Firefly Oasis Carbon Foam AGM Batteries

[cha0s]

So they may be defective. They are nov16 ones but we're not installed until march 2017, and we're uninstalled in may 2017.

The issue is that I am not in the lower 48 so sending them back will cost about $150usd per battery. I went to great trouble to get them @ $500usd a piece because they seemed like they have all the benefits of lithium ion without the burn a hole through the bottom of your boat risk (no idea if this is a real risk but I had been lead to believe this).
I have never had a defective battery prior to this, so it's a shame that the most expensive batteries I've ever bought didn't work. I had read about the potential quality control issues, I just didn't think that this would be an issue.

If I did it again I would go with lithium ion.

I'm sure if you don't mind taking them back to the dealer (if you can) if you get a dud one then they are probably still a good option.

[Suijin]

So I'm "reviving" this thread with two questions:

1. To those with Firefly batteries, what has your experience been so far? As advertised? Any other observations?

2. What is the projected end of service life profile of these batteries? Does their capacity start to drop off gradually or do they fail catestrophically? I assume the former, but has anyone got there yet and worn out a bank of these yet?

[phantomracer]

Originally Posted by Suijin

So I'm "reviving" this thread with two questions:

1. To those with Firefly batteries, what has your experience been so far? As advertised? Any other observations?

2. What is the projected end of service life profile of these batteries? Does their capacity start to drop off gradually or do they fail catestrophically? I assume the former, but has anyone got there yet and worn out a bank of these yet?

Been freaking awesome.. I am intentionally treating the batteries poorly.. I pulled the boat out of the water last Oct... I didnt even put a charger on it or even check the voltage.. when I went to the boat a few days ago.. was at 12.6v .. Put the charger (voltage regulator actually) on it.. I think it was asking for about 2a current...so just about, or actually at fully charged.. I charged it (2 batteries) til it got to less than 1a.

Keep our boat on a mooring. no charger, just a small 30w solar panel to keep it topped off, and the 100a alternator..

so far so good. no problem running the fridge.. or anything.. and i don't care how low the batteries get! they, so far, are taking my abuse easily

[admiralslater]

Quick recap 5 FFs 900 watts of solar with 3 mmpt Victron controllers. On the load side 3 refrigeration units ,toaster in the morning hair dryer at night and a draw from dusk to dawn of about 100 amps.
Battery bank is usually back to full charge by 2 pm with no sign of degradation

[zboss]

Very pleased so far. Charges fast. We hang somewhere between 45% capacity before the sun comes up the morning (I think one day after extensive multi day cloud cover we were down to the 30’s) and then at 80% by high sun and then 87 or 90 (according to the balmar... the amp counter shows us full by noonish) by sun down. These are the first AGM batteries we have used so I don’t know if this is typical behavior for AGM.

[missourisailor]

My bank is still too new for any long range predictions.

Installed in Feb 2018, 6 FireFlys replaced 8ea 6v Life Lines. Only needed 4 of the FireFlys to replace the old Life Line bank. But had extra room so added two more, making 6 total.

Have made a few 3 to 4 day trips. Anchoring each night.
With my current P-of-S solar (200 watts on a very,very good day), even on the 4 day trips, the Smart Gauge never went below 55%. The old worn out and very abused Life Lines would not last the second night.

Once back at the home dock, and connected to shore power, the Smart Gauge was/is showing in the high 90's after a few hours.

Long term life expectancy, only time will tell.

Very Very happy with them.

[Dulcesuenos]

Originally Posted by admiralslater

Quick recap 5 FFs 900 watts of solar with 3 mmpt Victron controllers. On the load side 3 refrigeration units ,toaster in the morning hair dryer at night and a draw from dusk to dawn of about 100 amps.
Battery bank is usually back to full charge by 2 pm with no sign of degradation

My question is do you really need 5 of the firefly batteries, could you have managed with say 3?

[admiralslater]

Originally Posted by Dulcesuenos

My question is do you really need 5 of the firefly batteries, could you have managed with say 3?

Maybe but the ability to get through cloudy days would be compromised. Last year before the solar upgrade we had a week of cloud and we could not catch up . I sized the bank to keep the deep discharges to a minimum. Our balance is quite good now .

[gatorsailor]

Does anyone have information on the production shortage of FF batteries? I understand their shift to factories in India has caused a significant decrease in quality to the point the batts require individual testing and have a high failure rate. That is causing a production backlog. I cant find any suppliers with inventory on hand.

[billknny]

Originally Posted by gatorsailor

Does anyone have information on the production shortage of FF batteries? I understand their shift to factories in India has caused a significant decrease in quality to the point the batts require individual testing and have a high failure rate. That is causing a production backlog. I cant find any suppliers with inventory on hand.

Production of Firefly batteries has always lagged far behind demand. No dealer has ever had them “in stock” for long. When we ordered ours last year we had a 3 month wait quoted that turned into closer to 6 months.

On the other hand, they have performed better than advertised in charge acceptance rate. We have been very happy with them. 80% of the performance of Li batteries for 30% of the installed cost.

