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Old 21-03-2024, 14:48   #1
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water makers

Does anyone have experience of Whisper 60 modular water maker? by PureWater of Germany.
I have the whisper 60 230volts AC and would like to convert it to 12 volts dc.
Any help and advice will be appreciated.
Thanks John
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Old 21-03-2024, 14:50   #2
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Re: water makers

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnmyjo View Post
Does anyone have experience of Whisper 60 modular water maker? by PureWater of Germany.
I have the whisper 60 230volts AC and would like to convert it to 12 volts dc.
Any help and advice will be appreciated.
Thanks John
Why bother to convert it to 12v? Why not just buy an inverter? At least 10x cheaper.

Top quality 500 watt inverter from Victron: https://www.12voltplanet.co.uk/victr...t-enabled.html

€169.
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Old 21-03-2024, 15:45   #3
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Re: water makers

Since the thread is named "water makers" I will ask what may be perceived as naive (stupid?) question but bear with me.

About 12-15 years ago a now late friend (so I cannot ask him) had put together a DIY home RO system as the water supplied to his home in NH was pretty hard and less than ideal.

Being a project manager in his younger years in E. Europe he thoroughly researched the subject and bought a bunch of RO system parts from a Canadian supplier on e-bay for about $150 plus replacements cartridges for about $30-50. All I recall he mentioned that at the time a similar bunch of parts would cost him $300 to $500 at his local HD.

The system worked flawlessly for many years, until he passed away and his wife not being technically inclined just diverted the line to regular tap and is using a Brita table top filter or some such.

I understand that a home RO system designed to filter out a hard mineral tap water into softer palatable one is not the same as water maker for a boat. But how more involved i.e. complicated and expensive would be RO home system to turn into boat water maker? Is it a matter of more number and more expensive parts? Is it totally different chemical/physical principle than a home RO system? Is it just the manufacturers' hype how difficult it is to put together a DIY boat version compared to a regular home RO system? All of the above? None of the above? Some of the above?

Appreciate in advance a detailed explanation from technically advanced CF members.
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Old 21-03-2024, 16:13   #4
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Re: water makers

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnmyjo View Post
Does anyone have experience of Whisper 60 modular water maker? by PureWater of Germany.
I have the whisper 60 230volts AC and would like to convert it to 12 volts dc.
Any help and advice will be appreciated.
Thanks John
What size 230v motor do you have? The inrush current needs consideration but using a low frequency inverter would be a better solution. Running large loads off 12v is never straightforward. You need large guage wires and motors always run hot. Finding good 12v motors for high current is never easy.
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Old 22-03-2024, 02:48   #5
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Re: water makers

Whisper 60 modular Guide
User Guide and Installation handbook ➥ http://www.watermaker.de/pdf/manual_en_whisper_60.pdf
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Old 22-03-2024, 05:52   #6
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Re: water makers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Island Time O25 View Post
Since the thread is named "water makers" I will ask what may be perceived as naive (stupid?) question but bear with me.

About 12-15 years ago a now late friend (so I cannot ask him) had put together a DIY home RO system as the water supplied to his home in NH was pretty hard and less than ideal.

Being a project manager in his younger years in E. Europe he thoroughly researched the subject and bought a bunch of RO system parts from a Canadian supplier on e-bay for about $150 plus replacements cartridges for about $30-50. All I recall he mentioned that at the time a similar bunch of parts would cost him $300 to $500 at his local HD.

The system worked flawlessly for many years, until he passed away and his wife not being technically inclined just diverted the line to regular tap and is using a Brita table top filter or some such.

I understand that a home RO system designed to filter out a hard mineral tap water into softer palatable one is not the same as water maker for a boat. But how more involved i.e. complicated and expensive would be RO home system to turn into boat water maker? Is it a matter of more number and more expensive parts? Is it totally different chemical/physical principle than a home RO system? Is it just the manufacturers' hype how difficult it is to put together a DIY boat version compared to a regular home RO system? All of the above? None of the above? Some of the above?

Appreciate in advance a detailed explanation from technically advanced CF members.

The osmotic pressure of seawater is about 26.4 atmospheres, which is 388 psi, so most watermakers run at 800 psi, more or less.


That's a lot of pressure, which requires a robust pressure vessel for the membrane, and a high pressure pump.


The osmotic pressure of hard tap water is so low that you don't need any pump at all.


So these are completely different systems.
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"You sea! I resign myself to you also . . . . I guess what you mean,
I behold from the beach your crooked inviting fingers,
I believe you refuse to go back without feeling of me;
We must have a turn together . . . . I undress . . . . hurry me out of sight of the land,
Cushion me soft . . . . rock me in billowy drowse,
Dash me with amorous wet . . . . I can repay you."
Walt Whitman
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Old 22-03-2024, 10:10   #7
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Re: water makers

If you're looking for a inexpensive water maker there are Youtube videos.
You need to start with a pressure washer pump and motor. You can buy membrane pressure vessels on Alibaba. High pressure hoses and fittings on ebay.

I went thru a lot of stuff building my water maker. Some of the items were no good and didn't last. Especially cheap pumps. Eventually I learned and have a good 40+gph watermaker.

