Winch refurbishing

[AiniA]

I am getting my chrome Lewmar winches rechromed after 33 years. My question is what can I do to the black anodized self-tailing part and the plastic disk on top? Both of these are very oxidized looking although functionally sound.

Thanks for your ideas

[model 10]

Get the anodized part re-anodized and buy a new plastic part?

[l2ridehd]

Follow this procedure for the rebuild, your already getting new chrome, and try wiping the anodized parts lightly with Acetone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZr_NuCmB64

[AiniA]

I will try the acetone. Don't particularly want to go to anodizing but may have to. I have lots of experience taking the winches apart and putting them back together. My rule is to only take one apart at a time. Then I have the other one for a model. I have ten winches to do ranging from 42s to 65s. Lots of work ahead of me.

[Jim Cate]

When you talk to the chrome platers, be sure to tell them NOT to polish the drum surfaces. The PO of our boat had the beaut Barient chrome/bronze winches re-done, but the buggers polished off all the knurling, leaving a lovely mirror finish... which is so slippery that the winches didn't work until I abraded them with some 60 grit.

Jim

[UNCIVILIZED]

Originally Posted by AiniA

I will try the acetone. Don't particularly want to go to anodizing but may have to. I have lots of experience taking the winches apart and putting them back together. My rule is to only take one apart at a time. Then I have the other one for a model. I have ten winches to do ranging from 42s to 65s. Lots of work ahead of me.

There are some tough coatings out there for metals. Both DIY, & Professional type. But pretty much none will match good anodizing. Done right, it's so hard that it'll dull most tools. As it's a man made, super enhanced version of the protective oxide layer which naturally forms on Aluminum anyway.
Though putting onto parts (at least bare ones) is far from rocket science.

A tip: Avoid machining & finishing shops which cater to the "Marine" market, if you can. As their markup's rediculious over regular shops... who can do the same job.

Also... the tolerances of the part (when anodized to spec), so that it fits & works properly with it's mates, were setup for certain dimensions. Ones that coatings may cause you troubles with.
Plus some finishes, like Powder Coating, may/will, screw up the strength properties of the base metal, such as Aluminum, due to the heat involved inn the process. Though it can't hurt to ask them about both things.

As to drum knurling, I feel for you Jim. But that said, there are a few guys around who specialize in re-knurling worn down drums. At least one of whom is a regular over on SA.
That, or if you're having your drums re-finished, be they aluminum or bronze, you could have somebody with a CNC mill, carve you some beautiful knurling patterns in them. Or, if you have a steady hand, & a pair which clank, you could do the pattern etching yourself, with a Dremel or similar.
Prior to having the new finish put on them of course.

PS: Is your Anodizing, or the actual Aluminum, actually breaking down? If not, & re-anodizing has you spooked, you could just try a light dusting of Krylon.
It's not as if getting them re-anodized later is a big deal, if that doesn't work out.

[OBXSkipper]

In this day and age, use your iphone to record a video or photos of the dis-assembly then when you put it back together you don't have any of those extra parts laying on deck when you're done.

[Delancey]

The type of anodizing you are looking for is called hardcoat. I had an anodizer I used for architectural projects who used to do it on M-16 rifle magazines as well as pizza pans for a frozen pizza factory. It is an addative process unlike normal anodizing so you can increase part thickness, something the anodizer can advise you about.

It's a great finish, very hard and abrasion resistant. The normal color for it is a bronze-grey color but it can also be dyed black.

[UNCIVILIZED]

Originally Posted by Delancey

The type of anodizing you are looking for is called hardcoat. I had an anodizer I used for architectural projects who used to do it on M-16 rifle magazines as well as pizza pans for a frozen pizza factory. It is an addative process unlike normal anodizing so you can increase part thickness, something the anodizer can advise you about.
This part I'm well familar with - the increasing part thickness thing.

It's a great finish, very hard and abrasion resistant. The normal color for it is a bronze-grey color but it can also be dyed black.

Delancey,
Concerning this info. I'm a touch confused. I know that there are a variety of spec's (types) of anodizing, & that some (especially high end, MilSpec variants, such as Type III) are just shy of a diamond, hardness wise. But that also, you can literally get anodizing done in any color of the rainbow.
Could you be kind enough to clarify on type(s) & specifications please.
And in the meantime, it's time for some Anodizing home schooling it would seem.

[Delancey]

Couple links below, a wikipedia page and a DIY anodizing page. I did some home brew anodizing in an art school chemistry class and have worked with a couple of anodizers professionally but am in no way an expert.

Basically it is an electro chemical process that converts the metal surface into a stable oxide that can be used as a finish itself or as a surface prep for subsequent painting or bonding. Anyone who has seen paint flaking off of aluminum will understand what an unstable surface oxide is.

Regarding specifications, there are many types of metals that can be anodized, but it is most commonly used as a finish for aluminum, and specs vary by alloy but generally have to do with the thickness of the coating as well as the type of sealer used.

