Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 01-10-2016, 18:18   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 23
Advice for Hurricane Matthew

I am in North Carolina and am somewhat of a novice with respect to sailboats and small watercraft in general. I have read a few of the previous threads about preparation for heavy weather while docked. I intend to double up lines, lash down the mainsail, put out extra fenders, etc., however, I thought I would ask about advice for a boat tied up on only one side.

The boat is tied up to the dock on one side, the additional pilings on the outboard side of the boat were supposed to be put in this week (fortunately) but the state regulator shot down the placement of the new pilings (unfortunately). I would have to relocate or perform extensive modifications on the existing dock to satisfy the regulator. Anyway, when the wind comes out of the northeast it pushes water in the Pamilco Sound. With tropical storm Hermine (maybe 30 knot winds), the water level rose about 3 feet. Even if Matthew is somewhat off the NC shore, I suspect the water level in the Pamlico Sound will rise even more and the wind will likely to be stronger.

I have a Mantus 25lb. anchor and a lighter Danforth anchor. I was contemplating taking them out with a kayak maybe 25 or 30 feet outboard of the boat and dropping them and try to set them with the sailboat winches. The intent is to try to keep the sailboat from banging up against the dock. Any advice?

Thanks,

Mike
__________________

__________________
Mike_NC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2016, 19:35   #2
Senior Cruiser
 
skipmac's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 29 49.16 N 82 25.82 W
Boat: Pearson 422
Posts: 11,826
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

If Mathew turns slightly to the west you could be in for a hammering so certainly a good idea to start planning ahead.

A few questions.

1. Is the dock fixed or floating? I assume it's fixed.

2. How high is the dock? Cleats on the dock or are their taller pilings where you can drop a loop?

3. How deep is the water and what is the bottom like?

4. What is the fetch (the distance of open water) around your dock?

5. What size boat?

Taking an anchor out to the beam of the boat to hold it off the dock is certainly a good idea. Question is, how bad will it get and would the anchors be enough?

Regarding 2. Will the water get higher than the dock is the issue. Can cause damage to the boat bottom, hole and sink it. Pilings you can set the dock lines higher to compensate some.

Regarding 3. Anchor will hold better in a bottom where it can dig in. If rock or oyster beds it might be hard to get an anchor to set. In this case I would make the line to the anchor at least ten times the depth of the water where the anchor would sit.

4. Waves can be a bigger problem than wind. If your dock faces an area of open water then the waves can get big and cause very strong shock loads on the lines and a lot of chafe. Allow for this in your plans.

5. If your boat is much bigger than 30' I would want something bigger than a 25 lb Mantus in a strong hurricane. If the wind and waves are hitting the side of the boat that will be a lot more force than the normal forces against the bow.

If your dock is really exposed it might be worthwhile considering other options. You might have the boat hauled at a yard or look for a place way up a small creek where you can tie a couple dozen ropes to trees like a spiderweb.
__________________

__________________
The water is always bluer on the other side of the ocean.
skipmac is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2016, 20:22   #3
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 23
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

Thank you for your response skipmac.

1. Is the dock fixed or floating?
The dock is fixed.

2. How high is the dock?
The dock is about almost 4 feet above the water. The dock has short pilings where the boat is presently docked. I can loop lines around these pilings. I can move the boat forward to where a powerboat lift was previously, these pilings are taller and would prevent the boat coming up over the dock. I need to get some tires or something around those pilings though.

3. How deep is the water and what is the bottom like?
Boat has a draft of 3.7' and the water depth on the outboard side is a little over 5'. I would be dropping the anchors in 6' of water or so. The bottom is soft mud.

4. What is the fetch (the distance of open water) around your dock?
Measuring on google maps, the creek is 500 ft across. We are about 1/2 mile up the creek from the Bay River which flows into the Pamlico Sound.

5. What size boat?
27', 7500 lbs

Regarding 2. Will the water get higher than the dock is the issue. Can cause damage to the boat bottom, hole and sink it. Pilings you can set the dock lines higher to compensate some.

Where the boat is tied up, the pilings are short and if the water rises more than 4' the boat would start coming over the dock. I can move the boat to where the pilings are higher but I will have to get some old tires or something for fenders. I have some at my week day house, I'll bring them back on Friday.


Regarding 3. Anchor will hold better in a bottom where it can dig in. If rock or oyster beds it might be hard to get an anchor to set. In this case I would make the line to the anchor at least ten times the depth of the water where the anchor would sit.

