Francis Scott Key Bridge Collapse

[marcjsmith]

7-10 days for the ship to be moved back to the cargo port.
30 days for the channel to be clear for marine traffic.

3 years for a new bridge..

[JimsCAL]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

Looking at the area, it's difficult to believe they dont require tug assistance there.

There is basically zero chance this will result in tugs being required in a situation like this. Just what do you expect tugs to do with a ship of that size going at 8 knots? Tugs are used to help ships get in and out of tight quarters where they need help maneuvering.

[JimsCAL]

Originally Posted by Kettlewell

I don't know ship engineering enough to speculate, but doesn't it seem strange that all power can be lost at once like that, and there is no instant backup way to power the rudder system?

There is. In addition to a redundant generator on line in close quarters like this, all ships have an emergency generator that starts automatically on loss of electric power. Question will be what happened that this all didn't work.

FWIW I spent a number of years as an engineering officer on large ships like this and then spent almost 30 teaching marine engineering at the US Merchant Marine Academy.

[skipperpete]

Originally Posted by Kettlewell

I don't know ship engineering enough to speculate, but doesn't it seem strange that all power can be lost at once like that, and there is no instant backup way to power the rudder system?

Kettlewell, I can partially explain the chain of events leading up to the allision, I was aboard a ship where exactly this happened. On our ship, pilot on the bridge, engine room manned going out on a seatrial after major repairs and making about 4 knots in Chinamans creek Cairns. The first fault was a seized cooling water pump that tripped out the #1 genset and we lost the plant and went dark so the chief got the second generator online and still unaware of the initial problem, it tripped out too and we went dark again. I was on the foredeck with the anchor windlasses and our emergency genset was in a separate engine room under the foredeck with an exhaust pipe in the foremast. First I knew was that the genset exhaust turned jet black then it shutdown and the pilot called me for the Stbd anchor to be released. Normally a ships anchor is lowered , not dropped but with no AC power, no propulsion ,no steering and no prop pitch control I released the chain compressor and then went back and released the brake and dropped the anchor in a huge cloud of dust and rust….. stopping the chain from running out at 4 knots is an adventure in itself because you have to approach the windlass and the maniacal chain to wind on the (newly relined) 5’ diameter drum brake… all ended well and tugs re berthed the ship after we dropped and buoyed the chain
The problem aboard during the recent allision in Baltimore would have been similar, ya just can’t drop the anchor quickly, even when you plan to do it with power and a few crew it still takes a co ordinated procedure SO, in total darkness and relatively unprepared ( it is usual to man the windlass while manoeuvering) it would have been nothing short of heroic and certainly life threatening to release even just one anchor without any control other than the brake.

[JPA Cate]

Originally Posted by JimsCAL

There is basically zero chance this will result in tugs being required in a situation like this. Just what do you expect tugs to do with a ship of that size going at 8 knots? Tugs are used to help ships get in and out of tight quarters where they need help maneuvering.

I was present on the day an oil rig was taken out to sea from SF Bay, via the Golden Gate bridge. There were 6 huge ocean going tugs on it.

I don't think a tug could stop a ship going 8 knots, which was probably just enough to maintain steerage, anyhow. We have yet to hear about whether the tide was on the ebb, or to learn what her minimum steerage way was. One hundred thousand tonnes is a lot of mass to slow down or turn. Had the tugs remained attached, they might have been able to push and pull her back to the north side of the shipping channel, but it all happened pretty fast, in terms of a real life catastrophe-- a cascade of failures.

I think they did well to warn the Dept. of Transport to warn the bridge.

Again, my condolences to the families affected. This has to have been a really hard, hard 24 hrs.

Ann

[Montanan]

We need Francis Scott Key to add a verse to the anthem:

Oh say! can't you see by the dawns early light that bridge which the ship is about to be run into? . . .



The Star Spangled Banner

Oh, say! can you see by the dawn's early light
What so proudly we hailed at the twilight's last gleaming;
Whose broad stripes and bright stars, through the perilous fight,
O'er the ramparts we watched were so gallantly streaming?
And the rocket's red glare, the bombs bursting in air,
Gave proof through the night that our flag was still there:
Oh, say! does that star-spangled banner yet wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave?

On the shore, dimly seen through the mists of the deep,
Where the foe's haughty host in dread silence reposes,
What is that which the breeze, o'er the towering steep,
As it fitfully blows, half conceals, half discloses?
Now it catches the gleam of the morning's first beam,
In fully glory reflected now shines in the stream:
'Tis the star-spangled banner! Oh, long may it wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!

And where is that band who so vauntingly swore
That the havoc of war and the battle's confusion
A home and a country should leave us no more?
Their blood has washed out their foul footsteps' pollution!
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave:
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

Oh, thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand
Between their loved home and the war's desolation!
Blest with victory and peace, may the heav'n-rescued land
Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation!
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
And this be our motto: "In God is our trust":
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

[MARC D]

Originally Posted by Jammer

This. I anticipate exceptions for U.S. flagged vessels.

