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Old 06-02-2020, 11:02   #1
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Formerly BVI Reg & MMSI } Now USA & MMSI?

So the boat we just bought was registered in the BVI with a BVI MMSI in the AIS, RADIO and EPIRB.


She's now legally registered in Maryland, and we just received the Coast Guard formal documentation number (awaiting the package; they're backed waaaay up!).


We're not supposed to be using the BVI MMSI, but neither Raymarine, nor BoatUS seem to know how we should proceed, and the PO has moved overseas. Does anybody know how to proceed? We apparently aren't allowed to change the MMSI, but the dealer says he doesn't know what to do about the BVI #.


Has anybody overcome this?!


Thanks,
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Old 06-02-2020, 11:35   #2
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Re: Formerly BVI Reg & MMSI } Now USA & MMSI?

Just get a Ship's Radio Station with the FCC. I can't remember the sign up process but you might need your USCG doc number.

https://www.fcc.gov/ship-radio-stations

That Ship's Radio Station will give you an MMSI. It costs some money, but it's either for life or something like 10 years. So don't sweat it much. You will then need to change all your DSC capable radios to the new MMSI (VHF and HF if you have with DSC, hence Icom 802), including the AIS if you have an AIS that transmits.

You will also need to get an FCC Restricted Operator License. Again, something you just pay for. And you get it print it and archive it in case someone asks.

All these processes on the FCC website are a bit cumbersome. Because the FCC website still works as if ham radio where a thing and being complicated and obfuscated is a necessary evil to get to what you want. But you will figure it out, I guess.You can do everything online and get your MMSI online.

Cheers!
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Old 06-02-2020, 11:49   #3
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Re: Formerly BVI Reg & MMSI } Now USA & MMSI?

Depending on the makes of the various DSC pieces of kit you may need to return them to the dealer(s).


The regulations require "dealer" intervention to change the MMSI



Some AIS units can have their MMSI changed more than once others cannot.


Recent Standard Horizon equipment can have the MMSI number changed by simply obtaining a code from them.
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Old 06-02-2020, 11:50   #4
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Re: Formerly BVI Reg & MMSI } Now USA & MMSI?

Thanks for that. We don't have an SSB but we will ultimately travel outside the US so I downloaded the form for the Ship's License.


We just weren't sure what to do about the BVI MMSI, but it appears as thought we'll have to send the DSC VHF out to be reprogrammed, as well as the AIS :-(



When I'm at the boat next week I'll get the EPIRB info and have that registered as well.


Thanks for the recommendation!
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Old 06-02-2020, 11:53   #5
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Re: Formerly BVI Reg & MMSI } Now USA & MMSI?

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Originally Posted by Tupaia View Post
Depending on the makes of the various DCS pieces of kit you may need to return them to the dealer(s).


The regulations require "dealer" intervention to change the MMSI



Some AIS units can have their MMSI changed more than once others cannot.


Recent Standard Horizon equipment can have the MMSI number changed by simply obtaining a code from them.

Everything is Raymarine so it's not looking good for doing it myself! :-)
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Old 07-02-2020, 08:38   #6
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Re: Formerly BVI Reg & MMSI } Now USA & MMSI?

You could try this, I mentioned this to a friend in passing and he said that he had seen this.


YWB - forum



I am looking to do the same as I bought a boat with a Ray240e VHF which is programmed with the previous owner's MMSI

I did stumble across this , which may work and I will be trying on the Ray240e as well

"Here is the secret code to erase the MMSI # in your Raymarine VHF radio. It was sent to me when I sold my old boat with a Ray230 in it and even though it was originally for a Ray220, it worked to erase mine. It may work on your Ray215 also. OOPS!, guess it's not so secret anymore.
This secret code is for the Raytheon / Raymarine RAY 220 VHF. It may work on other Raytheon/Raymarine radios also.

Here you go:

With the Power OFF, Press and HOLD the FUNC, 16/9 and DSC keys while you power ON. Do not release the keys until you hear the audio BEEP which means your done. Then reprogam your NMSI number as per the manual. "

http://my.boatus.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=59294

and this is what I found on the software and NMEA commands

http://www.raymarine.com/submittedfiles/tech_update/ais/tu388 ais500.pdf

see page 3 , may work on the VHF as well as on the AIS ?
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Old 07-02-2020, 10:17   #7
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Re: Formerly BVI Reg & MMSI } Now USA & MMSI?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LeeV View Post
Thanks for that. We don't have an SSB but we will ultimately travel outside the US so I downloaded the form for the Ship's License.


We just weren't sure what to do about the BVI MMSI, but it appears as thought we'll have to send the DSC VHF out to be reprogrammed, as well as the AIS :-(



When I'm at the boat next week I'll get the EPIRB info and have that registered as well.


Thanks for the recommendation!
If you are going to operate any radio, VHF, AIS, SSB outside of the US and in the waters of another nation, a ship's station license is required as well as a restricted radio operator's license.

And the FCC website is a bit arcane, eventually you will end up a the Pay.gov site where you can pay the fees.
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Old 07-02-2020, 10:34   #8
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Re: Formerly BVI Reg & MMSI } Now USA & MMSI?

I"m on the FCC site now! Thanks to all who responded. I'm hoping I can help others who might have the same dilemma with the info below:


RESOLUTIONS;


The vessel was BVI flagged and is now US flagged.


The existing Station License and Call Sign are no longer valid. The same is true of the BVI-assigned MMSI number.


None of them can be used legally by a US flagged vessel. They do not need to be cancelled; just don’t use them.


If you still require a Station License and Call Sign, contact FCC for assistance. 1-877-480-3201. They will also issue an appropriate US MMSI number.


If a License is not required, you can obtain a domestic-only US MMSI at https://www.boatus.com/MMSI/MMSI/ObtainMMSI#!


