TD Power Marine, Chinese Marine Diesel Engine

[pagu]

Originally Posted by Teknav

Hiya Pagu! Thank you for sharing your experience with Chinese-built diesel engines! Would you buy again, Chinese-built engines? As a US Engineer, I have yet to find a reason to, but I'd like to hear your unbiased opinion. While it's one person's opinion, I will keep an open mind. Take care!

Mauritz
Simplicity and elegance through engineering.

A very good question and I'm considering carefully my reply and in all I’d have to say yes.

Now that may seem odd after my experience I’ve shared in this thread so I’ll explain.

My location here in the Solomon Islands and the boats I wanted to power present a different set of needs. Mainly as I expressed in a previous post; the boats are rough and ready, the environment and conditions are hard on equipment and I didn't want to put a lot of money powering a rough old hull that may well end on the reef (as if to illustrate that point; I’m writing this from a location where only a couple of hundred meters from me right now is a brand new, or what was a new beautiful Japanese built 30+ meter long fiberglass pole and line tuna fishing boat now wrecked hung vertically on the reef. It was destroyed soon after her arrival accidently driven up on the hard when the local helmsman missed the passage). My point is that **** happens here ….. a lot. So for me, I didn’t want to spend a bunch of money and I was at first shopping for reconditioned or rebuilt second hand engines. I’m explaining this so you have an idea of the things influencing my decision. You can’t walk into a dealership here in the Solomon Islands and buy a marine engine. Nobody sells them! Well actually that’s not true, there is a Yanmar dealer and he has one only 30 HP model for USD 25,000. When I spoke to him about the guy said has been in the store several years and he regretted it. There just isn’t the economy for that kind of market. So what ever I bought was going to be imported which makes backup complicated no matter what the make.

Back though to cost, and obviously anyone looking at these engines, cost is going be the major factor influencing their interest. Now obviously if the engines don’t work, need to installed and then removed, stooged about with etc. it quickly ceases to be cheap! But if they can do the job, well there’s no doubt they are good value. If I compare to buying and importing used ……… of course not much guarantee on a reconditioned engine bought from abroad and I’m still paying double the price +
I bought two engines and the one that didn’t seize is running well – touch wood. Time will tell of course after some long use and endurance, but I’ve put about 150 hrs on it now over 3 months, so it gets used and so far so good (written with hand firmly gripping wooden writing desk)

lifeofreilly57 comments are very insightful and certainly make sense when I consider again my own experience. After market is not what I’m accustomed to in say Australian market. It is buyer beware and in my experience and also backed up by conversation I had with a European dealer I made contact with, don’t expect to get these out of the box plug in the hoses and all good. Things need to thoroughly checked and perhaps hoses replaced or as in may cas, just a simple rubber hose kinked caused an engine to sieze. So there’s some local knowledge involved and certainly I’ve had a steep learning curve.

I think and I hope though that the core of these engines might be OK. I don’t compare to the top Western and Japanese manufacturers and trying to make that comparison is of course silly. The Yanmar model I mentioned for 25K, I had the Chinese engine here for 3K. If I bought the Yanmar I’d damn well expect 22K better engine than the Chinese! Some of the faith I put in making the purchase was speaking with people who’d owned Chinese made diesel engines for irrigation pumping. All said they were rough and ready but in the end ran and ran and ran ……. I got in contact with an importer in Australia buying 80 industrial engines a month from this company and on selling those in Australia where there are high consumer expectations, and he sang their praise, these are factors that influenced my decision too.

So, in answering your question, I would buy again. I would buy again for the boats I have here in the Solomon Islands. For other scenarios where there is more choice and other factors my decision might be different.

In summary I’d politely suggest to any interested buyer that you are taking a bit of a punt. Check the engine very carefully when breaking it in and be prepared to change the hoses to better quality (something hard to do here in the Sols where buying a simple garden hose hard enough!) go into these engines with an open mind.

I hope this info/experience is useful.

[Teknav]

Thanks Pagu! I appreciate you being candid about your logistics and circumstances. I now fully understand your situation. Have a great day!

Mauritz
Simplicity and elegance through engineering.

[Delfin]

Sounds like a good solution for you, and as long as one is prepared for the unknowns that may cause problems that you can't see perhaps a Chinese engine can make sense if you don't want to spend the $ for a first world engine.

That Yanmar dealer is very optimistic on his pricing, since a marinized 30 hp Beta can be had for under $9k and the Solomon Islands has no duty on diesel engines, although it would probably cost $1,000 to ship it there.

[pagu]

Originally Posted by Teknav

Thanks Pagu! I appreciate you being candid about your logistics and circumstances. I now fully understand your situation. Have a great day!

Mauritz
Simplicity and elegance through engineering.

