Horrible Guests, Terrible Crew

[Stu Jackson]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

How could it help me avoid this sort of thing in the future? Especially, since I’m now afraid to go on it after all this.

A few months ago, after a data breach at FB, I googled "How to delete FB account." Give it a try. Doesn't seem easy or straightforward, but can be done.

[PMac456]

If you need crew next year or 2020...let me know...30 years experience..Captains ticket... and know how to carry my share of the load!

[CarlF]

We rarely invite guests to be aboard for longer than five nights and 4 days. If they've had an expensive flight to get to us, we encourage them to fill out the week ashore at an inn.

This short trip length seems to be appreciated by the guests too. As much as we worry about horrible guests, they worry about a horrible boat trip.

Brevity reduces both concerns.

I only do long offshore trips with people who already have substantial offshore experience and understand how watch keeping works. They aren't guests. They're crew.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Macblaze

I've not run into border guard types who search computers/phones when we enter the US by boat, but that is a issue that never occurred to me when I am essentially crossing the border with my home. And having guests with who-knows-what in their search history makes it just frightening.

I think you've just ruined my day.

No, I think you may have missunderstood. The guest had a prior conviction for child porn dating back 10 years ago, which is why interpol conficated his passport. He didn’t board our boat with anything more than clothing and a cellphone.

[MV Wanderlust]

Wow! Just... wow. You’ve had a rough string of luck there. It’ll get better. Has to.

[Dooglas]

Well, some things like "your friend" the sex offender are a bit tough to anticipate, except to say that you should know people fairly well before inviting them on a several week cruise with specific expectations. About sharing costs and duties - that really does need to be written down (don't need to call it a contract - you aren't going to sue them after all). You just want to avoid misunderstandings. And, if anyone sticks you with half the bill for an expensive dinner and costly drinks that you didn't want - that should certainly not happen twice, let alone multiple times. Sounds like you find it difficult to explain to someone what is acceptable and what is not. No one said it was easy being the Captain, but someone has to do it.

[Macblaze]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

No, I think you may have missunderstood. The guest had a prior conviction for child porn dating back 10 years ago, which is why interpol conficated his passport. He didn’t board our boat with anything more than clothing and a cellphone.

No I got that. But consider what the hell COULD have ben on that cell phone!!!

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Dooglas

Well, some things like "your friend" the sex offender are a bit tough to anticipate, except to say that you should know people fairly well before inviting them on a several week cruise with specific expectations. About sharing costs and duties - that really does need to be written down (don't need to call it a contract - you aren't going to sue them after all). You just want to avoid misunderstandings. And, if anyone sticks you with half the bill for an expensive dinner and costly drinks that you didn't want - that should certainly not happen twice, let alone multiple times. Sounds like you find it difficult to explain to someone what is okay and what is not. No one said it was easy being the Captain, but someone has to do it.

We only fell for spitting the bill once, after that evening we only paid for ourselves. But these guests were of that mindset throughtout the two weeks... always putting their interests first and making sure they were the ones coming out ahead financially.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by JohnEasley

Wow! Just... wow. You’ve had a rough string of luck there. It’ll get better. Has to.

Agreed. ‘Just putting these experiences out there so others don’t have to suffer the way we did.

[Seaworthy Lass]

Ken, I am sorry to hear about your experiences this season.

Regarding your first two guests, one thing that struck me when reading your initial post was this paragraph:

Originally Posted by Kenomac

Our goal when purchasing our Oyster 62, was to provide a platform for us and invited guests to reconnect and see parts of the world together.... create lasting memories

Nowhere does this mention part of your goal was to have tasks and costs shared. Did you actually discuss this with your guests beforehand? Many people would assume that guests invited into your home (and by extension onto your boat as well if your aim is purely “to reconnect and see parts of the world together”) would not be subject to this, so perhaps this was simply a case of not communicating your expectations. On our boat I would not want let alone expect guests to be involved in watch keeping, so your expectations are not universal.

With friends the “contract” you mention may not be appropriate, but any information should be put in writing beforehand in, for example, an email, so that the situation is crystal clear. If you feel it is inappropriate to raise the issue of shared expenses, then just be prepared to happily bear the costs if your guests do not offer to contribute. Your generosity is very likely to be later reciprocated in some other manner.