In either case, the MMSI in the radio will have to be reset, which almost certainly means sending the unit back to the manufacturer.


U.S. East Coast:

Send AIS and VHF to:



Raymarine

9 Townsend West

Nashua

New Hampshire 03063



Include new MMSI from FCC/Ship's License , Vessel Name and CG Doc number



EPIRB units on US flagged vessels do not use MMSI numbers. They come from the manufacturer with unique pre-assigned 15 character alpha-numeric ID Codes. European units use MMSI numbers, but US EPIRBs do not.


US flagged vessels’ EPIRBs must be registered with NOAA (Suitland, MD 888-212-7283) and should include a reference to the vessel’s MMSI.


Satisfy all the US requirements and keep good written records; you’ll need them later.



Best regards,
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Old 08-02-2020, 15:20   #9
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Re: Formerly BVI Reg & MMSI } Now USA & MMSI?

Just one point. You cannot have a state-registered boat that is also USCG documented (US Flagged). A state registration will invalidate your USCG documentation. The USCG will not know if you have also state registered the boat, They will keep sending you renewal notices and collecting the fees. If anything untoward happens, accident, law suit, etc. you may find out that the USCG documentation is, and has been, invalid the whole time. USCG documented vessels based in personal property tax states usually must "register" with state DMV or tax agency and place a stick on the boat notifying their sneaky revenue agents who search marinas and anchorages that you have complied. This is not the same as being a "state registered" boat. In fact USCG regulations prohibit the placing of state registration letters and numbers on a documented vessel.
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Old 08-02-2020, 15:31   #10
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Re: Formerly BVI Reg & MMSI } Now USA & MMSI?

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Originally Posted by jmschmidt View Post
Just one point. You cannot have a state-registered boat that is also USCG documented (US Flagged). A state registration will invalidate your USCG documentation. The USCG will not know if you have also state registered the boat, They will keep sending you renewal notices and collecting the fees. If anything untoward happens, accident, law suit, etc. you may find out that the USCG documentation is, and has been, invalid the whole time. USCG documented vessels based in personal property tax states usually must "register" with state DMV or tax agency and place a stick on the boat notifying their sneaky revenue agents who search marinas and anchorages that you have complied. This is not the same as being a "state registered" boat. In fact USCG regulations prohibit the placing of state registration letters and numbers on a documented vessel.
This is mostly correct, but a little confusing. For most states, the state in which the boat is kept will require the boat to be registered in that state. Just like a motor vehicle. The state will want to make certain that sales tax was paid in some state and they will require registration fees to be paid annually or on some other basis. (In NY it is every 3 years.) Some states treat boats, motor vehicles, and real property as property and tax them annually based on their value.

My NY registration card uses my USCG Documentation Number as the state registration number. Not sure what other states do. There is no state title because the boat has always been documented.

If the boat has always been documented there may not be a state issued title.

It is correct that documented boats may not display state registration numbers. And states may require the boat to display state registration sticker.
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Old 08-02-2020, 15:34   #11
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Re: Formerly BVI Reg & MMSI } Now USA & MMSI?

Also, if the boat is foreign built and has not been formerly imported (not just cleared in) into the United States it will be subject to duty at 1.5% of value. It is a very expensive process. In addition to the duty I am faced with about $1,000 in other fees and charges. It is a very complex process, the EPA form for the engine (s) alone is several detailed pages and, of course, they get a fee too. Heaven help you if the engine has been changed and/or the original engine did not comply with EPA regs. There are fees for the port-of-entry, the survey of value, the customs broker and a few other hangers on with their grubby mitts out. In theory you can DIY but good freaking luck. Just hire a customs broker and pay the deep-state swamp, dwelling bureaucrats.
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Old 08-02-2020, 15:59   #12
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Re: Formerly BVI Reg & MMSI } Now USA & MMSI?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmschmidt View Post
Just one point. You cannot have a state-registered boat that is also USCG documented (US Flagged). A state registration will invalidate your USCG documentation. The USCG will not know if you have also state registered the boat, They will keep sending you renewal notices and collecting the fees. If anything untoward happens, accident, law suit, etc. you may find out that the USCG documentation is, and has been, invalid the whole time. USCG documented vessels based in personal property tax states usually must "register" with state DMV or tax agency and place a stick on the boat notifying their sneaky revenue agents who search marinas and anchorages that you have complied. This is not the same as being a "state registered" boat. In fact USCG regulations prohibit the placing of state registration letters and numbers on a documented vessel.
This is NOT correct, at least in the U.S., in the states I’ve lived and owned 6 federally documented, state registered vessels. I just had renewed lengthy discussions with the C.G. and MAryland DNR, hoping something had changed. Nothing. You must register and show the sticker BUT NOT THE MD NUMBERS. The Md sticker will say “Documented Vessel.”

This from my current state, where you must pay tax and must register the vessel: “Note: US Coast Guard documented vessels using Maryland waters are NOT exempt from the vessel excise tax. When used principally in Maryland, documented vessels must display a documented use decal.

If your vessel was purchased in Maryland and will use Maryland waters a majority of the calendar year, you are liable for vessel excise tax and must register the vessel within 30 days of purchase to avoid assessment of penalty and interest.

If your vessel was purchased elsewhere or previously registered in another jurisdiction, is now in Maryland waters, and will use Maryland waters more than any other single jurisdiction during the calendar year, you are liable for vessel excise tax and must register the vessel within 30 days of entering Maryland waters.

If your vessel is duly registered in another jurisdiction but remains in Maryland waters more than 90 days in a calendar year, you may be liable for vessel excise tax unless you can prove principal use in another jurisdiction.

Re: https://dnr.maryland.gov/boating/Pag...istration.aspx
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