Thanks very much and you clearly appreciate quality engineering so I respect your perspective.

[pagu]

Originally Posted by Delfin

Sounds like a good solution for you, and as long as one is prepared for the unknowns that may cause problems that you can't see perhaps a Chinese engine can make sense if you don't want to spend the $ for a first world engine.

That Yanmar dealer is very optimistic on his pricing, since a marinized 30 hp Beta can be had for under $9k and the Solomon Islands has no duty on diesel engines, although it would probably cost $1,000 to ship it there.

Yes, I'd have to agree that does appear very optimistic pricing. That is fairly common here (Solomon Islands) with monopoly businesses/dealerships. For example the engine staple is the humble rugged and dependable Yamaha 2 stroke OBM and there is one dealer who screws the market with poor service and crazy prices, and without competition he can. The local consumers know little else.

My understanding/experience from I was importing engine here is there is duty on diesel engines, but not spark ignition under 30HP. I paid duty when importing the Chinese engines, though obviously less because of their relatively low sales price. I think from memory the taxes amounted to around 25%-30%.

In the case of the Yanmar, if I bought a Yanmar in Australia and importer here, I'd imagine I'd void warranty and back-up because of tight rules about dealers crossing territories. For example I previously had an old Yanmar engine in one of these boats and needed get spare impeller. Yanmar dealers in Australia couldn't sell to me. Only local agent, who after I placed order and paid bought it in Australia, imported and on-sold to me. Price was literally 3 times more. So back to the same complication of warranty and back up. No simple solution.

I'm an expact here with access to an income, so pretty easy really for me. The locals though who are generally broke get a pretty hard time as consumers, but they know little else and are generally unaware of this. Tough place the developing world.

[Delfin]

Originally Posted by pagu

Yes, I'd have to agree that does appear very optimistic pricing. That is fairly common here (Solomon Islands) with monopoly businesses/dealerships. For example the engine staple is the humble rugged and dependable Yamaha 2 stroke OBM and there is one dealer who screws the market with poor service and crazy prices, and without competition he can. The local consumers know little else.

My understanding/experience from I was importing engine here is there is duty on diesel engines, but not spark ignition under 30HP. I paid duty when importing the Chinese engines, though obviously less because of their relatively low sales price. I think from memory the taxes amounted to around 25%-30%.

In the case of the Yanmar, if I bought a Yanmar in Australia and importer here, I'd imagine I'd void warranty and back-up because of tight rules about dealers crossing territories. For example I previously had an old Yanmar engine in one of these boats and needed get spare impeller. Yanmar dealers in Australia couldn't sell to me. Only local agent, who after I placed order and paid bought it in Australia, imported and on-sold to me. Price was literally 3 times more. So back to the same complication of warranty and back up. No simple solution.

I'm an expact here with access to an income, so pretty easy really for me. The locals though who are generally broke get a pretty hard time as consumers, but they know little else and are generally unaware of this. Tough place the developing world.

There are no duties on diesel engines imported into the Solomons.

http://www.commerce.gov.sb/Divisions...%20Excises.pdf

[pagu]

Originally Posted by Delfin

There are no duties on diesel engines imported into the Solomons.

http://www.commerce.gov.sb/Divisions...%20Excises.pdf

Interesting, but I suspect that form, if it ever was accurate is now out of date.

I forwarded to a mate who works in this area and he replied.

'The only engines under duty free are OBM. Tax pmt still apply though.'

[Jim Cate]

A comment: While I'm not sure that I would buy a Chinese engine, the above mentioned Yanmar marketing practices are one of the reasons that I would never buy a Yanni.

Cheers,

Jim

[pagu]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

A comment: While I'm not sure that I would buy a Chinese engine, the above mentioned Yanmar marketing practices are one of the reasons that I would never buy a Yanni.

Cheers,

Jim

I would!

One of the boats I repowered came with a 24HP Yanmar 2LM.



I've no idea how old the engine was or it's history or hours, but I figure was probably installed in the 1980s, the vintage of that model, and believe me it would have had a hard life here in the Solomon Islands working for a fishing company with many different drivers! The engine and boat had been sitting idle for about 8 years when I bought them. After a bit of minor coaxing, we get the engine going and I used it for the better part of a year. Not trouble free, we were always having to tinker with something, but pretty standard minor things dirty fuel lines, starter motor, blocked cooling. Eventually I inadvertently snapped off a bolt holding an injector and a problem developed in the gear box. My point is that given the work and maltreatment that engine would have endured before I inherited it - that's an extraordinary testimony to the durability of Yanmar engines in my opinion.

My comments re Yanmar in previous posts were meant just as an example of the only engine that I was aware of for sale off shelf in this country. In my opinion, Yanmar are a top quality engine. I'd trust one for sure!

