Do I Really Need an Epoxy Barrier Coat ?! Help Needed ASAP !

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by windtraveler

Alright, so let's say we decided NOT to do the InterProtect as a barrier coat. Should we still apply 1 coat as a primer coat? Or should we use a different primer?[

I'd buy the Antifoul you want. and then look on the tin to see what primer is suggested. Probably there own

BTW - It's been out of the water since October - and it's been inside for about a month and a half so the hull should be dry enough.

Depending on your future plans I would consider getting her moisture tested- should get some nice results And a nice report (with decent pictures) to wave at any future buyer - even if in 5+ years time. If a bad report - drop it in the bin

[sailorboy1]

I vote that you put the barrier paint on the bottom. Seems that since the boat is out of the water and you have done most of the work that you are just looking at the cost of the coating. Is there really going to be a better time to do it? Maybe you will never need need it, but maybe you never would need a second anchor either!

[windtraveler]

Thanks to everyone for your great answers. Here's what we ended up doing this weekend... 3 coats of barrier coat (Interprotect 2000) (2 gallons) and 3 coats of bottom paint (West Marine PCA Gold... which my research showed is just rebranded Pettit Ultima). On each coat, we left a progressively larger area unpainted around the pads so we can tie in each IP2K coat and paint coat when we get under the pads.

We weren't sure if we wanted to do different colors of bottom paint (so you can easily tell when it needs re-painting) or not, but the availability of only 1 can of red (which we wanted), and another of blue, made the decision easy... We ended up with 2 coats of blue and 1 coat of red. We'll put one final coat of red on when we're hanging from the crane to paint under the pads and the bottom of the keel... and finish the job!

Hopefully this link works for pics... Picasa Web Albums - windtraveler09 - Painting Rasm...

Thanks!
Scott

[Minggat]

My experience went like this.

35 year old boat. Not horrible blistering, but enought to pay attention to. The yard took care of all of them, and then said, "barrier coat and you will never have the problem again". So barrier coat went on.

5 years later, same yard. Some blisters. What I got was "I never said you would never have blisters again!! No one in their right mind would ever say that !!"

[Mark Zarley]

Of all the boats that sink for various reasons, I am unaware of blisters being the culprit. Save the belt and suspenders rule for something more impt.

[Sandero]

The interprotect is to serve the purpose that an impervious gel coat does on a glass boat. First if you have blisters then it's a sign that there is something defective in the original gel coat. Get a moisture meter and see how the hull is and of course sound it to see if there is any rot.

If you don't have blisters and the moisture level is satisfactory, then don't bother with the interprotect. I believe it retails for about $90/gal and you need about 4 gallons (recommended by Interlux) to do a 35' sailboat. Putting it on is not biggie, just takes a couple of days and then you put the bottom paint on. It's an extra layer of protection or for some the primary on and then you want to make sure to build it up to provide that protection. Use a West system roller for a smooth application. It's worth it.

When painting it's ALWAYS the prep that takes all the time and the skill.

[Pete7]

Scott, you didn't put the red on the outside did you oh dear, it should have been blue on the outside to stop the blisters.

Safe cruising

Pete

[windtraveler]

Don't scare me like that Pete!

[warefuller]

This is a rather old thread, but I hope some of you will see this new post. I am doing a rebuild of the rudder from my Sabre 28. using foam/glass/ epoxy. I thought about applying a barrier coat (e.g., West 422 Barrier Coat Additive), but all the posts regarding barrier coat seem to be about protecting against blisters on polyester resin hulls. What I want to know is:
1. Is one barrier coat, mixed in with my epoxy resin per West's directions, that much more resistive to water diffusion that the layer of epoxy resin/glass that I have covered the rudder with ? (obviously many more than one layer in the repair areas), and
2. Is the West barrier coat likely compatible with the US Composites epoxy resin that I am using?, and
3. Many web sites claim there is a big difference in epoxy resins. Any one know if the US Composites one is appreciably better/ worse than, say, West's? When I built epoxy/glass airplanes (Varieze) I was careful to only use Rutan's recommended resin, but I haven't, to date, been concerned with the quality of the US Composites one - should I be?

