Catamarans in 50kt winds

[beiland]

Originally Posted by Originally Posted by [B

Souther Wombat[/B] ] Don't imagine for a second that short clip shows storm conditions. That's not 50 to 60 knots. There's a lot of disinformation.


I'd estimate not much over 20 knots

Originally Posted by Bulawayo

Hmmmmm, if Weavis says its so, then I am happy to accept his word. Any half experienced sailor knows that footage rarely can recreate the reality. I have filmed 40-50 knots and afterwards, watching the same footage .......well, it all looked so tame.
This can also be seen on You Tube. In particular, when 'Honeymoon' posted a clip of sailing in 50Knots in his Lagoon 38ft. It looks pretty mild on film. Is that also a bit of creativity? It is not disinformation.

I agree with you Bulawayo, photos of rough seas are hard to capture the intensity and size. I looked at that video under discussion and that size of a sea did NOT result from a 20 knot wind,...rather significantly bigger.

[tunnelvision]

Last summer we were at anchor in our 38 Maxim Cat when we were hit with a violent summer squall. when the wind hit 30kts our anchor started dragging and I had to hold position with the engines. The wind continued to build to a continuous 45-50kts. Several times it went to 56kts and it lasted for about 40 minutes. These were complete whiteout conditions with torrential driving rain and a steep 4-6ft chop in shallow water. Was it fun NO! did I feel like we were about to blow over no way. Three lessons were learned from the experience. Don't wait to put on your life jacket. If you think extreme weather is approaching start your engines. Don't put off buying a proper anchor in our case a 55lb Mantus.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by weavis

I think your objective viewpoint is correct. In saying that, it is the viewpoint of a competent mono sailor who uses the techniques and feel of working a mono instead of accumulated knowledge of how to sail a Catamaran in wind...

An experienced Cat sailor can tell you of how they work the passage with reduced sail, eye on the fill and the feel of the boat so it does not overpower.. time aboard will give you that knowledge..

I suppose that must be true, but I still wouldn't choose a cat for these lats. Nor does practically anyone else.

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[Paul L]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I suppose that must be true, but I still wouldn't choose a cat for these lats. Nor does practically anyone else.

Sent from my D6633 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

A couple of years ago a cat did the NW Passage successfully

[weavis]

I guess you are right....

[smj]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I suppose that must be true, but I still wouldn't choose a cat for these lats. Nor does practically anyone else.

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You must be joking


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

[weavis]

Seriously.

Whilst people with no prejudice against Cats present no prejudice, the reality is that there is prejudice. Not the overt "CAts suck" but the prejudice of familiarity and of reluctance to accept that Cats can do anything equal to a Mono.

I did not say better.

Its a boat. A boat floats, sails motors and moves across water. Each design will add merit or de merit depending on the design. Certain Mono designs are fantastic and certain Cat designs are wonderful.... Some are safer and better suited to certain situations than others, in BOTH types of vessel.

In the end, it would come down to personal Choice. As it should be. I would have a De Tomaso over a Ferrari... Just preference.

I have Monos... I will get a Cat.. Preference.

PS... no interest in the higher latitudes either in a mono or a Cat..

[REsCat]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I suppose that must be true, but I still wouldn't choose a cat for these lats. Nor does practically anyone else.

Sent from my D6633 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

From previous replies that you have made here and elsewhere on CF regarding your general Lat/location I would completely agree with you with the one exception that I might consider venturing your way in the "Peak" summer warm month(s). (you do get a bit of those don't you?...)

Our boat is not lacking for comfort,safety,build,speed etc but it is not suited for "Cold" weather, higher Latitude year round cruising in my opinion and I believe you that they are quite a rarity where you cruise.

Larger Cats with expansive back deck areas, roomy salons and hulls are more of a challenge to insulate, heat, canvas and shield from crappy cold elements as compared to well designed Monos for those objectives.

Bob

[DotDun]

Originally Posted by weavis

I think your objective viewpoint is correct. In saying that, it is the viewpoint of a competent mono sailor who uses the techniques and feel of working a mono instead of accumulated knowledge of how to sail a Catamaran in wind...

An experienced Cat sailor can tell you of how they work the passage with reduced sail, eye on the fill and the feel of the boat so it does not overpower.. time aboard will give you that knowledge..

I know when I have too much sail out....by the sound and the way the lee hull looks/responds in the bottom of a trough. A cat sailor tends to be more conservative than a monohull sailor, reef early, reef for what might happen weather-wise. And, reefing has never slowed us down, so why would I not reef early?