I'll put it out as far as I can but I have to cognizant of boat traffic.

4. Waves can be a bigger problem than wind. If your dock faces an area of open water then the waves can get big and cause very strong shock loads on the lines and a lot of chafe. Allow for this in your plans.
I'll see I can find something to put around piling to reduce chaff.

5. If your boat is much bigger than 30' I would want something bigger than a 25 lb Mantus in a strong hurricane. If the wind and waves are hitting the side of the boat that will be a lot more force than the normal forces against the bow.
Boat is 27', I don't have any snubbers but the lines are nylon.

If your dock is really exposed it might be worthwhile considering other options. You might have the boat hauled at a yard or look for a place way up a small creek where you can tie a couple dozen ropes to trees like a spiderweb.
There is a boat yard maybe 10 miles up the river from me. I'll watch the hurricane track, I would have to take off work to move the boat. I'll check with them on Monday, I know they are closed on Sundays.

Thanks again.
__________________
Mike_NC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2016, 20:35   #4
Senior Cruiser
 
skipmac's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 29 49.16 N 82 25.82 W
Boat: Pearson 422
Posts: 11,826
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

1. Is the dock fixed or floating?
The dock is fixed.

Probably much stronger. Good.


2. How high is the dock?
The dock is about almost 4 feet above the water. The dock has short pilings where the boat is presently docked. I can loop lines around these pilings. I can move the boat forward to where a powerboat lift was previously, these pilings are taller and would prevent the boat coming up over the dock. I need to get some tires or something around those pilings though.

An idea. In case the water rises really high, fix the dock lines around the pilings so they can't pull up over the top.

3. How deep is the water and what is the bottom like?
Boat has a draft of 3.7' and the water depth on the outboard side is a little over 5'. I would be dropping the anchors in 6' of water or so. The bottom is soft mud.

4. What is the fetch (the distance of open water) around your dock?
Measuring on google maps, the creek is 500 ft across. We are about 1/2 mile up the creek from the Bay River which flows into the Pamlico Sound.

That small an area you shouldn't have any problem with large waves, unless there is a long straight section of creek facing your dock. If you are around a couple of curves then you should be safe from serious wave action.

5. What size boat?
27', 7500 lbs

The 25 lb Mantus should work to hold you off the dock unless it gets really bad.

Regarding 2. Will the water get higher than the dock is the issue. Can cause damage to the boat bottom, hole and sink it. Pilings you can set the dock lines higher to compensate some.

Where the boat is tied up, the pilings are short and if the water rises more than 4' the boat would start coming over the dock. I can move the boat to where the pilings are higher but I will have to get some old tires or something for fenders. I have some at my week day house, I'll bring them back on Friday.


Regarding 3. Anchor will hold better in a bottom where it can dig in. If rock or oyster beds it might be hard to get an anchor to set. In this case I would make the line to the anchor at least ten times the depth of the water where the anchor would sit.

I'll put it out as far as I can but I have to cognizant of boat traffic.

If you plan to set the anchor in an area 6' deep don't forget when the surge comes in that could be 10-12' or more. If you're concerned about blocking other traffic (very considerate ) you might take the anchor out 100' or so when there's no traffic, winch it in until it sets well, then slack the line so it sits on the bottom (hopefully no currents strong enough to pull it off the bottom) and then tighten the line if the storm hits when no one in their right mind will be out in a boat.

4. Waves can be a bigger problem than wind. If your dock faces an area of open water then the waves can get big and cause very strong shock loads on the lines and a lot of chafe. Allow for this in your plans.
I'll see I can find something to put around piling to reduce chaff.

Also chafing gear around the chocks, toe rail or anywhere on the boat where the line might rub on anything.

5. If your boat is much bigger than 30' I would want something bigger than a 25 lb Mantus in a strong hurricane. If the wind and waves are hitting the side of the boat that will be a lot more force than the normal forces against the bow.
Boat is 27', I don't have any snubbers but the lines are nylon.

Nylon is pretty springy so should work. If it looks bad of course double up on all the lines. Really bad, triple up.

If your dock is really exposed it might be worthwhile considering other options. You might have the boat hauled at a yard or look for a place way up a small creek where you can tie a couple dozen ropes to trees like a spiderweb.
There is a boat yard maybe 10 miles up the river from me. I'll watch the hurricane track, I would have to take off work to move the boat. I'll check with them on Monday, I know they are closed on Sundays.

