Radar is now redundant ?

[AlanR]

Originally Posted by Boatyarddog

And ample RADAR reflection AIDS.
That is how you can be "seen" without much cost.
At your own risk!
AIS may help.
Boatyarddog

Only seen if the other ship has Radar, it is switched on, and being watched.

[Paul Carey]

Well we are still still waiting for pulse radar to flow through to the likes of us ,, until then it's the old electricity hungry 'dustbin up the mast' ...I have always believed it's better to be seen & the only really effective radar reflector is an active one , also tells when it's been 'painted' , but not enough competition amongst manufactures ...Keep em peeled

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by AlanR

Small boats do not have AIS, and many large boats do not. What about marker and mooring buoys in poor visibility. Navigating a river in poor visibility. Military/Naval vessels seldom switch AIS on.

Does "Every other vessel" mean one out of two? In my experience, it is much, much less than that. Think carefully.

If the choice were Radar or AIS, I would choose Radar.

That's Never the choice because the price point is completely different. It's "I have a boat buck to spend " can that get me radar , no. I'll buy AIS. When I have the money I'll buy radar

[rslifkin]

For those saying that entering any unfamiliar port at night or in bad weather is a recipe for disaster, as always, it's a case of "it depends". There are plenty of ports where it would be a terrible idea and very risky. But there are also ports where the entrance is easy to navigate without prior knowledge and fairly forgiving, even in bad weather. For those second type, depending on the situation, it may still be better to wait, but it's not automatically dangerous to head in.

[belizesailor]

@BB7

I think the basic premise you state is flawed. Specifically that the electronic chart is "better". This may work in first world venues where current survey data is used to produce electronic charts, but in much of the rest of the world it does not.

Example, in most of the Western Carib, electronic charts are dramatically innacurate (with the exception of a few small areas that get commercial traffic). You follow those into an unafamiliar harbor at night and you are highly likely to end up aground.

Case in point: a few years ago a cruising couple made the bad decision to trust their electronic charts to enter the San Blas Islands, Panama too late in the day for good vis...total loss on the reef.

In this world, I often use RADAR overlays to get a better idea of how much the electronic chart is off relative to charted land masses. Sattelite imagery overlays are also very handy.

RADAR and electronic charts are 2 entirely different tools which are complementary not mutually exclusive.

Electronic charts also wont show you those coastal fishing vessels with no lights at night (no they dont run AIS here) or squalls building ahead on your course.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by rslifkin

For those saying that entering any unfamiliar port at night or in bad weather is a recipe for disaster, as always, it's a case of "it depends". There are plenty of ports where it would be a terrible idea and very risky. But there are also ports where the entrance is easy to navigate without prior knowledge and fairly forgiving, even in bad weather. For those second type, depending on the situation, it may still be better to wait, but it's not automatically dangerous to head in.

Agree, it depends. I entered Bermuda for the first time at night. Plenty of opportunities to screw up bad there, but it is a very well lit and accurately charted commercial channel.

That said though, there are places here in the Western Caribbean that I know very well, but would not attempt a night entry.

[BB7]

Ok, thanks for the many responses, clearly radar still has its fans !

Maybe I should have play with my system and see if I can get a better resolution. Its really only at night or in fog that it becomes useful, and any ships the radar has found are more accurately shown on the chart plotter by their AIS info, which includes their speed. However, I shall go to work...

We use GPS to identify any anchor dragging on a stormy night, rather than radar which uses much more power.

Many thanks, BB7.

[Bycrick]

You really need to practice with it. A LOT. In nice clear conditions where you can verify what you’re seeing against the reality on the ground.

[Cheechako]

Radar is one thing that can save you in a pinch.
Also works for tracking big thunderstorms 75 miles away!
Or waterspouts.
Or the location and moving direction of a container ship at night.
Or small craft around you in the fog or at night.
You can even look into an enclosed harbor to see how many boats are in there and if you want to continue on to the next port.

[Dave Lochner]

Originally Posted by BB7

Ok, thanks for the many responses, clearly radar still has its fans !

Maybe I should have play with my system and see if I can get a better resolution. Its really only at night or in fog that it becomes useful, and any ships the radar has found are more accurately shown on the chart plotter by their AIS info, which includes their speed. However, I shall go to work...

We use GPS to identify any anchor dragging on a stormy night, rather than radar which uses much more power.

Many thanks, BB7.

The most important time to use radar is in clear weather. That way you can associate what you on the screen with what you see with your eyes.

[Cadence]

Does anyone know how to sail any longer?

[Erik de Jong]

Originally Posted by Scorpius

Most places would never see -3 feet (especially here in Canada where lower, low water is used for the datum of soundings rather than mean low water as used in the States. However, in Alaska, where they can have 40 foot tidal ranges, I expect -3 feet wouldn't be all that uncommon.

Here in Sitka (SE Alaska) we have about 3 to 4 times a year normal astronomical tides that are between -3 and -4 feet. Add a bit of storm surge to it and we occasionally have -5. That is just my home town, I know there are places here in Alaska where it is even more.


As for having radar or not, I use it for a lot more than just detecting land or other boats. The AIS thing is already mentioned an exhausting amount in this thread, but there is a lot more. You can see rain squalls on the radar when it is dark, you can see buoys and other floating objects, when sailing further north (or deeper south) you can see ice on the radar. When you go a bit more off the beaten track you will have to work with pre-GPS charts. A radar overlay shows you very clearly how far the GPS is off on that specific charts (I have encountered instances of 6 miles off in the north).

It depends of course fully on your style of sailing and where you sail. Just day trips in coastal waters, I would probably not bother putting a radar on a boat. Sailing a coconut run around the world? There would be a few places where radar would be handy, but all in all a good pair of eyes and some common sense is plenty, sailing off the beaten track and less cruised places? I wouldn't go without radar.

[sv_pelagia]

Originally Posted by Scorpius

Yup. The BC coast certainly has more than its share of hazards and challenges - including the fastest tidal rapids in the world.

But apparently we're some sort of "edge case".

Whatever, if it keeps them away....

[mrcarson]

They are ALL tools to aid your eyes. Chart and Compass.
Use what YOU have/can afford, with common sense and just be thankful you modern day sailors have such.

[David B]

Originally Posted by BB7

With a large screen displaying GPS location on a super detailed chart, and AIS streaming from every other vessel, I wonder if Radar is now an outdated and redundant technology?
I have radar, but very rarely use it since the GPS chart is better.
Will soon be speccing up a new boat, and wonder if Radar is worth having.

Thoughts from your experience ?

Are you assuming every boat transmits AIS?

A large number of boats don't have AIS, so you don't know they are there.
Then there are those who for some reason have AIS receive only, so they can see you, but again, you don't know they are there.

Then there are 'non-boats' out there that will never have AIS ......

AIS only, is a lottery - depends if you want to be in it or not.