Why Vane steering at all?

[RBEmerson]

A minor clarification about the ST-6000+: we use it in all three possible modes, hold heading, hold wind angle, and follow route (typically GPS or laptop chartplotter).

[noelex 77]

Just a note of caution. There are autopilot and autopilots. Don't expect a tiller pilot to steer your boat out in the blue yonder for long they are designed for day sailing in reasonably calm conditions. Wheel pilots are more reliable, but for blue water cruising you really want an under deck autopilot driving the ruder stock.

[haulback]

If you have plans for crossing oceans at some point the best money you will spend will be on self-steering for the boat. Everything else aboard should be further down the list. If you cannot steer a true course, life aboard will not be a lot of fun.

My thoughts go towards having one of each, an autopilot that will steer the boat under any conditions, and a windvane. As with everything else, there are both good and bad examples of each. Do your research and get a good one.

I use my autopilot a lot when coastal cruising locally (British Columbia) but offshore the Fleming 501 does the bulk of the work, except in light-air conditions and when motoring when the pilot does a better job of it.

I sail singlehanded so steering the boat myself simply is not an option.

Jim/Haulback

[RBEmerson]

Comments on adapting tiller pilots to drive wind vanes in light air?

[delmarrey]

Originally Posted by RBEmerson

Comments on adapting tiller pilots to drive wind vanes in light air?

Why would you want to do that?

The power consumption used to run the main tiller (in light air) shouldn't be much more then to an auxiliary rudder. Unless you have a heavy hard to move rudder.

[Cheechako]

I dont know if these are still made but they are superb. Simple non digital technology. Recirculating ball screw aircraft drive ram(no hydraulics) with a quadrant disconnect, so you aren't driving the ram while sailing. My friend has had one for probably 20 years, sailed the south pacific etc... same pilot still going strong. I had two, sold one with the boat, took the second one off one boat and put it on my catamaran. Bulletproof.

[highseas]

Why bother?If you are going to use an autopilot,why not attach to main rudder and be done with it.Except under heavy seas or wind,autopilot should be all you need,otherwise should probably handsteer anyways.I have wheelpilot and will carry spare motor when venturing offshore.

[noelex 77]

Power wise my autohelm 7000 uses about 1.5A in moderate conditions. comparing this with other devices often on when sailing it is not as good as 0 for a windvane, but it doesnt make much of an impact on our offshore electricity budget.

Chartplotter 2.2A
Tricolour light 2A (I have to get an LED one at some stage)
CD player 1.5A
GPS 0.4A
Wind, depth, compass, and log 0.6A
Radar 3.3A

Put another way changing to an LED Tricolour at night would save over ½ the electricity the autohelm conumes in 24 hours.

[roverhi]

I cannot believe an autopilot would only draw 1.5 amps. Maybe if it's not actually steering and just standing by. To actually move the rudder and steer would demand more than 1.5 amps. In rough conditions reaching, the demand would have to be greater, maybe by a factor of 10 or more.

Aloha
Peter O.
Pearson 35

[Nebro]

I would say…Windvanes are not at all Rube Goldberg devices , on the contrary, they are really KISS, at least the good ones..by far more than electrical autopilots
But on normal offshore cruising autopilots are set with a punch to the knob, that’s why folks ( me included) use them so often…and..
Good equipment is very safe, every single part will not break more than Windvanes, there are only much more: Fluxgate, electronic device, electric box for drive motor, clutch, drive, rudder feedback and Windgear..
Their only but heavy disadvantage is power consumption and it is illusory to think about 1,5 A / on 12 V. I understand..24V/1,5 would be much of a difference
So, in a normal offshore passage with equipment, let’s say 400-500 Ah installed, the engine will run every second day
The important thing comes on, when you are in bad conditions and something of your technical Board-Net breaks down, Battery fail, engine does not start, Battery capacity goes down and you become nervous because you do not find the reason, it is dark outside and panic starts…that’s when all goes wrong..
With a windvane, steering line could break and you will find the defect immediately
Our experience...we had both on board for almost more than ten Years, both are well invested money, well they are not cheap but a good windvane model will do second hand without any problems . Count on at least 4 A/12V consumption all included Electronics ,Clutch and Motor.

[RBEmerson]

To clarify, I'm not advocating using a tiller type a/p in the same way a below decks unit might be used, but I've seen a couple of folks who fitted a tiller a/p to their wind vane and seemed to work, at least when the wind packs it in and the wind vane isn't going to work anyway. But I've never had a chance to talk with anyone at length about it. Nonetheless, I can think of people who might be on a budget, already have the wind vane, and want something to steer when the wind quits, but don't want to drop a fortune in the process.

[dana-tenacity]

We've done it, had a wind vane for sailing, but motoring had a pathetic little tiller pilot, but flipped the compass in it and attached it to the counterweight of the vane. Steered perfectly, minimal power draw and the engine was running anyway.
I bought the boat and that was the system I inherited and never had a need to change it.
If I were starting anew and had to prioritise the vane is way ahead of an autopilot - as in top of the list where the autopilot is on page three.

[highseas]

Raymarine specs. say 5 amps when drive motor is running ,200mA standby, for S1 model.Recharging with solar and wind power ,it shouldnt be an issue.Correct me if I'm wrong.If I had the extra $4500. for a good vane ,and some way to mount it over Bimini,(see pic. of boat) I would buy,not too many used ones around.

[roverhi]

I've bought two used vanes. Have seen at least 7 on the market: Aries, WindPilot Pacifc/WPP Plus, Sailomat, Cape Horn, Fleming, Monitor, Navik and probably some others that I can't think of right now. Keep an eye on Craig's list in the major sailing centers and Ebay, there's one kind or another come up about once a month. They are not that rare. I'll be selling either a Sailomat, Windpilot Pacific Plus and/or a Monitor. Haven't decided which two I'm going to sell, price will be $2,000 when I make the decision.

Aloha
Peter O.
Pearson 35

[Stranded Mariner]

Originally Posted by RBEmerson

To clarify, I'm not advocating using a tiller type a/p in the same way a below decks unit might be used, but I've seen a couple of folks who fitted a tiller a/p to their wind vane and seemed to work, at least when the wind packs it in and the wind vane isn't going to work anyway. But I've never had a chance to talk with anyone at length about it. Nonetheless, I can think of people who might be on a budget, already have the wind vane, and want something to steer when the wind quits, but don't want to drop a fortune in the process.

That is what I mentioned in my earlier post. Here's a link to the Scanmar website that covers this subject:
http://www.selfsteer.com/faqs/faq.php?ID=134