Makes no difference U.S. flagged vessels or foreign, all must use local, harbour pilots.

[Watermann]

Originally Posted by JimsCAL

There is basically zero chance this will result in tugs being required in a situation like this. Just what do you expect tugs to do with a ship of that size going at 8 knots? Tugs are used to help ships get in and out of tight quarters where they need help maneuvering.

A tractor tug made up centerline aft would have absolutely been effective at either significantly slowing, if not stopping, this ship.

Failing that, so long as the rudder is not jammed hard over, it could have also provided enough steering lever to keep the ship somewhat mid-span.

Part of having a tug made up is also controlling your speed enough to keep the tug effective for what you may need (granted, some ULCV's today have Dead Slow bells approaching 7-9 kts).

Such maneuvers being effective depend on both the pilot and tug operator having some experience in doing so. Simulators are great but nothing beats live drills (especially for the tug operator).

[Don C L]

I am no expert on tugs, but in my imagination I was thinking of tugs at the ready to control the direction of the ship if needed, not stop it.

[AA3JY]

CNN drone coverage..

https://fb.watch/r4jCKc3RPz/?mibextid=v7YzmG

[Kettlewell]

Cross-posted from another thread. This was in a Waterway Guide email today:

Effective immediately a safety zone is established for all navigable waters of the Chesapeake Bay within a 2000-yard radius of the Francis Scott Key Bridge. The 948-foot Singapore-flagged vessel DALI struck the Francis Scott Key Bridge on March 26, 2024.

The safety zone is intended to protect personnel, vessels, and the marine environment in these navigable waters. No vessel or person will be permitted to enter the safety zone without obtaining permission from the Captain of the Port (COTP) or a designated representative. The COTP is currently issuing a Broadcast Notice to Mariners (BNM) via VHF-FM marine channel 16. Mariners are requested to monitor the VHF channel 16 for the latest information. You may not enter the safety zone described above unless authorized by the COTP or the COTP's designated representative. To seek permission to enter, contact the COTP or the COTP's representative by telephone at (410) 576–2525 or on Marine Band Radio VHF–FM channel 16 (156.8 MHz). Those in the safety zone must comply with all lawful orders or directions given to them by the COTP or the COTP's designated representative. The U.S. Coast Guard may be assisted in the patrol and enforcement of the safety zone by Federal, State, and local agencies. If you have any questions regarding the contents of this bulletin, please contact the Command Center at (410) 576-2525, or via email at d05-smb-sectormd-ncr-scc@uscg.mil.

[skipperpete]

It must have been a chilling moment for the engineers, firstly the generators are offline so every bit of attention would have been dedicated to solving that ………THEN, once enough power was available for essential services and the main engine was ready for a restart, they had to stop it rotating and start it in ASTERN at 8 knots, an awsome feat given that this entire chain of engine room events occurred in an almost impossibly small time frame, less than 5 minutes. No one was just walking in that machinery space. Same with the foredeck crew, one moment they’d have been leaning on the bulwark having a yarn and a cigarette, next moment… darkness and the prospect of doing an emergency anchor drop when ordered by the captain. The ships bridge would have been plunged into even more darkness ( unless the ECDIS had an ups) and it will be interesting to hear the audio from the vessel data recorder, those pilots did an amazing job alerting the bridge authority, getting the anchor drop started , sounding the muster alert and praying that the engineers could save the ship from what was unfolding at 8 knots. The amount of smoke from the stack in the last moments is pause for concern.

[AA3JY]

Interesting ‘Time Line’ has been released..

https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https...JnSL7WmKRY&s=1

..as I was interested in the time the port anchor was ordered to be dropped and the time of the collision..approx 2 mins and 30secs..

[GordMay]

The remains of 2 of the workers, who were 26 and 35, were found inside a red pickup truck, submerged in roughly seven metres of water, near the mid-section of the fallen Francis Key Scott Bridge, on Wednesday.

Officials have paused the search for the bodies of 4 more workers, who are presumed dead, because conditions in the water had become too dangerous.

Based on sonar scans, authorities "firmly" believe the other vehicles, with victims inside, are encased in superstructures and concrete, from the collapsed bridge.

The two men who died, and the four who are presumed dead, were from Mexico, Guatemala, Honduras [ID’d as Maynor Yassir Suazo Sandova], and El Salvador.

[hpeer]

My knee nerk reaction is that the failure occurred years ago when either a risk analysis was not carried out, or it was done and did not identify this risk, OR the risk was assessed but then no preventative action was taken.

The most predictable thing in the world is that accidents happen. You can not stop that. You can anticipate it and take reasonable measures.