Want To Buy: 40-50 Foot Cat - Somewhat Unorthodox Approach

[D&D]

Originally Posted by downunder

Good luck.

You will need it to pick up a low houred Lagoon 440 with watermaker priced between $200,000 - $325,000.

Not saying don't try. May get at a bank's fire sale.

We agree 100% with the above.

Unless the market's seriously further deteriorated since we bought -- It was already very, very weak -- in February 2011, that price range will very likely involve ex-charter (in which case of course 'low hours' is very unlikely) and 4-cabins.

If, however, age is no barrier for a well-maintained vessel (as indicated in the OP) then there should be plenty of choices in that range.

Happy hunting teneicm...and we'll look forward to seeing out there on some magic, secluded anchorage!

[Palarran]

Do you have a way to prove your a cash buyer? If I was selling and someone approached me with an offer like this, I'd want to know they actually do have the money, like a letter from your bank stating the money is on deposit.

[D&D]

Originally Posted by Palarran

Do you have a way to prove your a cash buyer? If I was selling and someone approached me with an offer like this, I'd want to know they actually do have the money, like a letter from your bank stating the money is on deposit.

Very good point Palarran...and also one of the services provided by a buying broker.

Of course the deposit 'service' is one that REALLY puts the ethics of the broker under the spotlight. Given the likely large deposit sums involved AND the potential to want to retrieve those funds in the event that the purchase path leads elsewhere, one really puts faith in the broker's willingness to do so. On this particular aspect, we can say with great authority that the buying broker we (almost!) used was indeed prepared to very promptly refund our deposit; that, plus the superb service we received, makes us both prepared and even eager to support that broker in the future.

[Palarran]

I don't know if I'd trust a broker to hold that type of money. I've bought a lot of distressed homes in the past 4 years and we have a letter from our bank stating that we have X number of dollars available for immediate funding.

This was an issue (though not key) for the seller when I bought Palarran. He had lowered the price to fire-sale region with the stipulation that it was "as is, where is" and it happen fast. One of the shrouds had some broken wires and I asked that they replace it, that was the only thing. the guy looks at me and said, you must not understand "as is".

It really never hurts to try anything that's free. If the stragety is to post on Cruisers Forum that your looking for a seller listing on yachtworld who is really serious about selling and wants to lower their price to save you the trouble of making lowball offers - it will probably succeed. You'll get one response from the 6000 sellers on yachtworld. They will probably lower their price by 15%, the same amount they would have if a broker was making an offer. IMO

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by D&D

Very good point Palarran...and also one of the services provided by a buying broker.

Given the sums involved, I don't see that OP is dumb enough to be handing over his financial details to anyone just to appear "serious" ....Brokers included. When it comes to time for OP to start putting hand in his pocket on expenses (Own Inspection / Survey / Haulout) will soon tell if he has the money to back up the words. (and FWIW, on those sums I would be using a Lawyer to handle both the paperwork and the cash, rather than a numpty Broker).

But as a Vendor (whether in a financial hole or not) IMO worth at least an e-mail to see where things go, even if you have to use your own broker to do the thinking for you.

Nor I suspect is OP looking for validation of his approach. For some it will work - for others not (for a variety of reasons). Really it's only a glorified "Boat Wanted" advert. Probably outside the comfort zone of many.........but he only needs one boat.

Would be interesting to hear how things pan out (once a boat is bought, by this approach or via a Broker).

[POH]

Please keep us in the loop on how this works out.

We are going to be cashed up and hitting Florida/the Caribbean in September looking for a ~40ft cat.

Anyone who can recommend a good buyer broker, I would love you to PM me (D&D, I'll do you just now).

Anyone with a 2005+ Lagoon 38, 400, 420 or Leopard 40, please feel free to follow through on the OP's approach with me too!

[ausaviator]

If your approach fails, try this one.

Search for used boats on websites etc.
Make an offer on one of those boats.
Purchase a boat.

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by ausaviator

If your approach fails, try this one.

Search for used boats on websites etc.
Make an offer on one of those boats.
Purchase a boat.

I don't think it's an either / or approach . OP can probably also walk and chew gum at the same time. YMMV.

[Blue Crab]

Originally Posted by ausaviator

If your approach fails, try this one.

Search for used boats on websites etc.
Make an offer on one of those boats.
Purchase a boat.

I agree. I find the OP's approach annoying. I wouldn't respond to it cuz it's probably BS anyway. Yuppie BS.

The other thread where they want the free Lagoon is even worse.

I guess everybody's special in their own special way.

Where's the ignore button again?

Where's that quote about when I want to punch everybody in the nose, it must be time to get to sea again?

Someone take all these folks out to the Farralons and drop them off.

[Doodles]

Originally Posted by Blue Crab

I agree. I find the OP's approach annoying. I wouldn't respond to it cuz it's probably BS anyway. Yuppie BS.

The other thread where they want the free Lagoon is even worse.

I guess everybody's special in their own special way.

Where's the ignore button again?

Where's that quote about when I want to punch everybody in the nose, it must be time to get to sea again?

Someone take all these folks out to the Farralons and drop them off.

Mr. Rogers said we were.

