What's the deal with brokers?!?!

[tarian]

And all doctors are equal too.....
How about layers, any takers.
A broker selling a boat works for the seller not the buyer and many come across the tyre kickers, perhaps if one is seriously looking to buy then make that clear.
Do not expect a broker to work hard for you if you come across nonchalant.
Also the bigger the broker firm the better the service as you can go up the money tree to their boss

[sail sfbay]

Originally Posted by Peter1949

What is the commission % of the final sale?

My experience in California is 10% of the selling price BEFORE any deduction for repair allowances.

[Sir_Crabs_A_Lot]

Ok, I have to weigh in here. Years ago shopping for a boat, I was shown a CHB in the PNW. Broker says it's "perfect". I engage a surveyor and pay him. Then comes the sea trial: Alarms are screaming! "What's that?" I say. Broker: "It's nothing, you can ignore that. Sign here!"

Turns out it was being run (1/2 hour) with no coolant. The heat exchanger was Swiss cheese and all the coolant was in Puget Sound. And the broker knew it.

[sail sfbay]

Sir_Crabs_A_Lot, Was that AFTER an engine survey and the sea trail was AFTER a marine survey?

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by shadow

I think you guys have misread my original post.. Everyone that I came across was a useless clown.. I didn't say all of them... And they seemed to be attached to the boats that I was interested in.. Just wanted to clear that up with everyone...

What financial range are you operating in? My bet is you (like me ) are in the lower end of the market. By that I mean less than $100K.

At this range, as as Dave just pointed out, the commission level means the broker really isn't getting paid a lot. Most brokers are paid on commission, and most commissions are 10%. If they work for a brokerage, then they share that with the owners, so their payout is even less.

A broker is a business. They have to allocate their time appropriately to the expected payout. So if the commission is small, the effort will also be small. It has to be, otherwise the broker goes out of business.

My personal view is that I would like brokers to stop representing low-end boats. If they can't commit to fully servicing the sale*, they should decline the listing. Accepting to list the boat, then not fully servicing the sale, does no one any good. Not the seller, and certainly not the potential buyers.

All of this is a generalization, of course. Some brokers are awesome, no matter what the commission. Some bend over backwards to help. And some take the long view, knowing they may not make a lot on this first sale, but they now have a life-long customer who will keep coming back to them.

But sadly, these seem to be getting fewer and further between.


*This means responding fully to all inquiries in a timely manner. And becoming fully informed on all the boats they represent, or be willing to get the answers if they don't know.

[Maple Leaf]

Great information and responses. I often hear that as a purchaser, you don’t pay the commission, the seller does. Wouldn’t the yacht be 10% cheaper if there were no brokers involved? As a buyer, I am funding this commission no mater how you justify it. I do understand that there are benefits to using a broker but let’s not lose sight of this reality. The housing market is similar and we have been seeing a shift away from brokers and a lowering of commissions. The % charged is lower today than 10 years ago . My preference for my purchase would be, privately. I will pay for the services of paperwork, survey, etc. If I’m looking at a 500k yacht that I have located and 2 brokers will share $50,000, That’s a lot of money. Do they negotiate on their commission. 10% tends to be unrealistic in today’s environment using search engines and locating yachts. Their knowledge is invaluable but I could offer 5k to most experienced yacht owners and they would be happy to assist and share their experience and knowledge. My 2 cents again.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by shadow

Hi All,
I know that most of you have purchases many boats in your lives and have a myriad of experiences with a wide range of yacht brokers. I've purchased a few myself and I swear, every single one of them has been dodgy scum that is not only lazy but incompetent?!

I've heard many stories, from here as well, that some people have had GREAT experiences with their broker and their overall transactions. That so far has been a unicorn and I'm sick of these idiots being in the way of a pleasant experience. If these brokers really hate their lives, then, do something else, stop making everyone around you, especially your client base, suffer for your crap lives..

Ok, had to rant as I'm still on the market and dreading my next experience even though I've been sailing since 12 and only feel alive on the water.. Oh well..

Cheers all for hearing me out... LOL

Brokers are salesmen. Unfortunately the honest salesman starves in comparison to the one that gilds the lilly until it comes to repeat business.JMHO

[shadow]

Great additions and I'm glad I'm not the only one experiencing this.. I like the idea of keep a good broker to be my buyer's broker.. Hence impossible since I haven't found one yet.. So that negates my current situation. As for the range, what's funny is that the broker that I ran into, on many occasions, was that their entire inventory were all priced about the same.. So, I fully understand if they had a bunch of yachts that were 500K+ and only had a small handful of 100K boats, but nope.. they were all equal and yet, they were still useless..

