27 year old rigging in very good condition

[nfbr]

I'm looking at a Cat with original Sta-Lok standing rigging.

Survey (in place) showed not one broken strand, crack or discoloration on anything. Mast and cross-beam.

The mast needs to be pulled for other reasons, so the obvious task is to replace the standing rigging.

BUT - it's in such good condition
And, it's all re-useable ends.

a) Would you replace wire that shows perfect?
b) Would you keep / NDT / replace the end fittings?
c) Screw it, go Synthetic.

[sailorboy1]

well you know how this is going to go

The riggers have convinced everyone, including the insurance companies, that rigging needs replacement every 10 years no matter what.

My rigging is almost 20 years old, has no issues, and I know the boat history and how conservative it is sailed overall, so I haven't replaced my rigging.

[barnakiel]

It depends on how you sail the boat and what the insurer says.


We sail offshore and we have no insurance, hence we replace everything on a regular basis.


If our boat lived at the dock or were sailed only occasionally in local waters, I would be tempted to replace nothing before it breaks.


b.

[thomm225]

It may depend on the boat also.

My boat doesn't have that much sail area, 313 sq ft, but still has the forestay, backstay and three shrouds on either side (2 lowers and one upper each)

I never met the PO of my boat so I'm not sure of the rig's age ,but I've had the boat 9 years, it sat on the hard 5 years, he took a farewell cruise that lasted 2 years from Massachusetts to Florida and the Bahamas so it's at least 16 years old.

I'm thinking it's quiet a bit older though since it didn't appear anywhere near new when I boat the boat in 201.

I'm a coastal sailor/weekend vacation cruiser

[Thumbs Up]

The wire itself shouldn't fail without warning. It is the other bits that you have to worry about. Chain plates, mast tangs, pins, toggles, bolts. If you have roller furling, you can't inspect the fore stay. Rigging degrades much faster in the tropics. It is common for the original wire to have been better quality than available replacement. But 27 years warrants replacement. I replaced my fore stay, mast tangs, and lower swages (with sta-lock). With the mast off it might be a waste not to rerig. If you can afford it...

[capt jgw]

The Sta-loks should be fine, just needed new cones to replace the wire. If do the wire, it's only a couple hour job and not expensive. Just need a wire cutter, appropriate wrenches and optionally a small bench vice. If the turnbuckles are currently screwed in half way or more cut the new wire maybe one inch shorter than the old. It will creep a little on initial tightening.
But as said above, the connection points like tangs and chain plates are the vulnerable parts and should be thoroughly inspected.

[sy_gilana]

Inspect carefully, annually, die test it. Keep it if it passes.
Our rig is 42 years old. Still perfect, its only so because they made good stuff in Sweden back then. The new stuff is crap in comparison.

[kmacdonald]

There are plenty of 40 and 50 year old boats with original rigging. If it has Sta-Loks it's been changed at least once. Sta-Loks are reusable. I wouldn't change it unless there are broken strands or signs of serious corrosion. The chain plates where they penetrate the deck are the biggest concern.

[JPA Cate]

@nfbr:

I can see the temptation to go to dyneema rigging, significant weight savings.

To me, your question boils down to this: how comfortable will you be with pretty wire that looks fine, and may or may not be? what is the risk of having to recover from a dismasting? (It will cost more than you might think, in a total dismasting you may also have lifelines, furlers, antennas, roller furlers and bow pulpit to replace, as well; and of course there's the risk to people, too.)

Story time: On our previous boat, we replaced all the rigging wire except the baby stay. This was a monohull. Jim bought a reel of really good wire, and we did it with Sta-loks. The baby stay looked fine, and it was a different diameter wire, and we thought it probably didn't get loaded all that much. It broke in a wee gale at sea, and Jim had to go aloft in 45 knots to make a repair. He was badly bruised --which heals, but it painful for quite a while. When we looked at the broken end of the wire, the outside wires were still all shiny and nice, but the inside was rust powder. Bearing that in mind, plus the heavier loading on catamaran rigs, I would say replace the wire. Because you can't see how the inside of it is. I would not leave on a significant offshore passage with almost 30 yr. old rigging.

If you are going to insure the boat, some insurers do require you to replace the wire --every 10 years--so the possible need for insurance may affect your decision, as well.

Finally, if you will need jacklines on your boat, used rigging wire, if still sound, will do very well, and the lowers may even be the right length.

Ann

[Benz]

It is common for stainless steel to show no signs of wear or corrosion before suddenly snapping. Dye tests can highlight some frightening results on stuff that looks pretty good to the naked eye. I'd replace.

[Manateeman]

The insides of the Sta-lok will tell you a lot. I’ve seen cones or wedges...whatever you want to call them, with very fine cracks or just one split that you need dye to see. But it’s the formers that tell you how well sealed the fitting was done up. Some get so rusted in place you have to remove them with an easy out. Some are so stuck I fabricated a special tool to remove them. Next look at the female threads. Stainless loves to weld itself together and if you don’t use TefGel you can ruin the fitting. I learned a lot from Florida Rigging and Hydraulics because the do big rigs all the time. If the former looks pitted, water has found a way inside...inside the socket and wire. One year or after 10 ...if the fitting was over tightened or the threads messed up, water will find a way in and the cone or the former or the wire will be compromised. You can have a rig with good quality wire and everything done properly the first time and the whole rig properly adjusted and an owner who does not beat the boat...the rig could be disassembled and you find nothing wrong. Or...one bad jibe or lightning or twang against the dock and just one wire has a little too much of a shock load.
I’ve seen an owner bend a new mast! Pull a wire. Pull it apart. Look at the fittings facing up. Take it to a good size rigging shop. All this x..y..z..number of years ...What? The working life of any metal is not simply a function of time alone. Exposure to heat, salt, chemicals, flexing, ozone, bird doo doo, manatee farts...sorry, I was thinking about my aluminum hull...never mind.
Step one, find good rigger. Step two, relax.
Happy trails to you.
Mark and his manatee friends

[kmacdonald]

I've never seen or directly heard of a rigging wire failure. Always been chain plates or end terminals. I sleep just fine though. YMMV

[Sailmonkey]

Originally Posted by kmacdonald

I've never seen or directly heard of a rigging wire failure. Always been chain plates or end terminals. I sleep just fine though. YMMV

I’ve had one fail on me. Tartan 10, upper shroud port side, wire failed right at the top of the swage, no other signs of impending doom.

One could say this was a terminal failure.....but it would be picking nits

[thomm225]

I had a side stay break also lower midway up. Mast fell right over, but there were two of us on two boats so no problem.

2nd boat towed in the first.

Hobie 16. (mid Pensacola Bay)

[peter loveridge]

I think it depends on how much stress there has been on the rig. If the wire has never been stressed beyond its elastic limit, it could be good for 100 years. On my boat, the uppers are 30 years old, and the lowers date from 1964. You could make a case for replacing any stay on which a roller furling is installed as they can't really be inspected