[pagu]

The manufacturer has supplied a replacement set of bearings and couriered them to me FOC.

[Kiwi303]

Originally Posted by pagu

The manufacturer has supplied a replacement set of bearings and couriered them to me FOC.

That fits my experiences with chinese suppliers, you never get money back or such, but a better price on the next buy or some accessories included free to sweeten the deal and make up for the problems of the first deal, that happens quite often. It's just a different business culture.

[squintal]

Hello All.
I've read everything with interest about this topic, mainly because I found it AFTER having placed an order for one of these tdme-490
58Hp Inboard Marine Diesel Engine - Product Group1 - Product Catalog - YANGDONG CO.,LTD.

I had a few months of back and forth with the sales person, as well as finding a referral in Australia. Everything seemed fine. I do have the worry about overall quality, and now I know what to try and look for when it comes in in the next week.

The project I am doing is repowering a 24' sea skiff halvorson, 1961. And after some very exhaustive searches for reco diesels around aus, I wasn't able to find one that would fit her engine bay - most older reco diesels are quite tall, and the skiff only has about 730mm max height. The tdme and their more powerful 85-120hp models were a perfect size.

Time will tell if they run long enough, but will be grateful for any further tips if anyone has them

I believe the base or copy that tdme are on are kubotu, and or Nissan, depending on variant.

Blue skies.

SQ

[ACUARIO]

Originally Posted by pagu

Sorry I did miss your previous post warning about these engines.

The word I've had back from the factory is that the kinked rubber hose installation to the oil breather is standard. I find that hard to believe as this caused massive oil loss on both the engines I bought so if standard I can't imagine that I'm the only person in the world to have encountered this problem.

I'd be curious to hear from others who have bought these engines, or have experience with them, if the kinked rubber hose is standard? Did your engines, or the ones you have experience with in Louisiana come with that installation?

Hi, Pagu

I am spanish TDME-385 owner. I tell my bad experience. My engine ran for 90 hours and:

- at 11 hours of runnig, oil pump of gearbox break off. I emailed to chinese sealer and he send me a new oil pump (free), but shipping costs were about 200 euros. In addition mi holydays were lost.

-Now (with 90 hours), it leaks oil by the seal crank (a lot, 1/4 litre per hour). I am waiting for seal crank to replace the one old and can´t use the sailboat.

My sump pump, came from sump by a metal tube, and after connect with a rubber tube, but it is different to connection that I see on your picture. When I back to sailboat, I will take a picture for you.

Please, do you have any parts drawing of engine?

Regards

[GordMay]

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, ACUARIO.

[Davey1000]

Originally Posted by pagu

Yes, I'd have to agree that does appear very optimistic pricing. That is fairly common here (Solomon Islands) with monopoly businesses/dealerships. For example the engine staple is the humble rugged and dependable Yamaha 2 stroke OBM and there is one dealer who screws the market with poor service and crazy prices, and without competition he can. The local consumers know little else.

My understanding/experience from I was importing engine here is there is duty on diesel engines, but not spark ignition under 30HP. I paid duty when importing the Chinese engines, though obviously less because of their relatively low sales price. I think from memory the taxes amounted to around 25%-30%.

In the case of the Yanmar, if I bought a Yanmar in Australia and importer here, I'd imagine I'd void warranty and back-up because of tight rules about dealers crossing territories. For example I previously had an old Yanmar engine in one of these boats and needed get spare impeller. Yanmar dealers in Australia couldn't sell to me. Only local agent, who after I placed order and paid bought it in Australia, imported and on-sold to me. Price was literally 3 times more. So back to the same complication of warranty and back up. No simple solution.

I'm an expact here with access to an income, so pretty easy really for me. The locals though who are generally broke get a pretty hard time as consumers, but they know little else and are generally unaware of this. Tough place the developing world.

Regarding Yanmar guarantees. An old colleague now a blue water sailor, bought a brand new Yanmar 1GM10 several years ago in Trinidad. After he had installed it himself he had to get the Yanmar agent/engineer to come on the first sea trial. What they worry about is the engine being over-propped and making black smoke. It HAS to be able to reach its maximum rpm without black smoke to get the guarantee.

That boat is long gone and the "new" one has got the unbeatable Perkins 4.108 Forget the rest as that engine was used in Bedford vans, road compressors, ice-cream vans to run the freezer and a great many other applications. One slight problem is the rear crankshaft seal which is the classical rope type. Sometimes it leaks slightly but spares are available worldwide.

As to weird oddball diesel engines. In the UK, Bryco at Daimler Road can supply spares for almost everything. They can even get crankshafts for the BMW D7 which was based on Hatz. Good luck!