What windlass for a 22 ton cutter which will be anchoring a lot?

[Methersgate]

The difficulty in moving the chain locker to the mast is nearly always the forehatch. I agree that it’s the best place for it. Certainly a tubular chain locker is best - merchant ships have these for good reason!

I also agree about the desirability of a large diameter roller at the fairlead. I fitted a 7” diameter Delrin roller to the last boat but one and it made a huge difference, not just to stowing the anchor but to handling the chain.

[Cheechako]

IME moving the chain locker is more trouble than it's worth. If you buy the right rode etc for your boat, it should take the weight in the bow fine. I once moved the chain locker to under the V berth in one boat. By the time I was done it was a mess that didnt work very well at all. I used a large diameter plastic pipe, but I can tell you that any angle on that pipe doesnt work out well. If you use a vertical pipe with locker aft, your foredeck will be a mess and likely a rusty mess over time.

[hpeer]

When I replaced our bow sprit I moved the anchor rollers forward and outboard to accommodate roll bar anchors. It all works well EXCEPT I have a piece of stainless (2” heavy wall structural box) that the chain rides over. Well piss, missed that in the design.

To “fix” it I wired some starboard to the friction area. That made a huge difference, chain rides over very smoothly, almost zero friction. Happy my bullet dodge was so easy.

Now someone just needs to invent a way to keep the chain from piling up.

I have some spare chain in a bilge section, damn hard to get out without thrashing around in the Saloon. So I have a piece of flexible electrical conduit instickndown a port light, the the chain just pulls up and slides down nice and easy. I’ve got the conduit taped to my arch for storage.

[Methersgate]

The runners and riders look like Muir, Maxwell and Lighthouse.

I want to mount the windlass abaft the inner forestay, but the forehatch, which is not small, hinges at the fore end... That in effect rules out the horizontal windlasses, due to their length, apart perhaps from the Lighthouse 1501, which is very short.

So far, having discarded the aluminium contenders for the moment, due to my concerns about the amount of water that comes on deck forward, we have three vertical windlasses - the Muir VCR3500 and the Maxwell VWC 2500 and VWC3500, and one horizontal- the Lighthouse 1501.

The same concerns about the amount of water on deck mean no foot switches wander lead or jusr possibly radio.

[Nicholson58]

We learned on ours to isolate the thing when the anchor is down. This means we turn off the windlass breaker and switch off the neutral return. This saves a lot of galvanizing. For what it’s worth, our old Maxwell 3500 is aluminum.

[SailRedemption]

I designed everything from the ground up for our setup. Our Kaufman 47 cutter is 15+ tons so a little smaller than yours and we have a Maxwell VWC2500 for 3/8 g4 chain and a 85lb Mantus anchor. We set our Maxwell aft of the inner stay and forward of the forehatch. We haven't used it cruising yet but it looks great and works in trial. Our chain pipe goes down and forward a bit from the deck to under the v-berth via a 2 sch. 10 SS pipe we had welded up. It's probably a 3.5"+ drop from deck to bottom of chain locker. Almost finished with the locker part, just finishing up the gearbox enclosure. I'm thinking I'll be able to fit 200'+ of 3/8 g4 chain. I have a small locker forward of the v-berth that will hold 3/4" 8plait rode for extra deep anchorages.

[Methersgate]

Originally Posted by Nicholson58

We learned on ours to isolate the thing when the anchor is down. This means we turn off the windlass breaker and switch off the neutral return. This saves a lot of galvanizing. For what it’s worth, our old Maxwell 3500 is aluminum.

Thank you very much for that - important lesson to keep in mind!

[keithw88]

Did you decide to do that on the basis of shall we say inspired guesswork or did you make some electrical measurements?
I have stainless steel chain and connector onto my galvanised Rocna, and the s/s is acquiring a powdery grey coating over the firstcouple of feet! No obvious sign the Rocna is losing its galv, but seems a possibility!
If there is galvanic action there, I need to consider if there might be something similar going on with/inside the winch (Lofrans:-mixes aluminium and S/S)'
Are there any measurements I can do to determine if there are stray electical charges?
Has anyone any experience of adding a zinc anode to a galv anchor to protect it whenconnected to a s/s chain? Would it work? Could it make things worse?

[Nicholson58]

Originally Posted by keithw88

Did you decide to do that on the basis of shall we say inspired guesswork or did you make some electrical measurements?
I have stainless steel chain and connector onto my galvanised Rocna, and the s/s is acquiring a powdery grey coating over the firstcouple of feet! No obvious sign the Rocna is losing its galv, but seems a possibility!
If there is galvanic action there, I need to consider if there might be something similar going on with/inside the winch (Lofrans:-mixes aluminium and S/S)'
Are there any measurements I can do to determine if there are stray electical charges?
Has anyone any experience of adding a zinc anode to a galv anchor to protect it whenconnected to a s/s chain? Would it work? Could it make things worse?