But I would have spent less money and time if I bought a system from CruiseRO.
https://www.cruiserowaterandpower.com/products/
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Old 22-03-2024, 10:57   #8
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Re: water makers

Cruise RO for the win. I’m almost finished with my 40gph install. Very happy with the quality and the personal service is second to none. Rich is very responsive.

The hardest part is just figuring out where all of it will fit.
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Old 22-03-2024, 11:14   #9
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Re: water makers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
The osmotic pressure of seawater is about 26.4 atmospheres, which is 388 psi, so most watermakers run at 800 psi, more or less.


That's a lot of pressure, which requires a robust pressure vessel for the membrane, and a high pressure pump.


The osmotic pressure of hard tap water is so low that you don't need any pump at all.


So these are completely different systems.
Tnx. That's what I was afraid of.
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Old 22-03-2024, 11:31   #10
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Re: water makers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Island Time O25 View Post
Since the thread is named "water makers" I will ask what may be perceived as naive (stupid?) question but bear with me.

About 12-15 years ago a now late friend (so I cannot ask him) had put together a DIY home RO system as the water supplied to his home in NH was pretty hard and less than ideal.

Being a project manager in his younger years in E. Europe he thoroughly researched the subject and bought a bunch of RO system parts from a Canadian supplier on e-bay for about $150 plus replacements cartridges for about $30-50. All I recall he mentioned that at the time a similar bunch of parts would cost him $300 to $500 at his local HD.

The system worked flawlessly for many years, until he passed away and his wife not being technically inclined just diverted the line to regular tap and is using a Brita table top filter or some such.

I understand that a home RO system designed to filter out a hard mineral tap water into softer palatable one is not the same as water maker for a boat. But how more involved i.e. complicated and expensive would be RO home system to turn into boat water maker? Is it a matter of more number and more expensive parts? Is it totally different chemical/physical principle than a home RO system? Is it just the manufacturers' hype how difficult it is to put together a DIY boat version compared to a regular home RO system? All of the above? None of the above? Some of the above?

Appreciate in advance a detailed explanation from technically advanced CF members.
I have had both. It takes much higher pressure and membrane to filter out salt than it does to filter out biologics or iron etc. The home units have no pressure pump at all and work off your normal pressure. I dont think there is really any part of it you can use to make a desalination unit.

OP: My catamaran came with a big 120volt AC watermaker. The electric motor was 1.5HP! the complicated black box seemed to always have a light blinking with some sort of error. I didn't want the Northern Lights gen set weight in the Cat either.
I sold the gen set and converted the AC water maker to engine drive on one of the cat engines.

I had to make an engine bracket and buy an electric clutch for the pressure pump.
I just went for manual control of the water maker. Used a needle valve to set the pressure (keep the engine rpm constant) and made 25 gallons an hour and charged batteries at the same time.
It worked out very well. The unit had a Bronze Cat Pump and 3 short membranes.
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Old 22-03-2024, 17:52   #11
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Re: water makers

Actually when membranes became cheap, fishermen used the home membranes connected to their wash down pump that usually runs all the time. It somehow produced a very small trickle of fresh water. Maybe a few gallons/day. No idea on TDS or salt %, never tried that.
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Old 22-03-2024, 19:54   #12
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Re: water makers

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Originally Posted by Lepke View Post
Actually when membranes became cheap, fishermen used the home membranes connected to their wash down pump that usually runs all the time. It somehow produced a very small trickle of fresh water. Maybe a few gallons/day. No idea on TDS or salt %, never tried that.
I call bs.

The physics do not lie. You need over 400 psi to counteract the osmotic pressure of seawater. Even assuming their wash down pumps could do that, the home membranes would tear to shreds in seconds.
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Old 23-03-2024, 05:03   #13
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Re: water makers

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Originally Posted by Wandering1 View Post
What size 230v motor do you have? The inrush current needs consideration but using a low frequency inverter would be a better solution. Running large loads off 12v is never straightforward. You need large guage wires and motors always run hot. Finding good 12v motors for high current is never easy.
The motor is 230vac 0,55kw 4.30A 50Hz
What size inverter please.
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Old 02-04-2024, 15:04   #14
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Re: water makers

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnmyjo View Post
The motor is 230vac 0,55kw 4.30A 50Hz
What size inverter please.

So the motor is nominally 550 watts. You should oversize the inverter to deal with the inrush current when it starts up. Not less than 1000 watts I think. A Sterling 1000 watt pure sine wave one should do nicely; or 1500 watts.
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"You sea! I resign myself to you also . . . . I guess what you mean,
I behold from the beach your crooked inviting fingers,
I believe you refuse to go back without feeling of me;
We must have a turn together . . . . I undress . . . . hurry me out of sight of the land,
Cushion me soft . . . . rock me in billowy drowse,
Dash me with amorous wet . . . . I can repay you."
Walt Whitman
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Old 02-04-2024, 17:20   #15
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Re: water makers

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Originally Posted by johnmyjo View Post
The motor is 230vac 0,55kw 4.30A 50Hz
What size inverter please.
You need a low frequency inverter that can take 4x the run current. For example, my 2kw AC load of my water maker runs a 3kw low frequency inverter that has a peak short duration of 9kw. It works perfectly. Speak to the inverter tech guys and ask them which model will run your motor
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