Gas/Ethanol Separation

[sailorboy1]

I've gotten into the habit of not using the bottom gas out of my containers for outboard. And I carry a screw driver in the dink all the time so I can drain the carburetor when it stalls out (always on a windy nasty day when half way to/from the boat). But this gets old!!! The gas in the picture was the bottom of my larger can and wasn't even very old:

[Bill O]

Are you sure that isn't water separating out of the fuel? The ethanol is really good at pulling water out of the air especially in humid conditions. Have seen some people add a water separator to their gas fuel system when the amount of water is so bad.


Are there any ethanol-free fuel stations/docks in FL?

Edit; here's a site that lists where you can purchase ethanol free gas in FL

Bill O.

[sailorboy1]

Poured it through my Mr funnel and it all drains right through it. I've seen it have 3 stage before when water gets into it.

I try to get the ethanol free stuff, but you can only get what's available when you need it.

The other issue is always "well what do I do with it now".

[Pete17C]

https://www.wikihow.com/Remove-Ethanol-from-Gas

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by Pete17C

https://www.wikihow.com/Remove-Ethanol-from-Gas

Yes it's easy to separate the two. You can (and I have) pour the top layer of gas that is now lower in octane into your gas container figuring when you refill it the octane will be enough.

what do you do with the leftover ethanol?

[a64pilot]

You can’t successfully separate the two, yes you can pour water in the fuel and that will absorb some of the ETH.
Looking for a change in water level is how you test for ETH prior to using the fuel in an aircraft, because ETH is verboten to use in aircraft with an autofuel STC.
Anyway you can remove some of the alcohol, but what you have left over is water saturated fuel, it’s got all the dissolved water it can now hold because you put water into it, and this water can of course drip out of suspension from a temp change later and cause problems.
Yes, I know it was already there most likely, but phase change is the reason the stuff is prohibited for use in aircraft.


Best you can do in my opinion is to put a filter like this in the dinghy and watch the bowl for water.
I’ve never had the issues your having, but I have almost always been able to get ETH free fuel.

As far as disposal? Good luck there isn’t any way I know of that won’t get the environmentalists upset.
You can’t pour it into your waste oil. Because water contamination of the waste oil keeps it from being recycled.

[Pete17C]

I can solve any problem

[Dymaxion]

Hi-test gas in Canada is ethanol free. Gov't memo when still working for them came out stating not to use anything but hi-test if gas was to be stored more than 2 weeks, due to water attraction by ethanol in reg and mid grades.

[Montanan]

Reference for phase separation.

http://http://www.franklinfueling.co...-07-12-web.pdf

"Phase separation occurs when water enters a tank that contains an ethanol/
gasoline blended fuel.

Ethanol absorbs water. When gasoline becomes saturated, a layer of ethanol
and water, known as phase separation, can form in the tank. Since the density of this layer is less than water, typical water floats may not detect its presence.

Up to 100 percent of the ethanol can be pulled out of the gasoline and settle with the water at the bottom of the tank, depending on the fuel blend.

[sailorboy1]

[QUOTE=a64pilot;2819563

As far as disposal? Good luck there isn’t any way I know of that won’t get the environmentalists upset.
[/QUOTE]

Can't put a separator filter on the system, it's not an external tank.

I know how I've been getting rid of it (If you put in a container and leave open sitting out MOST will evaporate). But, I bet I'm not alone with this issue and wonder what people will fess up to.

[Tayana42]

I have been able to talk a friendly auto mechanic into taking a couple of gallons of “old” gasoline which he poured into his waste oil drum. I try every month or two to pour old gas for my outboard from my jerry can into my car which seems to burn it with no problems. I even bought a battery powered fuel transfer pump for this purpose.

[thinwater]

(Chem Engr with 40 years in the fuels industry. 35 years running multiple outboards.)



Sailor Boy: Have you been closing the vent EVERY TIME the tank is not in active use? Every night. Every rain storm. Everytime you are not going to use either the tank or the motor for a few hours? The ONLY place the water can come from is the air.


Keeping tanks out of the sun also helps. Less temperature cycling = less chance of leaks causing breathing. At the very least, make covers. Seporators don't really work for e-10; it's too much. Prevention is the cure.


Some notes here:http://sail-delmarva.blogspot.com/20...eparation.html
EPA memo on PS here: https://www.epa.gov/sites/production...s/waterphs.pdf


Basically, it takes about 0.5% water, but that depends on temperature. The most common cause is a leak on the fuel cap.


Re. Disposal, the county should have homeowner haz waste drop-off facilities.

[Tayana42]

Originally Posted by thinwater

Re. Disposal, the county should have homeowner haz waste drop-off facilities.

In my area if you bring old gasoline to the proper waste disposal facility they take the container too. You can’t pour out the old fuel into their drum. So find out if your haz waste facility if they have the same regulation. If so yo want to transfer the gas into a container you can give up.

[sailorboy1]

I’ll start walking, should be there Saturaday

[Montanan]

Don't desire to have ethanol in my gasoline.

And preferring Bud Lite over other Light beers, I don't want my beer brewed with corn syrup.

Dang corn growers messing with my gas and my beer.

One can siphon the water / ethanol phase separated fluid from the bottom of your tank, observe the flow as it dispenses into your container and watch for when just gasoline begins to be drawn then you can stop further gasoline tank.

Tilt the tank so as to have a clearly lowest spot and put the siphon hose into that portion. If there is a hose that dispenses from the bottom of the tank to the carburator / injectors then use that hose to draw out the accumulated phase changed water / ethanol mixture.

Evaporation is an easy was to dispose of the junk. Or a bonfire, but be careful when lighting as the fumes can be explosive especially if there was some gasoline mixed in with the water and ethanol.

Supposedly there are some chemical treatments that will aid in preventing phase change and if you use enough they state that you can reverse the phase change because their additive chemical competes to attract the water more than the attraction of ethanol. Not sure if the products are truly effective or just snake oil and market hype.

Reference to an example of such treatment. There likely are many others.
https://k-100.com/hot-topics/prevent...nded-gasoline/

Best solution is to use up your gasoline in your tank frequently and to keep water out of it in the first place. Gasoline does go stale with aging even if there is not water intrusion by rain or condensation.