Removing failed Copper Coat

[Sawbonz]

Originally Posted by DefinitelyMe

It sounds to me like the yard has a good solution, but if you're still looking for input:

I used to operate a wet sand blasting machine (called the Farrow System). We had three different grades of sand and could vary pressure, sand:water ratio and volume. We could blast thick rust from girders, prep a steel bridge for painting, remove road paint without marking the asphalt beneath or remove the paint from a soda can without damaging the metal beneath, or clean the gunk out of teak furniture without damaging the wood itself. It was an extremely versatile system and, in the right hands, perfect for what you are trying to do.

Input is great, thanks! Consensus in the face of a lack of facts is as helpful as it gets.

[ShoreFun]

I have done an extensive amount of sandblasting. Several antique cars.

Done with improper knowledge and you can ruin things real fast. With the correct pressure to amount of sand in the stream you can do a lot. But it would likely be a slow process to properly do fiberglass. Same would apply to water blasting.

In a nutshell, the abrasives act like little hammers. A few hammers moving fast can do as much damage as a lot of hammers moving slow. Those real cheap blasters that you buy are the worst as they put a lot of sand in the stream.

Anyway, stuff to consider.

[David B]

Originally Posted by Sawbonz

We got a bad application of Copper Coat in the Caribbean. Starting immediately we had more barnacles than we could count and subsequent "burnishing" by two power sanders over two days did lots of damage including multiple spots down to the barrier coat and one to gel coat. A few months after that we lost our first piece of about a square foot, followed by more over the next year and a half. With so, so many problems it has become clear that the only solution will be to remove the Copper Coat entirely. This post is not about the product or the applicator, though another in the future may be, it is about the removal of the failed paint.


Remedy is in a yard in Mexico. One day after we arrived there my wife had a medical emergency requiring evacuation and it will likely be months until we can return. During that time the boat can be repainted after stripping. The yard typically uses sand but says that they can try a planer or import walnut shells if requested to do the job. Our Leopard representative doesn't like the idea of sand blasting on a fiberglass boat. I would like to solicit the opinions of those here who may have had to remove paint using the different methods and can point me in the direction of best results more than cheapest cost.

Sorry to hear you got a bad job. Our Coppercoat is performing very well (nine years since now), but every now and again a bit flakes off here and there to reveal (you guessed it - bright, shiny gelcoat !). That's the trouble when you are not around to keep an eye on people who supposedly know what sandpaper is, and how to use it.

Sounds like you have a preparation issue (falling off), and an application issue (not performing).
Is it falling off everywhere, or just in spots?
Being two-pack epoxy, if the entire hull was not prepared properly, you really have no choice but to remove with abrasive paper using an orbital sander or slow-speed rotary polisher etc, have the hull abraded correctly this time, and then re-apply.

[Lemsteraak]

I've been doing a little research on bottom paints and am looking for a non hazardous, super slick option. The state of the art research seems to be for oil pipelines and such. The barrier coats we use seem to have come from them.

Ceram-Kote make a barrier coat, their #426 that is used as the primer for Copper Coat here in the US - https://ceram-kote.com/products/

These appears to be quite sophisticated coatings, you may need to remove or add an adhesion aid.

[Sawbonz]

Originally Posted by David B

Sorry to hear you got a bad job. Our Coppercoat is performing very well (nine years since now), but every now and again a bit flakes off here and there to reveal (you guessed it - bright, shiny gelcoat !). That's the trouble when you are not around to keep an eye on people who supposedly know what sandpaper is, and how to use it.

Sounds like you have a preparation issue (falling off), and an application issue (not performing).
Is it falling off everywhere, or just in spots?
Being two-pack epoxy, if the entire hull was not prepared properly, you really have no choice but to remove with abrasive paper using an orbital sander or slow-speed rotary polisher etc, have the hull abraded correctly this time, and then re-apply.

David,

It's coming off in several spots, perhaps 4 or 5, each about a square foot. They have been happening one at a time for a year now and I'll never be sure if they have stopped occurring.

The other concern is that even if these spots could simply be patched they sanded so much that the thickness of what remains is questionable.