Thanks again.[/QUOTE]

Good luck.
__________________
The water is always bluer on the other side of the ocean.
skipmac is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2016, 23:07   #5
Sponsoring Vendor
 
HopCar's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2011
Location: Miami Florida
Boat: Ellis Flybridge 28
Posts: 2,972
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

I think you've thought this through pretty well.
I have two comments.

You need to take your anchor further away from the boat. Remember the water will rise. If you set the anchor with only a five to one scope to begin with, it will be a much smaller scope when the water rises.

Don't count on fenders to keep your boat off the dock. Fenders will get out of position. Install rubber bumpers the length of the pileing. Use the tall pileings. I've seen boats impaled on pileings after hurricanes.

During hurricane Andrew, I had set fenders between my boat and the dock. Somehow during the storm the fenders got stuck under the deck of the dock and when the water rose it lifted the deck loose from the pileings. The boat survived, the dock had to be replaced.
__________________
Hopkins-Carter Marine Supplies & Fishing Tackle
What You Need, at the Price You Want...with Service!
HopCar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 01:42   #6
Registered User
 
UNCIVILIZED's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Up the mast, looking for clean wind.
Boat: Currently Shopping, & Heavily in LUST!
Posts: 4,437
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

Since there's a boatyard nearby, I'd suggest having her hauled. And for you personally to make sure that she's well supported & secured against strong winds once she's on the hard.

As to having to take a day off of work to do this, you'd have to take more than one day off in order to sort things out if she fell prey to the storm when tied to the dock, right?
Plus, were it me, I'd want to check on her a few times both before & after the worst of the storm anyway. And also during it, if it's safe to do so. That way I could adjust her lines, add more of them, & check the ones in place for chafe, etc.

Strip everything off of the boat that you can, including the main. As even rigging wires create a lot of force when subjected to high winds. For example, when it's blowing 60kts, 1sqft of area creates 15.5lb of force.
Force = Area (in sqft) x Wind Speed squared (in knots) x 0.00432

You can easily get 10'+ of storm surge (increased water depth) even if the storm only gets within a few hundred miles of you. Which, when coupled with only moderate winds, can make for some substantial waves. As when it's blowing hard, it doesn't take much fetch for large ones to form. With waves in the 2-digit range, height wise, not being uncommon.

Chafe protect your lines everywhere that they touch anything, & everything (except your cleats). Including the sections tied around pilings. Since in heavy weather they're going to move to some no matter how tight you tie them on there.

Some people will even wrap a length of chain tightly around a piling several times, & then connect both ends of the chain together with a shackle, & then shackle a dockline which has an eye splice with a thimble in it, to this. So as to eliminate any possibility off chafe on these dock lines. Especially as the boat will be yanking on them pretty hard.

More anchors are better, & the longer you wait to buy them (or buy more line, chain, & fenders), the harder they will be to find. If you can find them at all. You can't have too much line.

With one side of your boat tied to the dock, you might use one heavy anchor as a breast anchor, & another anchor (or two) set in the direction of the strongest projected winds. Also, it can't hurt to check how well your anchors are set by diving on them.

When you set your anchors, place them far enough out to allow for the increased water depth caused by the storm. Including using sufficient scope so that they'll hold well as the water deepens, & so that there's enough rode to cope with these depth changes. Plus of course, chafe protect such lines heavily. Along with making sure that shackles are safety wired shut, & following other good anchoring practices.

EDIT: This changing water depth is one of the reasons that I'd prefer to be nearby to check & adjust her lines & anchor rodes. Ditto on their chafe protection, as well as the bilge pumps & cockpit drains.

Take everything that you can out of the boat, just in case the worst happens. And to prevent damage to things inside her should she suffer partial flooding due to leaks from heavy rains, & other causes. Particularly as lots of fasteners, fittings, ports, & hatches will be flexing more than they ever have before. Which can create water ingress routes that are vulnerable to heavy rains, & to waves breaking on the boat.

Also double check all of your bilge pumps, to include ensuring that the hoses are clear, & that the switches are working. As well as your batteries being topped off.
And along with this, ensure that your cockpit drains are running freely. Plus you may wish to install some guards around them that prevent debris from getting near the scuppers themselves. As many boats get flooded or sunk when their cockpit drains get clogged by storm debris, & then can't keep up with the heavy rains associated with such storms. As most such storms tend to dump lots of debris in "inconvenient" places, like in cockpits. Thus hindering or stopping things from draining.

