do you use side lights or tricolor?

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

If your audience is commercial vessels, I guess most will understand.


For everyone else, you're still using the normal deck-level lights.

.....

Doubt it..... most would have never ever seen them before.... I think I have seen them once... maybe twice.... it would be up there with lights shown when minesweeping... do they still have them...? or maybe dredging lights...safe side to pass and all that...

[Ambler]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

I refuse to get drawn back into all this....

However.....

I think 'Red over Green' is the way to go... with sidelights... and AIS Tx.. unless you are on a long sea voyage and power is an issue... in which case go with tricolour and AIS Tx.

That's it... I'm done....

Nice masthead red over green!

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

Doubt it..... most would have never ever seen them before.... I think I have seen them once... maybe twice.... it would be up there with lights shown when minesweeping... do they still have them...? or maybe dredging lights...safe side to pass and all that...

Probably depends on what part of the world you're in, and certainly on the quality of training.


Around here all of the large sailing vessels have red over green. Not a rare sight at all.


In fact, there's a set of them visible from where I'm writing this:

[Cpt Pat]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

Doubt it..... most would have never ever seen them before.... I think I have seen them once... maybe twice.... it would be up there with lights shown when minesweeping... do they still have them...? or maybe dredging lights...safe side to pass and all that...

If the watch stander has a USCG mariner certificate, they had to score at least 90% on the rules-of-the-road exam. So there's a good chance they learned: "red over green, sailing machine."

Now, if it's a US Navy surface vessel, on the other hand... (see https://www.navytimes.com/news/your-...t-you-to-read/).

About three weeks after the ACX Crystal disaster, Fort’s investigators sprang a rules of the road pop quiz on Fitz’s officers.

It didn’t go well. The 22 who took the test averaged a score of 59 percent, Fort wrote.

“Only 3 of 22 Officers achieved a score over 80%,” he added, with seven officers scoring below 50 percent.

My own experience is that some commercial watch standers may interpret red-over-green as meaning: "BIG sailboat," since sailboats over 20 meters can't use a tri-color. But there seems to me to be no harm if, in fact, it's a "little" sailboat instead.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Cpt Pat

...
My own experience is that some commercial watch standers may interpret red-over-green as meaning: "BIG sailboat,"...

Indeed, or sailing SHIP.

Ping, have you not got any sailing ships down there? Quite a lot of them ply these waters, and what a sight they are. All using red over green, in my experience.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

I refuse to get drawn back into all this....

However.....

I think 'Red over Green' is the way to go... with sidelights... and AIS Tx.. unless you are on a long sea voyage and power is an issue... in which case go with tricolour and AIS Tx.

That's it... I'm done....

Red over green can be well seen. Sidelights aid those to sight.

Red over green sailing machine. Red over green, sailing is keen.

Red and Green go between......unless their moving.


The point is to be well seen and to be correctly identified.

Agreed often see sailboats with tricolor and sidelights glowing even when motoring.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by Cpt Pat

If the watch stander has a USCG mariner certificate, they had to score at least 90% on the rules-of-the-road exam. So there's a good chance they learned: "red over green, sailing machine."

And somehow 90% manages to be a passing grade! It's exactly the 10% of the time that one is wrong that probably account for 90+% of the accidents.

[Cpt Pat]

Originally Posted by Montanan

And somehow 90% manages to be a passing grade! It's exactly the 10% of the time that one is wrong that probably account for 90+% of the accidents.

Probably true. But if the instructor followed standards, he/she is supposed to discuss every question missed with the student until the student understands the correct answer. The goal is 100% comprehension. Of course, we're dealing with humans, so it's never perfect.

[conachair]

Question for the ship drivers - how useful to you guys is angood radar return, in a black and white/ this or that world would a good radar return be better than good nav lights? Obviously both in the real world but closer to shore do you guys rely less on radar and more on visual? Or does it not work like that ?
Ta

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Indeed, or sailing SHIP.

Ping, have you not got any sailing ships down there? Quite a lot of them ply these waters, and what a sight they are. All using red over green, in my experience.

Stuff like this below?

I have seen plenty of sailing ships fitted with red over green..... and there are probably as many square rigged sailing ships between Mexico and TdF as the rest of the world put together.

