Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by newhaul

actually no Robyn didn't he was paid by national geographic for part of the trip after the story of what he was doing was reported in his local newspaper.
It wasn't a fire that caused the change from the dove to dove two. It was due to storm damages.
If you want to get the story direct give him or a call. They live near Missoula Montana.

Actually no need to call him, there are two books about it and three National Geographic's with articles on his RTW voyage which took 5 years. Plus a movie.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XpU_7JHV-1g

It's also correct that he was on a shoestring budget and the 2nd boat did come from money made with National Geographic.

Little Dove (a Lapworth 24) had been patched up so many times that he didn't want to chance sailing on it anymore so he bought Big Dove (a Luders 33) in Florida I believe

[TreblePlink]

Looking at the after impact photo on their gofundme page, they were flooding, but upright.

Could this have been a simple holing and flooding? Perhaps the hole was not accessible?

[surf_sail]

Originally Posted by mikedefieslife

You've heard the phrase "This is Africa", well "this is Cruisersforum" it's full of these type of views. In fact many in the sailing community can often be like this too.



Just the other day, I went over to German Prout owner to ask about the lifting points of that model boat. I'd obviously interrupted his xHamster session, as he stood up huffing and puffing, and snapped "No" I don't know.



What a ****ing liar, I saw him with his boat on the hard just a couple of months earlier.



Another German I helped tie off his lines as he docked for fuel. The staff were no where to be found. Another boat came, and ask if he would move further down the pier a little, and I'd again tie off his lines. He refused, leaving the other boat to just drift about while he waited for the fuel staff.

Well sounds like Germans.

(Having a German passport may or may not make it bit better to say that)

[earlgray]

$5000 for boat and $5000 to fix it and with $90 to their name.
They sold everything they had, all their possession and barely could "gather" $ 10,000.
My house in Dubrovnik is worth $800,000. I have £70,000 savings on my bank account.

I thought that you American are all rich, at least according Hollywood movies and series.

And most interesting that I found in this story, if they did not had that "accident", one day they may come down to Croatia and look at me like I am some kind of "banana man". Something like, I should be happy they spend few dollars and local peasant will not starve.

Gods know how many of you, same like them, are cruising up and down the Adriatic every year.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by earlgray

$5000 for boat and $5000 to fix it.
They sold everything they had, all their possession and barely could "gather" $ 10,000.
My house in Dubrovnik is worth $800,000. I have £70,000 savings on my bank account.

I thought that you American are all rich, at least according Hollywood movies and series.

Looks like the wanted more out of life than a nice house and money in the bank.......

[Maka]

Why are we sure they do not have insurance ?

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by earlgray

$5000 for boat and $5000 to fix it.
They sold everything they had, all their possession and barely could "gather" $ 10,000.
My house in Dubrovnik is worth $800,000. I have £70,000 savings on my bank account.

I thought that you American are all rich, at least according Hollywood movies and series.

And most interesting that I found in this story, if they did not had that "accident", one day they may come down to Croatia and look at me like I am some kind of "banana man". Something like, I should be happy they spend few dollars and local peasant will not starve.

Gods know how many of you, same like them, are cruising up and down the Adriatic every year.

Yus.. us po' white trash git everwhur.. even inta CF..

[donradcliffe]

Originally Posted by hellosailor

Or for that matter, who the heck calls Seatow to say "We lost our keel in a channel entrance, we are in danger of capsize and obstructing the channel" duh? That sure sounds like a reason to call the USCG for an emergency response and notification to all mariners that the channel is obstructed in the fog.

I'm pretty sure that Seatow was in touch with the USCG, probably even before arriving on scene, and definitely after that. If Seatow had known the kids had a 50 year old boat with $70 in their pockets, Seatow would have likely turned the rescue over to the coasties.

[surf_sail]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Someone said he/they are CF members so maybe.. if we are lucky.. we will hear it from the horses mouth so to speak.

Yes if the couple is reading this I second the desire to hear the real story.

There is a lot of vitriol on this forum, but I'm sure many of us would really appreciate learning from your misfortune and would respect your bravery in sharing a first hand account.

Truth is that it could happen to ALL of us...

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by TreblePlink

Looking at the after impact photo on their gofundme page, they were flooding, but upright.

Could this have been a simple holing and flooding? Perhaps the hole was not accessible?

Could be, like some remnant of some kind of steel framework jutting up from the sand in shallow water, but still submerged. Hopefully we'll get some more info or photos of the recovered boat, but that model of Columbia has a fairly deep stub (even minus the ballasted keel,) so if that were stuck in a shallow bottom (like 2') the boat could be flopping around fairly upright with whatever weight there is below the waterline still pulling it upright.

[Captain Bill]

There has been lots of speculation about insurance or lack thereof. Lets look at the situation as presented.

1. No survey (not a known fact, but speculation)

2. 1969 boat

3. Crew with no boating experience.

4. No apparent training, not even a basic safety course.

5. No assets, so they could not piggyback on a home owners policy.

6. Headed for the Caribbean.

My bet is that no company would have sold them a policy. If they could have found one it would have cost much more than the $90 they had left in their pockets. They gambled and lost. I wish them luck picking up the pieces and trying again someday.

Just to add a little to the multihull vs monohull debate, there has been a lot of trepidation raised by the monohull zealots about the fact that a multihull will not come back up if turned over. I would note that there seems to have been a rash of fin keeled monohulls that have lost their keels and turned turtle and stayed that way.

[TreblePlink]

As close inshore as the wreck is, and as densely populated as the area is, seems like some locals would have snorkeled it by now to see what happened.

[surf_sail]

Originally Posted by Dymaxion

Obviously you can't visually inspect the keel boats with keel in place, but you can torque them to spec and see what happens. Undoing a nut, cleaning all the threads so you know it isn't seized then retorquing it to spec would sort out which bolts were paper thin fairly quickly since they'd either keep stretching and/or snap. If you get all nuts torqued to spec then you're back at the original clamping pressure at least. Not that that is a guarantee that a severe impact won't snap marginal bolts, since the factor of safety would be reduced.

Thanks Dymaxion. Is this regular practice, how often should this be done? Every 10yrs? I suppose it would work for both bolt-type and stud-type keels.

Are there manufacturer recommendations for keel boat maintenance?

I think some high quality builders also use studs for their keels (e.g. Tartan 3700 I believe). Is it even possible to replace them, or is a brand new keel required?

Thanks

[ferrailleur]

Originally Posted by mikedefieslife

Or read one too many of the sailing books that often get mentioned on these forums.

Pls don't underestimate the newbies who read a lot. Rich Wilson's "Race France to France" (Vendee Globe/solo/non-stop around the World 2008-2009).... fantastic book even for a newbie.... How many sailors on this site know how a keel cant work? I now know thanks to that book.

[robert sailor]

Keel bolts are not all the same, as you say some are studs, some are stainless, some are common steel. Some are poured in place as in lead keels and you'd need to drop the keel to inspect them. Studs screwed into the keel can be removed either in the water or on the hard for inspection. If you do it in the water it's one at a time. Common steel will not have crevice corrosion where stainless can. Common steel can corrode but it's clearly viable, stainless not so much. If you have common steel studs then it's fairly easy to pull and replace them one at a time and you won't break the seal.