[roverhi]

Epoxy is pretty much water proof, FWIU. Shouldn't need a barrier coat since you built it with epoxy resin. Barrier coats are to seal polyester resin which can aborbs water and can result in blistering.

[Cheechako]

Most rudder water intrusion is not through the fiberglass... I 'm guessing anyway. Maybe at the rudder stock etc.... one coat of epoxy sure cant hurt though.

[delmarrey]

Originally Posted by warefuller

This is a rather old thread, but I hope some of you will see this new post. I am doing a rebuild of the rudder from my Sabre 28. using foam/glass/ epoxy. I thought about applying a barrier coat (e.g., West 422 Barrier Coat Additive), but all the posts regarding barrier coat seem to be about protecting against blisters on polyester resin hulls. What I want to know is:
1. Is one barrier coat, mixed in with my epoxy resin per West's directions, that much more resistive to water diffusion that the layer of epoxy resin/glass that I have covered the rudder with ? (obviously many more than one layer in the repair areas), and
2. Is the West barrier coat likely compatible with the US Composites epoxy resin that I am using?, and
3. Many web sites claim there is a big difference in epoxy resins. Any one know if the US Composites one is appreciably better/ worse than, say, West's? When I built epoxy/glass airplanes (Varieze) I was careful to only use Rutan's recommended resin, but I haven't, to date, been concerned with the quality of the US Composites one - should I be?

Epoxy is epoxy is epoxy! There are just different hardnesses of the stuff. It will all stick together. It just can't be mixed together pre-cured.

e.g. The West Systems standard 105 & 206 mix is fairly hard and can crack if it's too thick in a flexing area. But what I've found is the slower the cure the softer each is. Some that have a higher content of catalyst with slow a cure is usually the most flexible.

Here, look at West's product chart and you can see differences>>>> WEST SYSTEM | Epoxy Resins and Hardeners - Physical Properties

[delmarrey]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

Most rudder water intrusion is not through the fiberglass... I 'm guessing anyway. Maybe at the rudder stock etc.... one coat of epoxy sure cant hurt though.

One thing that I do with rudders is grind a little grove, 1/8 to 1/4" wide and deep around the stock into the FG. Kind of like for an O-ring. Then fill that with 3M-5200, and once it's cured I put a couple layers of FG/epoxy over that and fair it in.
This will keep out water intrusion and still be slightly flexible so as not to crack and opening.

[svBeBe]

Originally Posted by windtraveler

See, this is typical of all the forums I've read! One person will say you're stupid not to barrier coat and others will say you don't need it.

Yep, unless you know the answer, it is difficult to tell who really does know the answer and who is just a forum-addict that gives you any answer. From what I have witnessed in this forum, odds are that you will get the wrong answer.

Regarding barrier coat, my answer, based on experience, is yes, use it. If you do not believe this advice, believe this: Don't try to save the few dollars that you will save on your haulout by NOT using a barrier coat, because the downside is huge.

Hope this helps,

Bill

[Nicholson58]

Originally Posted by witzgall

Do you have blisters now? If not, then no way do you need the epoxy. Blistering happens more easily in fresh vs. salt water, so your boat is already in the worst situation for this to happen.

Chris

Not necessarily true. Boats in the great Lakes tend to have very short seasons with very long out of water seasons. If you have no blisters now, count yourself lucky and perpare for full time imersion in warm tropical water. You will never have a better opportunity to make it right. The vintage of your boat, like ours, is spot on for polyester resin compounds. These are particularly prone to blisters and warm tropical, 365 days is as bad as it gets. Ours was transported to Michigan from Ft Lauderdale where it lived for years. We had gel blisters at about 6 per square inch and 7 huge delanination blisters of about 10 inches diameter or larger. Not only should your do the job, you should do about 6 coats of Interprotect 2000E or its equivilent. I had both the Interprotect and Pettit paint reps at a boat show and together, they helped outline a total method using both of their paints so that they would adhere. What is on the cans is not the best way.