Mister Rogers' Neighborhood . You Are Special Song | PBS KIDS

[teneicm]

Originally Posted by Palarran

Do you have a way to prove your a cash buyer? .

To the random internet? No. To a bona fide seller? Sure. If we are talking about a boat already listed on yachtworld or similar, once contact is made between myself and the prospective seller I'd still go through the typical process of having my broker write up an offer and having a deposit be held by the brokers or an escrow service. So you would know pretty quickly if I had the 10-20 percent needed for a deposit. The benefit of a "cash buyer" really means that I don't need to qualify for financing and the sale can proceed as quickly as the survey and closing can be pulled together. For that I'll happily be willing to have an a provision in the contract stipulating reasonable timelines to get to a closing date. And if we got to the point where we were all but agreed on everything but you still wanted to see my bank account statement, I'd probably be fine with that...

Originally Posted by Blue Crab

... it's probably BS anyway. Yuppie BS.

Nope. I can be full of BS on lot's of things (ask my wife), but this is real. And yeah, you seem a bit cranky, probably time to get back out to sea...

David is really correct- at its heart this is simply just a boat wanted ad with a filter on it to save me from hearing from the same people who just want to offer the boat at the same price as on Yachtworld. Most people selling stuff build in a buffer to their asking price because they know they will be asked to negotiate down. That buffer is different for different people. I'm trying to strip away the negotiating BS and get to meat of the issue: what is the price you will sell your boat for- and do I see it the same way. This is not a "special" way of doing things, it's just different from the norm in the boat world- but completely typical for most of the transactions we engage in everyday. Do you go down to your grocery store and start negotiating with the check out clerk over the price of a can of soda? No- the seller has set a price they are agreeable with and the consumer makes his choice.

As David pointed out, it's just an email to find out if it's worth engaging in further conversation... you're not going to be committing to the Columbia House record of the month club.

And for those keeping score:

Messages received stating, "Cool idea! Let me know how it goes!": 3
Messages received stating, "Dumb idea! It'll never work!": 1
Messages from brokers wanting to represent me: 2
Messages about legitimate boats: 1 (although no mention of an asking price different than advertised, just "may be negotiable")

[Tropic Cat]

Originally Posted by teneicm

.....
Why should you do this? This is an opportunity for you to present a better (or hopefully your best) offer to a qualified purchaser that will be buying and not just kicking tires.

Boat shoppers are just so interesting to watch. In this case you are way...way..behind the internet / technology curve. Folks who aren't listing with a broker are either putting their boat for sale on their own web site or selling on a catamaran for sale by owner website. In either case, catamarans are selling every day.

You seem to think you're special? You left out the reason the catamaran marketplace can't get along without you?

Take some advice, go find a boat offered for sale by owner. Don't insult the owners by offering substantially below asking price and make sure you don't spend the $15K per year maintenance kitty the boat will require..

[teneicm]

Originally Posted by Tropic Cat

Boat shoppers are just so interesting to watch. In this case you are way...way..behind the internet / technology curve. Folks who aren't listing with a broker are either putting their boat for sale on their own web site or selling on a catamaran for sale by owner website. In either case, catamarans are selling every day.

You seem to think you're special? You left out the reason the catamaran marketplace can't get along without you?

Take some advice, go find a boat offered for sale by owner. Don't insult the owners by offering substantially below asking price and make sure you don't spend the $15K per year maintenance kitty the boat will require..

Wow. Lot's of venom. Not sure why. But nice to meet you too...

I don't think I'm behind the curve. I'm very familiar with all of the boats listed for sale by owner on your site. I'm also familiar with about a dozen or two independent websites. But I don't kid myself into thinking that I know about all the boats for sale out there, hence my invitation for people selling by owner to "please (I even asked nicely!) contact me". Not sure how that makes me seem like I believe I'm special.

And I'm not proposing to "insult owners"- fully the opposite. I'm all about getting a deal done that works for everyone.

[tomfl]

Originally Posted by Blue Crab

I agree. I find the OP's approach annoying. I wouldn't respond to it cuz it's probably BS anyway.
SNIP

As someone who is looking to buy a boat I have to say I find a lot of things annoying.

I have probably sent out fifty emails and made a couple of dozen phone calls. So far one guy has said he has a buyer who had the boat surveyed and is trying to get financed; if that falls through he will let me know. I am going to inspect two boats next week, weather depending.

The rest ignored my emails or did not return my calls. I could maybe understand this if I was asking for a free ride and a meal afterward. But my emails were rather direct asking simple to answer questions and always leaving my phone number.

The boats I am interested in were a Stiletto 27, F24, F27, F28, F31, Dragonfly, and a Contour 31. These boats are all in good supply and it is fairly easy to find listings several places. Somehow I thought it would be a lot easier to locate one of these boats than it has been so far.

[tamicatana]

TropicCat: anyone who takes any offer personally ("gets insulted") isn't someone I want to do business with, and I'm on both sides of that issue (boat for sale, looking to buy). My job as a seller is to get the highest possible price for my boat, and my job as a buyer is to get the lowest possible price for someone else's boat.

speaking of, tomfl: I have an F27 for sale... < see pic at left and in my albums here