If possible, put multiple swatches of reflective SOLAS tape on the boat's topsides just below the hull to deck joint, at several spots, 360 degrees around her perimeter. And also do this on the mast around most of it's circumference, both near the lower spreaders, & up near the masthead as well.

This way, should she break loose, she'll be easier to find. Ditto if she winds up partially submerged. So that one would need to find her via her mast. Especially if she winds up high & dry on a muddy bank, partially hidden by foilage. So that the top of the spar is all that's easily visible.

This is also good a good idea for any & all boats, be they in the path of a major storm or not. As it saved my boat when she decided to try & head to Mexico without me.


PS: BoatUS has plenty of pointers on this. Simply go to their website & type "Hurricane Prep" into the search window.
BoatUS.com Search Results
__________________

The Uncommon Thing, The Hard Thing, The Important Thing (in Life): Making Promises to Yourself, And Keeping Them.
UNCIVILIZED is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 05:54   #7
Senior Cruiser
 
Sailmonkey's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Houston
Boat: '76 Allied Seawind II, 32'
Posts: 5,144
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

I'll reiterate what was said above in regards to sails. Pull them off and store them below. If you've got roller furling, pull the headsail off too. As well as any canvass (Bimini, dodger). You may even go so far as to pull the boom and stow it.


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum
__________________
Sailmonkey is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 07:17   #8
Registered User
 
neilpride's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: in the world
Boat: csy 44 tall rig.
Posts: 3,050
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

Any chance to use a double slip space just for you? could be the best solution , in the middle , far from the docks and spider web set up to the docks....
__________________
neilpride is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 08:36   #9
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 23
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

Thanks for everyone's helpful advice.

I started making some initial preparations today. I am investigating moving the boat to a better protected dock. My real estate agent has a lot for sale with a nice dock. I contacted him to see I can park my boat there. It is in a protected cove and has tall pilings. If the boat goes over those pilings most of the houses in the neighbor would be flooded.

It looks like the most recent track is right over Oriental. I'm going to call the boat yard, too.

Thanks,

Mike
__________________
Mike_NC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 08:43   #10
Sponsoring Vendor
 
HopCar's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2011
Location: Miami Florida
Boat: Ellis Flybridge 28
Posts: 2,972
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

Uncivilized and Sailmonkey brought up something I missed. Take the sails and canvas off. No matter how tight you bind it, a hurricane will destroy exposed fabric. I've seen boats that had left roller furled head sails on during a hurricane and they brought down the whole rig.

Do not plan to check on the boat during hurricane force winds. You will die.
__________________
Hopkins-Carter Marine Supplies & Fishing Tackle
What You Need, at the Price You Want...with Service!
HopCar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 08:52   #11
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 6
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

Try putting springs in front and aft.
__________________
Micron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 09:27   #12
Registered User
 
Cadence's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: SC
Boat: None,build the one shown of glass, had many from 6' to 48'.
Posts: 5,361
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_NC View Post
Thank you for your response skipmac.

1. Is the dock fixed or floating?
The dock is fixed.

2. How high is the dock?
The dock is about almost 4 feet above the water. The dock has short pilings where the boat is presently docked. I can loop lines around these pilings. I can move the boat forward to where a powerboat lift was previously, these pilings are taller and would prevent the boat coming up over the dock. I need to get some tires or something around those pilings though.

3. How deep is the water and what is the bottom like?
Boat has a draft of 3.7' and the water depth on the outboard side is a little over 5'. I would be dropping the anchors in 6' of water or so. The bottom is soft mud.

4. What is the fetch (the distance of open water) around your dock?
Measuring on google maps, the creek is 500 ft across. We are about 1/2 mile up the creek from the Bay River which flows into the Pamlico Sound.

5. What size boat?
27', 7500 lbs

Regarding 2. Will the water get higher than the dock is the issue. Can cause damage to the boat bottom, hole and sink it. Pilings you can set the dock lines higher to compensate some.

Where the boat is tied up, the pilings are short and if the water rises more than 4' the boat would start coming over the dock. I can move the boat to where the pilings are higher but I will have to get some old tires or something for fenders. I have some at my week day house, I'll bring them back on Friday.


