get insurance i have a survey ,,
If i stuff up i dont ask i dont beg ,, i sort it out my self ,

I would never Unless the world was ending run my car truck bike or boats with no insurance ,,,NEVER .

they may be youn they may have been foolish we all have been ,,,
But not to have back up is insanity ,,,,not foolish

I see little difference between these two people & other couples ... both young & old, who lose everything in an apartment fire, & hear few if any residents had fire insurance. ... such news report is frequently followed by a statement that a fund has been set up to assist these people at a local bank where we can make personal donations to help ... Does this not happen where you live?
You're going to say: "but these two are the cause of their own problem, while those burned out of the apartment building are the result of someone else's actions." ... does that mean we should stipulate that no part of our donation should go to help the one that caused the fire?

[double u]

somewhere it said "...boat..for..$5000,-...refit another $5000.-, 90 bucks left..."-so what do I have to conclude?
seeing that they started from a considerably more favorable position than we did in the 70ies at abt the same age we did they went at the realisation of the dream (abt the same we had then...) in a much more idiotic way than we did (& everybody then thought we were idiots...).
their "gofundme" thing convinces me now that my first assessment was rigth!

[Sailorbob8599]

Originally Posted by surf_sail

Nevertheless, I think with some introspection they would also reach the conclusion that the gofundme isn't the right thing to do since there are many people/causes that are more deserving of a donation.

There's an old adage that says: "If you don't ask, you don't get." ... Remember, they are only asking, & no-one is forced to donate. Hang onto your money all you stingy old codgers, you just may need it to cross the Styx.

[boatman61]

Wonder how many of those bitchin sponsor folks on Youtube doing boring sailing videos whose idea of excitement is talking about pirates and hidey holes when fishing boats come close and drooling over the 'hot babe'..
Seems to me you've had a good $50 worth of 'bitchin value' on 15 pages of this thread..