I noticed the galvanizing was disappearing. I took measurements and fount the mv potential. The zinc on a chain is no different than the zinc on your prop shaft if the chain is connected to your boat ground.

I would never use a SS swivel in my steel chain. I use an anchor forerunner, galvanized high strength from Washington chain. Looks like this.

[Matt Johnson]

You can always wire up a second solenoid to only connect the negative when the foot switch or remote is activated, and save yourself from having to remember to flip anything on.

But, we too always disconnect the windlass when not in use, so I wired the entire circuit with a Blueseas 6010 dual switch to disconnect both pos and neg whenever the windlass isn't being used. This is in addition to the dual solenoids (I had an extra lying around as a back-up anyway).

Matt

[MJH]

I would first recommend a vertical windlass as a horizontal requires the correct angle of the chain meeting the gypsy, the vertical does not. I have a Maxwell HWC1500 on my boat (16 tons) and it has been reliable to date...I only wish it was vertical.

~ ~ _/) ~ ~ MJH

[philmarks]

I weigh in at 27 tons, have a Lofrans Leopard vertical axis which I fitted 15+ years ago in UK. I have done 3 trans atlantics and many hundreds of nights of anchoring. Still on original motor, 12 Volt, and original brushes. Parts easily available in Caribbean.


Mounted on a 2" teak board bolted to the deck, with a canvas cover which I put on for wet seagoing. I coated the motor casing with Lanacote grease and terminals are painted with starbrite liquid PVC. I also have a plastic bag wrapped around the casing.



It pulls a lot of amps and I usually run the generator when weighing anchor. I do not use any additional batteries for the unit and there is a 40' cable run to the unit.



I'd certainly recommend one. I don't know about budget now, but you don't want your windlass failing at 02:00 on a wet and windy night.


Nice boat you have. Guessing ex-joint services.

[Stress Tab]

Originally Posted by Methersgate

I have exchanged contracts on a Nicholson 55. A fabulous sailing machine but I have to start from scratch in the anchor department, and since I expect to be making very heavy use of the anchor(s) I want to get it right. Money is not unlimited.

The boat has twin bow rollers which are set up a bit above the deck. This photo of a sister ship shows the foredeck area (the inner forestay is off, but you can see the lever for it). The two deck eyes aft of the inner forestay and ahead of the hatch are just parking places for the staysail halyards and can be moved.



There is loads of space in the chain locker. The boat is wired for 12 volts. The engine is a recent Yanmar and there are no hydraulics. I am expecting to dispose of the existing 1/2” G4 chain and replace it with 12mm.

I have a completely open mind about vertical or horizontal but I do want something that will be durable (these boats are well known for being “wet” to windward) and easy to maintain, so I would prefer not too many mixed metals, and the ability to take it apart for attention.

I have a brand new Maxwell HRC10-10 that you might like. Sold my boat so I don't need it anymore. Never installed it.

[CaptJPMcGuire]

Vertical windlass & Capstain with snatch blocks gives you the ability to "pull" anything from any direction--aft, abeam or someone on the mast.
Old fashioned, heave, difficult to properly install but solid design the "Ideal " now owned by Schafer has always been a good performer.

[LargeMarge]

A half-inch equals 12.7mm, so 12mm is slightly smaller.

Our latest build is aluminum, and is based on the mountains of experience from the Dashews, their sailing encyclopedia, and their mega-site SetSail.

On their 78, one build picture shows the anchor is slightly larger than Steve Dashew. I seem to remember it weighs around 300-pounds.

On your Nichols, could you move up to 24vdc for your anchor windlass? Some sources say this increases the speed and power of the windlass.

If you decide to re-construct your anchor rest, I might suggest a downward incline so it never (rarely) needs a kick to get it to free-wheel out / down.

Every gear choice depends on your choice of cruising grounds and the sense of safety you require while anchored. A lot depends on your windage (the amount of 'shoebox' the wind experiences as it moves past your boat), and the bottoms you anticipate.

On our 55, we went with an ancient scavenged / repurposed manual hydraulic vertical for simplicity and fixability. Half-inch by 300', but we have much more bow buoyancy than most, so we can carry it. However, we designed our locker toward the Center-Of-Motion instead of out on the snoot.

Our chain locker is a 55-gallon plastic water barrel we found behind the Mormon store.

Your concerns about compatibility are well-founded. We zinc the daylights out of everything, but we are weird that way.

PS:
Did you read about the new USNavy ship Zumwalt melting its engine mounts? Could galvanic corrosion be beyond the scope of this forum?