F8 all day? Been there done that! Triple reefed, sustained 35-38kts all day on the beam. Two problems - (1) had to hold on to the beer as even a cat in F8 blown-waves will spill a beer left alone on the table! (2) wind blown spray got me wet!

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by weavis

I think your objective viewpoint is correct. In saying that, it is the viewpoint of a competent mono sailor who uses the techniques and feel of working a mono instead of accumulated knowledge of how to sail a Catamaran in wind...

An experienced Cat sailor can tell you of how they work the passage with reduced sail, eye on the fill and the feel of the boat so it does not overpower.. time aboard will give you that knowledge..

I think you nailed it. I won't say they are apples and oranges but the heavier the weather the closer they get to that.

[Bulawayo]

Tunnel, this is precisely a lesson many of us have learnt. For me there is no storm sized anchor in my locker. I use the alleged storm anchor as my standard.
I know its off subject but I also never to used to use the safety lanyard on my outboard engine either - I do now, around my ankle following the deaths of the British family on an afternoon fun trip. Bitter lessons. The spare lanyard is kept next to the motor to allow someone else to restart the motor and hopefuly collect me if I have gone overboard.

Originally Posted by tunnelvision

Last summer we were at anchor in our 38 Maxim Cat when we were hit with a violent summer squall. when the wind hit 30kts our anchor started dragging and I had to hold position with the engines. The wind continued to build to a continuous 45-50kts. Several times it went to 56kts and it lasted for about 40 minutes. These were complete whiteout conditions with torrential driving rain and a steep 4-6ft chop in shallow water. Was it fun NO! did I feel like we were about to blow over no way. Three lessons were learned from the experience. Don't wait to put on your life jacket. If you think extreme weather is approaching start your engines. Don't put off buying a proper anchor in our case a 55lb Mantus.

[Bulawayo]

Totally agree....its not just visual either. You recognise the noises being created - rigging sings. Visual also includes checking the leeward shroud slack .You can also feel the lee hull dragging itself as it gets immersed, or the bows taking that little longer to pop up. In my case, also the bridgedeck slap gets noticeable on certain points of sail. You can also be aware of the noise of the autopilot working more.

Originally Posted by weavis

I think your objective viewpoint is correct. In saying that, it is the viewpoint of a competent mono sailor who uses the techniques and feel of working a mono instead of accumulated knowledge of how to sail a Catamaran in wind...

An experienced Cat sailor can tell you of how they work the passage with reduced sail, eye on the fill and the feel of the boat so it does not overpower.. time aboard will give you that knowledge..

[Bulawayo]

Brave soul, I would love to know how they heated the boat. I keep thinking that I must install something but keep delaying it as I really do not know what to select that is practical.

Originally Posted by weavis

I guess you are right....

[tomfl]

Originally Posted by Bulawayo

Totally agree....its not just visual either.

SNIP

Yea I can almost do it by sense of smell.

The helm feels different, it gets heavier and there is a vibration I can never seem to completely eliminate moving the traveler, adjusting the sheets, or changing course.

I am not even sure it has all that much to do with speed. I have hit over 11knots with screecher, working jib, and full main up in 17-18 knots of true wind on a broad reach in maybe 2-3 foot seas. AP is hardly working and I am sitting on the aft bench with friends taking selfies with the rooster tail wake in the background. On the other hand I have had two reefs in and only a working jib in 25-30 knots and maybe 15 foot seas. Have to stay at the helm at all times and have someone holding the main sheet ready to release it. The helm just does not feel right.

Not that I would do it but I would bet I could close my eyes and put on ear plugs and just hold the wheel and know when it was time to shorten sail.

Harbor - Cruisers & Sailing Photo Gallery

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by DotDun

I know when I have too much sail out....by the sound and the way the lee hull looks/responds in the bottom of a trough. A cat sailor tends to be more conservative than a monohull sailor, reef early, reef for what might happen weather-wise. And, reefing has never slowed us down, so why would I not reef early?

F8 all day? Been there done that! Triple reefed, sustained 35-38kts all day on the beam. Two problems - (1) had to hold on to the beer as even a cat in F8 blown-waves will spill a beer left alone on the table! (2) wind blown spray got me wet!

Well put knowing when to reef on a multi hull. By time you will spill air it is to late. You are much less likely to spill the beer than a mono. I have had gimbaled beer holders however.