I was speaking of encountering them at sea ...at night.... very rare if you spend your life plodding to and fro across the Pacific or running between Brasil and China or NW Australia to Japan.
Taught in school....yes..... instant recognition ten years on... not so much.

CptPat and Montanan.... under the British system it is 100%.... one mistake and you are out the door.....two mistakes and you will be off to get more seatime....

Here is a quick one.... right ahead....out of the mist... very close ... RWR.... just to the left of it GG.... just to the right RR..... what is it ? what are you going to do.... quick no hesitation ... ?

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by Ambler

Nice masthead red over green!

G'day Wayne,

yep... some bloke I ran into in GH a few years back... golly.... three years already....

Care to share what you have and how you installed them?

Ping

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

Stuff like this below?

I have seen plenty of sailing ships fitted with red over green..... and there are probably as many square rigged sailing ships between Mexico and TdF as the rest of the world put together.

I was speaking of encountering them at sea ...at night.... very rare if you spend your life plodding to and fro across the Pacific or running between Brasil and China or NW Australia to Japan.
Taught in school....yes..... instant recognition ten years on... not so much.

CptPat and Montanan.... under the British system it is 100%.... one mistake and you are out the door.....two mistakes and you will be off to get more seatime....

Here is a quick one.... right ahead....out of the mist... very close ... RWR.... just to the left of it GG.... just to the right RR..... what is it ? what are you going to do.... quick no hesitation ... ?

Simple, when I see anything out of the mist and very close, I avoid it which is what I do without hesitation. Then when the situation was discerned to be safe, I'd go pull out my cheat sheet to figure out what I just saw but if I was indeed very close I should be able to have determined what "it" was.

And I would be grateful that I was not my father or nephew who were and are red green color blind, as is a significant portion of the population, such that they could not discern a distinction between red and green. Makes it fun when they would approach a flashing traffic light as they can't tell if it is flashing red [stop] or flashing yellow [proceed with caution]; further challenge happens if they can't see whether the illuminated light is at the top or the bottom of the traffic light because the only way they can determine if they have the right of way to proceed is based on the positioning of the illuminated light. [Sideways mounted traffic lights really become confusing.] Reference images below.

No different then the order of action when flying. 1) Aviate, 2)navigate, 3) communicate.

Okay I'm not sure what you are are describing by: "RWR.... just to the left of it GG.... just to the right RR..... ? "

Do you mean lights horizontally set as?

GG . . . RWR . . . RR

So please advise as to what is being signaled as such.

[StuM]

>RWR.... just to the left of it GG.... just to the right RR


If each of the three sets are vertical:

Pass to the left because that dredger is saying that's the safe side.

[markpierce]

We use sidelights. That was how the boat was equipped, and masthead lights "bounce" around a lot more. Those lights on most recreational vehicles aren't so bright that a masthead light has little advantage for range. An effective radar reflector or a steel boat are a great advantage for being noticed.

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Simple, when I see anything out of the mist and very close, I avoid it which is what I do without hesitation. Then when the situation was discerned to be safe, I'd go pull out my cheat sheet to figure out what I just saw but if I was indeed very close I should be able to have determined what "it" was.

And I would be grateful that I was not my father or nephew who were and are red green color blind, as is a significant portion of the population, such that they could not discern a distinction between red and green. Makes it fun when they would approach a flashing traffic light as they can't tell if it is flashing red [stop] or flashing yellow [proceed with caution]; further challenge happens if they can't see whether the illuminated light is at the top or the bottom of the traffic light because the only way they can determine if they have the right of way to proceed is based on the positioning of the illuminated light. [Sideways mounted traffic lights really become confusing.] Reference images below.

No different then the order of action when flying. 1) Aviate, 2)navigate, 3) communicate.

Okay I'm not sure what you are are describing by: "RWR.... just to the left of it GG.... just to the right RR..... ? "

Do you mean lights horizontally set as?

GG . . . RWR . . . RR

So please advise as to what is being signaled as such.

Green over green etc.... ie vertical.... sorry bout that....
Q not directed at you personaly but at general readership.... failure to answer correctly on the instant would see you failing 2nd mate's Orals....