Regarding 3. Anchor will hold better in a bottom where it can dig in. If rock or oyster beds it might be hard to get an anchor to set. In this case I would make the line to the anchor at least ten times the depth of the water where the anchor would sit.

I'll put it out as far as I can but I have to cognizant of boat traffic.

4. Waves can be a bigger problem than wind. If your dock faces an area of open water then the waves can get big and cause very strong shock loads on the lines and a lot of chafe. Allow for this in your plans.
I'll see I can find something to put around piling to reduce chaff.

5. If your boat is much bigger than 30' I would want something bigger than a 25 lb Mantus in a strong hurricane. If the wind and waves are hitting the side of the boat that will be a lot more force than the normal forces against the bow.
Boat is 27', I don't have any snubbers but the lines are nylon.

If your dock is really exposed it might be worthwhile considering other options. You might have the boat hauled at a yard or look for a place way up a small creek where you can tie a couple dozen ropes to trees like a spiderweb.
There is a boat yard maybe 10 miles up the river from me. I'll watch the hurricane track, I would have to take off work to move the boat. I'll check with them on Monday, I know they are closed on Sundays.

Thanks again.
I would worry more about storm surge that wind if the dock is only 4' above the water. A small creek with trees may be your best bet.
__________________
Cadence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 09:39   #13
Registered User
 
UNCIVILIZED's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Up the mast, looking for clean wind.
Boat: Currently Shopping, & Heavily in LUST!
Posts: 4,437
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_NC View Post
Thanks for everyone's helpful advice.

I started making some initial preparations today. I am investigating moving the boat to a better protected dock. My real estate agent has a lot for sale with a nice dock. I contacted him to see I can park my boat there. It is in a protected cove and has tall pilings. If the boat goes over those pilings most of the houses in the neighbor would be flooded.

It looks like the most recent track is right over Oriental. I'm going to call the boat yard, too.

Thanks,

Mike
Sometimes it's better not to ask. Either just do things, & later beg forgiveness, or show up & demand.

Now would be one of those times. And few will fault you for it, if at all.
__________________

The Uncommon Thing, The Hard Thing, The Important Thing (in Life): Making Promises to Yourself, And Keeping Them.
UNCIVILIZED is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 09:40   #14
cat herder, extreme blacksheep
 
zeehag's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: furycame alley , tropics, mexico for now
Boat: 1976 FORMOSA yankee clipper 41
Posts: 17,205
Images: 56
Send a message via Yahoo to zeehag Send a message via Skype™ to zeehag
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

as you are not early enough to really haul your boat and place it smartly, so make sure you are well away from dock pilings they WILL hole boat.
use both anchors to kedge away from dock. one forward one aft. mebbe one midships as well, if you have a 3rd anchor to use.
make sure all flying objects and potential flying objects and sails are either removed or lashed well to boat. if you use tarping, lash it down to toe rail with lines over tomake sure it doesnt fly off. yes this works even to 215 mph steady winds gusting 250. btdt.
INSURE!!!!
once boat is ready--get the flock away from it and hide well.
and make sure everyone checks in after this rampage is completed.
zeehag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2016, 09:57   #15
Marine Service Provider

Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 142
Re: Advice for Hurricane Matthew

I live and work in South Florida, and have been through several hurricanes, with the Intracoastal littered with wrecked boats, some of which had smashed into the undersides of bridges. If your boat is in the track of the eye, the only reliable course of action is to have it hauled. Of course, the e storm might fizzle out or change direction, but if you wait until it's a ccertainty, you'll be on a long waiting list of boats to be be hauled. Decisions, decisions.
Good luck
John Mardall
Vetus Maxwell Group
__________________

__________________
JOHNMARDALL is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
hurricane

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Diesel fuel- Matthew Town, Great Inagua Bahamas satirelounge Atlantic & the Caribbean 0 17-04-2015 06:12
Matthew Flinders' Cat BlueSun Families, Kids and Pets Afloat 9 14-05-2012 14:09
Lessons Learned Hurricane Irene- Hurricane Hole Preparation jacob30 Weather | Gear, Reports and Resources 7 21-01-2012 07:51
Western Aleutians Summer 2011 St. Matthew Island n3qq Pacific & South China Sea 0 07-04-2011 07:46
Hurricane advice links GordMay The Library 2 12-08-2004 07:26


Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:11.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.