SWL

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass

Ken, I am sorry to hear about your experiences this season.

Regarding your first two guests, one thing that struck me when reading your initial post was this paragraph:





Nowhere does this mention part of your goal was to have tasks and costs shared. Did you actually discuss this with your guests beforehand? Many people would assume that guests invited into your home (and by extension onto your boat as well if your aim is purely “to reconnect and see parts of the world together”) would not be subject to this, so perhaps this was simply a case of not communicating your expectations. On our boat I would not want let alone expect guests to be involved in watch keeping, so your expectations are not universal.

With friends the “contract” you mention may not be appropriate, but any information should be put in writing beforehand in, for example, an email, so that the situation is crystal clear. If you feel it is inappropriate to raise the issue of shared expenses, then just be prepared to happily bear the costs if your guests do not offer to contribute. Your generosity is very likely to be later reciprocated in some other manner.

SWL

Did you read the part where they actually sent me a bill following their return home?

But yes, sharing costs was brought up prior to them agreeing to come aboard for two weeks and they did contribute towards some of the onboard food, but I didn’t expect them to just hang around and not participate in any activities except to amuse themselves on their own computers. They have a boat of their own and know what needs to be done.

It goes without saying... they won’t be invited back. I found out later, that the guests have had trouble on other boats and been put ashore early. Of course, they made it sound like it was their choice due to “the boat being unsafe and unseaworthy” in each case. Their words, not mine.

[Dooglas]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

Just putting these experiences out there so others don’t have to suffer the way we did.

Fair enough, but I take it you are looking for observations from others about how they attempt to avoid unhappy situations such as your "friends" in Nova Scotia. I follow the suggestion above about short trips, i.e. 3-5 days. If I were looking for candidates for a longer passage where I desired specific capabilities, I would do the short trip with them first. And there is that old saying about the capabilities of a boat - drinks 6, feeds 4, sleeps 2.

[Jdeuel]

We've done a couple of houseboating trips with other families. Not the same, but the first time, we didn't spend much time clarifying who was paying for what beyond the cost of the rental. There ended up being some tensin as the the days wore on over gas for the ski boat, ice, beer, and who did what (ie cookking, cleaning, dishes, etc.) . The next trip, with one of the other two families and one 'new' family, we spent an evening ahead of time sussing out financial responsibilities, provisioning, cooking, basically everything that needed to be done and that needed to be paid for. The difference was amazing.

I think having the (initially) uncomfortable conversation in advance about expectations was key. There was no "I'll get it next time" at the fuel dock or "I forgot my wallet" at the store. Everyone paid their share at the point of purchase, which was nice because no one had to take the role of collection agency 3 weeks after the trip.

I sense that there was an assumption (and rightly so) that since the first couple were cruisers themselves, that they would understand the costs and pay their share. Obviously, they were looking for a vacation cruise. I imagine there was a lot of whispering in the staterooms as the days wore on.

As far as the creeper goes, live and learn. When it comes to reconnecting on Facebook, I realized that if I had really liked that person from high school, I wouldn't have lost contact with them for 30 years!

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Dooglas

Fair enough, but I take it you are looking for observations from others about how they attempt to avoid unhappy situations such as your "friends" in Nova Scotia. I follow the suggestion above about short trips, i.e. 3-5 days. If I were looking for candidates for a longer passage where I desired specific capabilities, I would do the short trip with them first. And there is that old saying about the capabilities of a boat - drinks 6, feeds 4, sleeps 2.

Excellent advice. We’ve done pretty good over the years with guests, only having one other problem with an alcoholic onboard six years ago, so our track record was going well up until a month ago.

[George DuBose]

Bad crew...bad luck.

On the other side of the coin, for two summer's cruises, I have had to supplement my friends who join me with extra crew that I find on Crewfinder.net or one of the other crew-finding services.

For two summers, I have been extremely lucky and found guys who love to sail, stand their watches with no complaints and are very helpful and welcome to be aboard.

I tell them before hand, that I will provide all onboard meals and beverages, but if they want to eat ashore, it's everyman for him/herself.

I have made three new friends who will sail with me again, I am sure.

Guess I am just lucky.