Anybody Fight CA over Hailing Port/Tax BS?

[brantleychuck]

This happened to me 8 years ago. My situation was I lived in California. But bought boat in Florida and kept boat n Florida. Boats hailing port was key west. Some how Cali got wind of it. It took a couple of phone calls and some paperwork and was resolved on the phone as I asked the tax lady to go to my website, yes the boat is in Florida and it would take a very large trailer to get it to California or a damm long trip by sea. It is frustrating with California coming up with more taxes and fees every year, we will leave at some point. The writing is on the wall. Chuck

[xymotic]

Originally Posted by brantleychuck

This happened to me 8 years ago. My situation was I lived in California. But bought boat in Florida and kept boat n Florida. Boats hailing port was key west. Some how Cali got wind of it. It took a couple of phone calls and some paperwork and was resolved on the phone as I asked the tax lady to go to my website, yes the boat is in Florida and it would take a very large trailer to get it to California or a damm long trip by sea. It is frustrating with California coming up with more taxes and fees every year, we will leave at some point. The writing is on the wall. Chuck

I wonder how they sussed you out? They go through USCG looking for CA mailing addresses!?! I mean it is really obscene; how would any of us feel if Canada sent us a letter demanding sales tax on the food we bought in a us state? Would you calmly and politely send them a notarized copy of 3 years or your sewer bill to explain where the food went?

[Stu Jackson]

Originally Posted by xymotic

You're not wrong.

I woulda thought when I wrote Nananana! there might be some clue to a immature Don Quixote part of my personality?

I'm just wondering how far they could actually take it before a judge gets involved?

I've explained it to them Three times
Once with a signed oath
That should be enough but not only do they think I'm a tax evader they are also calling me a liar while simultaneously being incredibly inefficient and wasteful; Sure I "could" resolve this except a) I actually doubt that a notarized copy of three years invoices and receipts will be enough and B) THEY could just as easily ask their counterparts in WA if Sales tax was paid here couldn't they?

Why do we sheeple put up with a state sending out 100000 pieces of mail when one email would suffice?

And the worst part of all of this is that I HATE libertarians! I'm as left wing liberal as they get and this crap ticks me off! I'm not Cliven Bundy over here

Interesting. Much more information now. Thanks for filling in the gaps.

[DotDun]

Originally Posted by MarkSF

"It's common knowledge that USCG hailing port has nothing to do with vessel location"

No, that's a common misapprehension.

The spirit of the law, at least, is that the hailing port is..... the port the boat hails from. IE, where the boat is based.

I'll repost what I posted in #15:

The hailing port is not restricted to where the owner lives or where the vessel is moored. Under new marking regulations, the hailing port can be any recognized place listed in the U.S. Department of Commerce Publication 55DC. This includes all listed places in the United States or its territories.

FAQs

You believe this information is wrong???

[xymotic]

Originally Posted by DotDun

Believe it or not, there are plenty of lawyers that will take a case like this pro-bono.

Yeah find me that lawyer and I'll send you a finder's fee I've had WAY better cases than this that were 'too much trouble' and the lawyer wouldn;t even take my money!

I remember co-workers being chased by CA for 'value on stock options'. The options were granted while they resided in CA, but exercised while living in another state. CA claimed the options gained value while they lived in CA, hence they owed CA tax. This is pure BS, as stock option grants are of zero value until exercised....

See I have no problem with that as long as in 2008 when all those stocks crashed CA sent refund checks to retroactively pay back all those income taxes they (over)collected for 30 years... But they don't do they!?

I'm just tired of being bullied by seemingly everyone all the time - I did leave CA largely because of Tax BS and I lost my ass when I moved there in the second great depression. Just when you think you're free they pull you back in!

[BOATDOCTOR]

Under penalty of purgery and threat of vessel siezure, you have told the Federal Government (via USCG, whose job it is to enforce federal maritime regulations) that your boat "resides" in California . There is cooperative agreement between each of the states and USCG for the disclosure of Documentation information as it pertains to their specific registration codes. So, the Federal Government, on your behalf, told California that you have sworn under law that your boat resides there and is undervtheir jurisdiction. So, you can either fess up to the Coast Guard that this is not the case and risk losing your vessel for lying to them, or suck it up and pay before California tells them you committed purgery on your forms, and makes a complaint that will at minimum lose you your documentation.I for one, actually read the associated codes and laws to extent before documenting the vessel we're on now. Guess you didn't?

[xymotic]

Originally Posted by DotDun

I'll repost what I posted in #15:



FAQs

You believe this information is wrong???

Thanks for that; that's the most specific thing I've seen to date; it's the first time I've seen anything that says an "actual place" in a list somewhere.