Typically with aluminum anodizing prep includes an acid etch bath that will remove material from the surface and too much time in the acid etch can remove a significant amount of material so this aspect needs to be controlled with regards to tolerances of finished parts. Hardcoat anodizing is unique in that it actually builds material so again and issues with tolerances that needs to be noted.

The prep process leaves behind a micro-porous surface which in aluminum is where the color part comes in and is achieved by dyeing and is then followed by the sealer, which is in part where a large part of the corrosion resistance comes from. Dyes and sealers vary in cost and quality mainly having to do with color fastness and durability.

Colors similar to what are recognized as anodizing colors can be produced in titanium by varying the voltage used. Because it can be hard to consistently control the appearance of the dyed finish many aluminum products such as aluminum bicycle frames are actually painted to simulate the appearance of colored anodizing.

Anodizing fun fact - anodized aluminum surfaces are electrically non-conductive!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anodizing

Aluminum Anodizing at home - DIY aluminium Anodising

[UNCIVILIZED]

Originally Posted by Delancey

Couple links below, a wikipedia page and a DIY anodizing page. I did some home brew anodizing in an art school chemistry class and have worked with a couple of anodizers professionally but am in no way an expert.

Basically it is an electro chemical process that converts the metal surface into a stable oxide that can be used as a finish itself or as a surface prep for subsequent painting or bonding. Anyone who has seen paint flaking off of aluminum will understand what an unstable surface oxide is.

Regarding specifications, there are many types of metals that can be anodized, but it is most commonly used as a finish for aluminum, and specs vary by alloy but generally have to do with the thickness of the coating as well as the type of sealer used.

Typically with aluminum anodizing prep includes an acid etch bath that will remove material from the surface and too much time in the acid etch can remove a significant amount of material so this aspect needs to be controlled with regards to tolerances of finished parts. Hardcoat anodizing is unique in that it actually builds material so again and issues with tolerances that needs to be noted.

The prep process leaves behind a micro-porous surface which in aluminum is where the color part comes in and is achieved by dyeing and is then followed by the sealer, which is in part where a large part of the corrosion resistance comes from. Dyes and sealers vary in cost and quality mainly having to do with color fastness and durability.

Colors similar to what are recognized as anodizing colors can be produced in titanium by varying the voltage used. Because it can be hard to consistently control the appearance of the dyed finish many aluminum products such as aluminum bicycle frames are actually painted to simulate the appearance of colored anodizing.

The above stuff I knew. In addition to the fact that sometimes surfaces are prepped by other methods. For example, tightly controlled media blasting, in order to keep/"machine" the parts so that they're within proper spec, both pre & postr andoizing. Albeit, with a few other steps thrown in there as well.

I had a friend for quite a while, who did in house anodizing on most of the stuff made by his company. And he'd do smaller items for me, pretty much on request. But sadly, his tank wasn't big enough for many of the yachting projects which I've worked on over the years.

Also, there are lots of newer, higher tech, "electro mechanical coatings" (for lack of better terms), which are light years beyond anodizing for some applications. Most of them having pricetags to match their perks.

[ramblinrod]

Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED

Delancey,
Concerning this info. I'm a touch confused. I know that there are a variety of spec's (types) of anodizing, & that some (especially high end, MilSpec variants, such as Type III) are just shy of a diamond, hardness wise. But that also, you can literally get anodizing done in any color of the rainbow.
Could you be kind enough to clarify on type(s) & specifications please.
And in the meantime, it's time for some Anodizing home schooling it would seem.

It is true that anodizing is available in a variety of colours, but I learned the hard way, that alloys of common cast aluminum, turn out a muddy brown, regardless of colour tried. Whereas many aluminum alloy machined billets can be anodized a variety of colours.

RamblinRod
About Sheen Marine

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by AiniA

I will try the acetone. Don't particularly want to go to anodizing but may have to. I have lots of experience taking the winches apart and putting them back together. My rule is to only take one apart at a time. Then I have the other one for a model. I have ten winches to do ranging from 42s to 65s. Lots of work ahead of me.

Depending on the plastic, acetone can attack it. Just use Armor-all on the plastic and live with it.
As far as re-chroming. Be careful the chromer know what he's doing. A bumper type chromer may not be knowledgeable (smart) enough to not chrome gear teeth and bearing surfaces.

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by Delancey

It's a great finish, very hard and abrasion resistant. The normal color for it is a bronze-grey color but it can also be dyed black.

Depends on the type of Al. They all take on a different hue. Some can even look pinkish.

[Delancey]

Can't say I've ever seen a pinkish colored hardcoat but agreed different alloys can produce different colors. For example the alloys used for casting will turn black when anodized.

My Isomat rig has cast bases for the spreader bases which are welded to the mast, as such Isomat supplied black anodized spreaders so this is not as obvious.

Also, when welding the kind of 6000 series alloys commonly used for extrusions (6061 T6 and 6063 H32) a specific 5000 series filler for must be used (can't remember the exact one) or else the welds will turn black when anodized.

Something to be aware of if you have someone custom fabricate something for you that you want to have anodized. If you work with a fabricator who is not familiar with anodizing do the research so you can specify the right filler.