[dcruz99801]

You say the boat is in Mexico, but not where. If you are in the Sea of Cortez AND you want to give Copper Coat a second chance, contact them to see what they might do about partial compensation/warranty work; the more bad stories people hear about the product, the more sales drop. I was considering it, now on the fence.



I mention it because if you want to try again, consider moving it (having it moved) to Puerto Penasco where Salvador Cabrales has a Copper Coat franchise and is getting good reviews for a very business-like boat yard.


If, OTOH, you want to return to standard bottom paint, I second the folks who say sand it. It's labor-intensive, but labor is cheap and capable here; still a good idea to be there or have a trusted friend watching the job. I strongly suggest hard paint, Trinidad (SR if you can get it); there is debate about which of the Comex, Hempel and International (Interlux) common in Mexico is better.

[Sawbonz]

Originally Posted by dcruz99801

You say the boat is in Mexico, but not where. If you are in the Sea of Cortez AND you want to give Copper Coat a second chance, contact them to see what they might do about partial compensation/warranty work; the more bad stories people hear about the product, the more sales drop. I was considering it, now on the fence.



I mention it because if you want to try again, consider moving it (having it moved) to Puerto Penasco where Salvador Cabrales has a Copper Coat franchise and is getting good reviews for a very business-like boat yard.


If, OTOH, you want to return to standard bottom paint, I second the folks who say sand it. It's labor-intensive, but labor is cheap and capable here; still a good idea to be there or have a trusted friend watching the job. I strongly suggest hard paint, Trinidad (SR if you can get it); there is debate about which of the Comex, Hempel and International (Interlux) common in Mexico is better.

I was purposely trying to be vague so as to not be seen as bad-mouthing anyone, but since you've outted me, Salvador is on the case. Lol

Copper Coat USA has actually just hired a surveyor to investigate, albeit after the boat has on the hard for 6 weeks already. The process and how I've been treated have pretty much turned me off though.

I expect that the yard in Grenada, still unnamed, is the root of the problem. I now know that it should be applied in dry circumstances and they didn't. Matter of fact, they did it in August which is very rainy and didn't do much as drop tarps. I'm not surprised given the many other issues that we had with them, but I'm still trying to keep their name out of it while we work through this.

[Bill_Giles]

Our local yard uses glass beads in the blaster instead of sand to remove old anti fouling these are easier on the gel coat and very cheap plus they are not toxic.

But have you thought of contacting Coppercoat, in the uk they are very helpful and have lots of experience.

It does sound like the application was light on copper to get barnacles. However during a period when our boat did not move we had quite a few but we think that when the boat does not move the copper is consumed leaving just the epoxy which would normally erode on water movement. Although the barnacles did fall of with gentle scraping.

[Divevac]

if copper coat is alcohol based like vc17, a bottom paint rep advised that rubbing alcohol will easily dissolve & remove it... worth looking into...

[fstbttms]

Originally Posted by Divevac

if copper coat is alcohol based like vc17, a bottom paint rep advised that rubbing alcohol will easily dissolve & remove it... worth looking into...

Coppercoat is not a paint. It is a copper-loaded epoxy and therefore not alcohol based.

[TabbyCat]

Originally Posted by Sawbonz

I would like to solicit the opinions of those here who may have had to remove paint using the different methods and can point me in the direction of best results more than cheapest cost.

Years ago I used a product called "Peel Away" to completely strip the bottom of my C&C down to gelcoat in Maryland. I'm not sure if it is still available, but it was relatively cheap, super fast (took just a few days with the two of us), and easy. You soak strips of newspaper in the gel-like chemical, slap it on, wait a few minutes, and then peel it off. Then rinse with fresh water. If you leave it on too long, it can remove too much, but with a little practice it is way less damaging than a bad scuff mark from a sander. So do a test spot and time it before you go putting it all over the bottom. You can do the whole boat, or just sections at a time. Once the hull had completely dried out, I rolled on a layer of West System. I also did the same with a similar stripping product in Panama on my MaineCat. I'm not sure of the name, but I do remember it had two skull & crossbones on the can, so be sure to wear a protective bunny suit, mask & eye protection and gloves! And find a safe place to dispose of the soggy newspaper strips. You could lay a tarp under the boat, or and drop them as you pull them off into a disposable bucket. Washing with water immediately neutralized & stopped the reaction, so a sunny rain free day is required.