But I mean "can be ANY" is pretty darn clear

It's not even "should be close to current location's commonly accepted name"

[DotDun]

Originally Posted by BOATDOCTOR

Under penalty of purgery and threat of vessel siezure, you have told the Federal Government (via USCG, whose job it is to enforce federal maritime regulations) that your boat "resides" in California . There is cooperative agreement between each of the states and USCG for the disclosure of Documentation information as it pertains to their specific registration codes. So, the Federal Government, on your behalf, told California that you have sworn under law that your boat resides there and is undervtheir jurisdiction. So, you can either fess up to the Coast Guard that this is not the case and risk losing your vessel for lying to them, or suck it up and pay before California tells them you committed purgery on your forms, and makes a complaint that will at minimum lose you your documentation.I for one, actually read the associated codes and laws to extent before documenting the vessel we're on now. Guess you didn't?

Please read post #15 & #64. Follow the link provided, then explain to us how a firm with 30 years experience in vessel documentation is wrong.

[xymotic]

Originally Posted by BOATDOCTOR

Under penalty of purgery and threat of vessel siezure, you have told the Federal Government (via USCG, whose job it is to enforce federal maritime regulations) that your boat "resides" in California . There is cooperative agreement between each of the states and USCG for the disclosure of Documentation information as it pertains to their specific registration codes. So, the Federal Government, on your behalf, told California that you have sworn under law that your boat resides there and is undervtheir jurisdiction. So, you can either fess up to the Coast Guard that this is not the case and risk losing your vessel for lying to them, or suck it up and pay before California tells them you committed purgery on your forms, and makes a complaint that will at minimum lose you your documentation.I for one, actually read the associated codes and laws to extent before documenting the vessel we're on now. Guess you didn't?

I did no such thing! "hailing port can be anywhere"

****NO WHERE***** in regulation or law does hailing port say it needs to be current; or even accurate;

You say you've read the code so what's the code you are referring to? That's the whole point of this thread; is there ANYTHING federally or in CA or WA law that gives them this authority?

PLENTY of people keep the PO's hailing port because they don't want to repaint the transom!!!

It's a bit of a stretch to say I swore to a judge with my arm held high that my boat is moored in an INLAND CITY IN CA that has NO BODIES OF WATER IN IT!!!!!!!!! But even if I did; how is that taxable?

[DumnMad]

Write a report to CA treasury documenting this instance as typical of how public tax is wasted. These officials are just looking for jobs to fill in their idle time and at the same time create inefficiencies in the economy.
Treasury is the only govt department that is detached enough to look into trimming staff numbers. The rest see large numbers of staff and piles of paperwork as a sign of how important they are.

[Chenega]

Wow! Give them the info they need and go sailing! A little work, less stress, and move on. The only guarantees in life are death and taxes - tell them what they need to know and be done.
- sail on... Life is too short.

[xymotic]

Originally Posted by DumnMad

Write a report to CA treasury documenting this instance as typical of how public tax is wasted. These officials are just looking for jobs to fill in their idle time and at the same time create inefficiencies in the economy.
Treasury is the only govt department that is detached enough to look into trimming staff numbers. The rest see large numbers of staff and piles of paperwork as a sign of how important they are.

Originally Posted by Chenega

Wow! Give them the info they need and go sailing! A little work, less stress, and move on. The only guarantees in life are death and taxes - tell them what they need to know and be done.
- sail on... Life is too short.

Um; I actually have done that three times now; AND they are not entitled to the information they have requested in the first place AND it's public record or at least available to them with a phone call

AND the boat is YEARS away from sailing I'm just observing their idiocy and waste of money It would be unpatriotic as an American to just acquiesce IMO I'm mad as hell and I'm not gonna take it anymore


Neaner-Neaner dammit!

[sailr69]

I have my boat documented and I remember that you have two choices for hailing port; one choice is where the boat is actually moored and the other choice is where the document papers are, or where there were filed. in my case, the boat is moored in Michigan and the documentation papers are filed in the 9th naval district which is Cleveland Ohio. therefor I have Cleveland Ohio as my hailing port. wherever home is now, the boat hailing port is legal

[xymotic]

Originally Posted by DumnMad

Write a report to CA treasury documenting this instance as typical of how public tax is wasted. These officials are just looking for jobs to fill in their idle time and at the same time create inefficiencies in the economy.
Treasury is the only govt department that is detached enough to look into trimming staff numbers. The rest see large numbers of staff and piles of paperwork as a sign of how important they are.

Well in all seriousness; wasting time whining on the internet instead of actually working on the boat is one thing; but if I were to write a letter to anyone; it would be to the WA DMV or Tax board or AG and ask them to intervene to protect their citizens from abuse of a foreign government

[Stu Jackson]

Question: You originally said "use" tax. IIRC, CA has sales tax and property tax. No "user" tax. Could you clarify, please?