Had the same thing as another poster posted, they never return calls, never available for viewing, etc.. WTF is with these peeps? Again, I'm never ignorant to say all of them, just the ones I've dealt with directly for my purchases..

[Sir_Crabs_A_Lot]

Originally Posted by sail sfbay

Sir_Crabs_A_Lot, Was that AFTER an engine survey and the sea trail was AFTER a marine survey?

IIRC, the sequence was: Broker motored the boat to yard without me. I met him there. Marine survey complete and I pay the surveyor. THEN me and surveyor board the boat for the sea trial and hear the alarms for the first time. Broker said alarm was sounding for the entire trip from dock to yard.

[Dave Lochner]

Originally Posted by Maple Leaf

Great information and responses. I often hear that as a purchaser, you don’t pay the commission, the seller does. Wouldn’t the yacht be 10% cheaper if there were no brokers involved? As a buyer, I am funding this commission no mater how you justify it. I do understand that there are benefits to using a broker but let’s not lose sight of this reality. The housing market is similar and we have been seeing a shift away from brokers and a lowering of commissions. The % charged is lower today than 10 years ago . My preference for my purchase would be, privately. I will pay for the services of paperwork, survey, etc. If I’m looking at a 500k yacht that I have located and 2 brokers will share $50,000, That’s a lot of money. Do they negotiate on their commission. 10% tends to be unrealistic in today’s environment using search engines and locating yachts. Their knowledge is invaluable but I could offer 5k to most experienced yacht owners and they would be happy to assist and share their experience and knowledge. My 2 cents again.

The standard commission rate is 10% of the selling price. Some brokers have a minimum charge, the broker I used to sell my old boat charged the greater of 10% or $2K. Not all of that goes into the broker's pocket. Overhead, advertising costs, business costs all come out of the commission.

Brokers take lower priced boats for lots of reasons, one reason is to sell a higher priced boat or a new boat to the owner. Buy a new $400K boat and the broker will sell your $15K to make the sale.

It might be possible to save a little money buying directly from the owner and some owners may be willing to sell their boats privately. However, selling a boat privately is a lot of time and work.

From the buyer's perspective one disadvantage of not using a broker is access to the actual selling price of similar boats. The Yachtworld price is the asking price. Brokers who subscribe to Yacht World have to report the actual sale price in order to retain their membership. A buyer's broker will share that information with you. If it wasn't for the broker's charging commissions and supporting listing sites, those sites wouldn't be available to search. There are marketing costs regardless of whether the boat is privately sold or sold through a broker.

[Dave Lochner]

Originally Posted by shadow

Great additions and I'm glad I'm not the only one experiencing this.. I like the idea of keep a good broker to be my buyer's broker.. Hence impossible since I haven't found one yet..

Where are you located? If we knew someone might have a referral to a good broker.

[Stewie12]

The commission is usually 10%. This might be divided between brokers if the broker does not have it directly listed with him.

[shadow]

Originally Posted by Dave Lochner

Where are you located? If we knew someone might have a referral to a good broker.

Currently in Southern California area..

[Nightsky]

Originally Posted by shadow

I think you guys have misread my original post.. Everyone that I came across was a useless clown.. I didn't say all of them... And they seemed to be attached to the boats that I was interested in.. Just wanted to clear that up with everyone...

Sounds like you are dealing with the selling broker. They don't work for you, they work for the seller. If you "walk in" off the street, they get the whole commission without having to share it with a buyer's broker. That's a lot of incentive to say whatever it takes to get a deal done. I would suggest getting yourself a buyer's broker, but don't rely 100% on that person either, they don't make any money unless there is a sale. Try to find a broker that is very familiar with, or specializes in the type, brand of boat you want. Get references if you can. A good buyers broker will steer you away from a bad deal.

[Dave Lochner]

One value of a buyer's broker that has not been mentioned is that brokers often talk to each other and get wind of boats coming on the market before they are advertised.

If the buyer's broker is working for you, he or she can contact other brokers to let them know what you are looking for. Every one wants a boat on the market to sell quickly, no one, especially the owner, wants a boat to run up storage bills while waiting for a sale.