Propane Bottles

[delmarrey]

Originally Posted by cal40john

I've read in a couple of places that you should transport your tanks in their normal upright position. The only explanation I've seen has to do with if the tank gets overpressured you will be venting liquid propane instead of gas propane. You would vent a lot more propane in the liquid phase before you brought the pressure back down to where it closed again.

John

True!
But using common sense is the key. On a hot day one should be more vigilant in transport the bottle in any position. Those w/o common sense are on a road to trouble to start with and shouldn't be doing anything that represents a danger. Keep'm out of direct sun light and car trunks. Mine goes right behind the passenger seat.

A lot of rules are made up to protect the stupid! And even though, some things can never be idiot proofed. One has to watch out for the other guy. In the old days the idiots usually died off before they could hurt anyone else. Now they are protected by the politically correct, like an endangered species.

[cal40john]

Originally Posted by Sailmonkey

I have never seen a tank vent from heat before. But I have also never been in the Sahara.

Summer before last got my tank filled in the San Juans, probably overfilled. I motored away from the fuel dock with the tank on the aft deck to go to the transient dock. By the time I was tied up my tank was venting. Combination of sitting in the sun and being overfilled was the probable cause. San Juans at 48 north ain't the Sahara.

Since transporting usually occurs in your car, and cars can get hotter than the Sahara maybe not an unreasonable precaution.

John

[propellanttech]

Originally Posted by Pblais

We also use a fiber tank and I doubt I could even spend more than 2 months in Alabama.

Funny, when I was in the military, away from Alabama, I thought I was smart. I came back and was instant genius.

It is sad......I was actually born here, but these people do make me wonder if I'm actually from here.

Everyday, I'm working to cruise away, and never look back.

James L

[delmarrey]

Originally Posted by cal40john

Since transporting usually occurs in your car, and cars can get hotter than the Sahara maybe not an unreasonable precaution.

John

Would a person get into a car that hot? Neither should one put or leave a bottle in a car. If it were that hot the air-con would be on for me. Even diving tanks blow up in hot car trunks.

[propellanttech]

I know a few posts ago someone state the tanks are legal in all states.......for use I'm am totally sure. I am not however sure you can fill them in every state.

I have done a bunch of research (online), and only come to the conclusion the APGA (Alabama Propane Gas Association) may have ruled the tanks non-fill able. Now, I'm not sure......and can't find any documentation to state that.

The incident did happen over three years ago, and I haven't since talked to any propane dealers about the composite tanks.

If anyone really needs me to, I can call some of the local propane dealers and ask.

I would advise, just steering clear of Alabama (read, sail on by), your probably better off.

James L

[cal40john]

Originally Posted by delmarrey

True!
But using common sense is the key. On a hot day one should be more vigilant in transport the bottle in any position. Those w/o common sense are on a road to trouble to start with and shouldn't be doing anything that represents a danger. Keep'm out of direct sun light and car trunks. Mine goes right behind the passenger seat.

A lot of rules are made up to protect the stupid! And even though, some things can never be idiot proofed. One has to watch out for the other guy. In the old days the idiots usually died off before they could hurt anyone else. Now they are protected by the politically correct, like an endangered species.

Don't have a problem with that attitude to a degree. I have a friend (you've met I believe), that complains alot about people not having common sense. His wife points out that his common sense is a lifetime of building, troubleshooting, etc electro-mechanical things. If all that someone wants to know about propane is a reasonable set of safety rules to memorize, are they still idiots?

John

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by cal40john

This says it's hard to BLEVE a propane tank, but possible if you heat it enough that the gas pressure rises faster than the gas escapes out of the overpressure valve.
...

The show "Myth Busters" did an episode on this once. They had a very hard time getting a steel propane tank to explode. In fact, they were unsuccessful on a properly functioning tank...burnt it, shot it, etc and no blow. As I recall, they finally disabled the pressure relief valve and got it to blow.

[delmarrey]

Originally Posted by cal40john

If all that someone wants to know about propane is a reasonable set of safety rules to memorize, are they still idiots?

John

Sorry if I seem a bit aggressive but here are the DOT rules and I don't see anything about which position a propane bottle is to be transported.

http://www.propanesafety.com/uploade...03-26-2009.pdf (Paragraph 2)

[sabray]

Can I drift please? A few odd experiences I found. One station attendant commented it was good I arrived when I did because... It was dusk and they are not allowed to fill tanks and use the lighting.
Second best attendant wouldn't fill my tanks because of the valves. The superior came out and said it was okay because they were used on a boat. No idea. My aluminum ranks are in great shape. I always worry that someone is going to not fill my tank. I have the old style tank valve with a small vent fitting square head vent fitting. Horizontal tanks.

[propellanttech]

Originally Posted by cal40john

Don't have a problem with that attitude to a degree. I have a friend (you've met I believe), that complains alot about people not having common sense. His wife points out that his common sense is a lifetime of building, troubleshooting, etc electro-mechanical things. If all that someone wants to know about propane is a reasonable set of safety rules to memorize, are they still idiots?

John

I like points like this, it gives me a chance to rant.......

My issue with this point:

Any person can do something irresponsible, or dumb. It is their post actions which prove or disprove their idiocy.

If they blame everyone but themselves for the incident, they are an idiot. Americans in general want to point the finger at someone else instead of taking the responsibility for their lack of understanding or their stupidity.

A reasonable responsible person will investigate the information on safe and non-safe operation for most things they deal with. When something happens that is bad, they find out they didn't know all they needed to know. It is no ones fault but theirs due to the lack of determination. They accept the situation based on their lack of understanding, and chalk it up to a learning experience they will remember.

An irresponsible person will blame everyone he can for his lack of information, and cause another warning label for hot coffee (Warning: Contents may be hot!).

Not every situation is this cut and dry. Most are, and it is a extreme irritation to me to see it happen day in and day out in the U.S. causing yet another piece of red tape in the legal machinery.

Somethings are not easy for the technical writers to consider. The hair dryer is a 120 volt electrical appliance. They would never think of someone still in the bath tub using it for anything. So why in the world would they put that warning on it.

So, you see, it's not as easy as you want to make it. Simple rules are great for simple situations, but not so much for complicated situations.

Rant over.........sorry

James L

[Sailmonkey]

Originally Posted by cal40john

Since transporting usually occurs in your car, and cars can get hotter than the Sahara maybe not an unreasonable precaution.

John

I'll admit, I've never owned a car.....I always stick to small toyota trucks. I have never had to share a compartment with a fuel

[delmarrey]

It does seem independent companies do encourage shipping upright but no mention of bottles that dispense horizontally. I think the worry is about the thing rolling around and hitting the valve or falling causing other damage.

Transporting Cylinders - Propane bottles are usually transported in the back of a truck and more often than not, they are unsecured and free to roll around. Transporting unsupported bottles exposes them to potential damage such as dents and possible harm to the valve. Ensure that cylinders are secured prior to transporting them. In the case of a 20 pound or 30 pound bottle, a milk crate can be used to keep cylinders upright and protected from most damaging effects of transportation.

http://www.apollopropane.com/pdf/Tra...eCylinders.pdf
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