[CarlF]

I installed eight Fireflys in my house bank in April. I'd gone on the waiting list in November. These replaced eight Lifeline XT's (125 AH) which at 3.5 years had lost 50% of their capacity despite careful charge rate/voltage management, never going below 50%, being plugged in at a marina over 50% of the time, and having a few "conditioning" charges.

One of the reasons I soured on Lifelines is that these conditioning charges are a pain in the neck. You need to devote the better part of a day to monitoring one of these charges. I find it hard enough maintaining a boat without adding a new eight hour maintenance job. In one post, MainSail said that LifeLine tech people said you should condition every month if you anchor out a lot. That's just too hard.

During the last year, I have heard a surprising number of people reporting similar Lifeline experiences. I don't know if something's changed or I just wasn't paying attention before I had the problem.

So far, I am thrilled with the Firefly's. Obviously, it's too early to judge their longevity but the bank voltage seems to stay higher for longer than the Lifelines even when new -- even though the bank is slightly smaller. On a typical night at anchor, I used to to start the genset in the morning to use the electric coffee maker, microwave and toaster because under this big inverter load the bank was falling below 12v. Now even under load it's at 12.2 and our mornings are genset noise free. And I no longer worry about going below 50% (the lowest I've gotten so far is 70% discharged - but only for a few hours). But I love not having to check the gauge constantly and worrying about the batteries.

And as noted, charge acceptance of the Lifelines seems far better. I had to adjust the belt load down on the Balmar regulator down another notch because even the full frame alternator was getting to hot with a heavily discharged battery. But the charge amps stay up there to well past 90% before tapering. A huge time saver.

As you can imagine, I was trying to understand the cause of the shipment delay while waiting. They said they were having issues scaling up new production - but that's a common problem of most small businesses with rapid increase in demand. And setting up overseas production is rarely smooth.

I don't buy the rumor about bad batteries being part of the problem. I have heard that Bruce Schwab's folks (the primary distributor for marine use in the US) do test every shipment but I suspect that's more due to his reputation for great quality and customer service than a problem with the Firefly's. All battery brands have bad batteries. I wish every distributor would test before the customer installs.

Obviously, the big test will be whether these last substantially longer than the Lifelines. Fingers crossed.

[john61ct]

I have been approached by an employee of the Indian parent to order directly.

I do not think that would be as safe.

I am very happy that Bruce's NA distribution is doing stringent QA on the Indian output.

If that causes a backlog, it is well worth it.

My trust in OceanPlanet is intrinsic to the value proposition of the brand.

[hellosailor]

john-
As was I, over a year ago. I didn't feel confident about "some guy" calling me at random to see if I was still looking for batteries, and I felt that if the factory was trying to undercut distributors, that wasn't a good sign either.
Sometimes I miss the news: Eveready has been Indian-owned for some time now, and they just bought out Rayovac. Go figure, batteries would become an Indian thing.

At those prices, I want a reputable domestic vendor, for warranty reasons if nothing else.

[Nicholson58]

6 batteries X 4 = 24 VDC 450AH getting freight forwarded to Trinidad. We install in October, replacing 4 X 6 volt Lifelines (now ten years old)

I have high hopes. After much research, rejected LIFO due to required wiring revisions as well as reprogramming and new software needed for all of our charging devices.

[Alberto]

Originally Posted by hellosailor

john-
As was I, over a year ago. I didn't feel confident about "some guy" calling me at random to see if I was still looking for batteries, and I felt that if the factory was trying to undercut distributors, that wasn't a good sign either.
Sometimes I miss the news: Eveready has been Indian-owned for some time now, and they just bought out Rayovac. Go figure, batteries would become an Indian thing.

At those prices, I want a reputable domestic vendor, for warranty reasons if nothing else.

My experience with this company was quite bad, however the only reasonable people I dealt with were the ones based in India. I ended up buying another brand and couldn't be happier.

I contacted Oasis/Firefly via their website requesting some very specific technical information. Tech support replied immediately, they sent me a very detailed form to assess usage, which I completed and returned. A couple days later they sent me a life-cycle cost analysis recommending a configuration for my need, it was impeccable except for one detail, the cost they used was $340 per battery. Retail cost in the US was at the time $486, even if buying 8 batteries, like in my case, and lead time was several months. I moved on.

A few weeks later they contacted me again, asking about my application. I told them at $486 I had much better alternatives, and I was already dealing with Lead Crystal. They insisted they were really interested in my application (electric propulsion), offered me a better pricing (around $300 each battery) and immediate delivery.

Shortly after I received the nastiest email from this guy Bruce Schwab, "Master Distributor", really insulting, claiming among many other false accusations that I went "behind his back" contacting India to get a better pricing. Up to that moment I had no clue I was dealing with India, I replied to this individual explaining I contacted Firefly Oasis via their website and tech support got involved, explaining him I never asked for any discount, it was offered to me by his company (I assumed it was the same one). Management replied claiming they'd honor their offer. As I don't do business with people like this Bruce Schwab I didn't follow up.

Dealing with Lead Crystal was a completely different experience. Superb personalized support, immediate delivery, and the batteries are truly amazing.

Alberto