Hunter 450 Passage...A World Cruiser?

[xxuxx]

This boat is certified CE A-Ocean. Hull has kevlar stringers. Should I???

Could I????

[MarkJ]

We have been on a Hunter 47... I think it was a 47... somewhere in the Pacific and the owners had been having a great cruising life.

They were doing the tropical circumnavigation, like most circumnavigators, and not the 3 capes of fear, cold and big waves.

The boat was quite luxurious... the Yanks do make soft coushions for their fat bums. (Is this a go at a nationality? )

Comfort is a pretty high priority on our list.

Mark

[barnakiel]

Kevlar or no kevlar CE-A or Z won't help much.

Probably have a close look, sail her, read up the specs carefully. Then jump, or not.

b.

[Euro Cruiser]

The EU's Recreational Craft Directive (RCD) that creates the A thru E classification system was drafted up by a Committee well populated with boat manufacturers, a process that has been likened to inviting the foxes to help design the hen house. An 'A' rating is one (partial) demonstration of suitability for extended ocean sailing but keep in mind it doesn't e.g. stipulate safety or suitability in seas over 4m (~13'). Capable ocean sailing boats may not have an A rating for reasons ranging from the builder not seeking it from the EU (lack of ability to support sales there) to details such as the boat has LPG hose delivering propane to the stove rather than copper tubing. Bottom line: Don't hang your hat exclusively on that rating.

I don't know how Hunter is building this particular boat but one thing you might want to look at is the immense above-waterline volume of the hull/deck structure vs. the location of the boat's CG and the hull volume below the waterline. It's pretty rare to find boats that handle a variety of offshore conditions well with that kind of distribution. I recall several of the participants in the last Blue Water Rally (a 22 month circumnavigation rally, from Gib to Gib) commenting about the Hunter 40-ish footer in their rally struggling with some of the conditions they faced for this reason). That issue would be the first one I'd put to bed...

Jack

[Anders]

Originally Posted by Euro Cruiser

An 'A' rating is one (partial) demonstration of suitability for extended ocean sailing but keep in mind it doesn't e.g. stipulate safety or suitability in seas over 4m (~13').

That is a misunderstanding since class A is for waves exceeding 4 meters and wind exceeding F8.

Originally Posted by Euro Cruiser

Capable ocean sailing boats may not have an A rating for reasons ranging from the builder not seeking it from the EU

The builders don't have to seek any rating from the EU. They have to design the boat according to RCD and in many cases the design has to be verified by a third party.

Originally Posted by Euro Cruiser

to details such as the boat has LPG hose delivering propane to the stove rather than copper tubing.

I can't imagine that there is any boat builder today that would use hose all the way from the LPG tank to the stove. Is there any such boat builders?

[Euro Cruiser]

Thanks for the clarification, Anders. What I was trying to say - but didn't - is that a 'rating' that says the boat is suitable for any sea conditions above 4m seas is over-promising.

I don't think I said ratings come from the EU. The RCD 'created' the rating system (well, the Committee established by the EU that drafted the RCD) and it is that system to which mfgrs. choose to build - or not.

Yes, copper tubing is in fact not routinely used by some builders. As one example, a Spanish chap that bought an Island Packet direct from the USA (vs. joining a 2-year waiting list with his local Spanish dealer) mentioned that changing out the propane system (tubing for hose) was one of the changes forced on him by the Spanish inspectors.

Jack

[barnakiel]

Well,

Not to criticize things, but I have seen Category A boats, brand new from the shop, that I would not dare to sail across the ocean.

Sort of like someone out there in the EU government thought a boat crosses an ocean just once ...

Probably OK from some manufacturers' point of view. Much less so from a serious cruisers' perspective.

b.

[Anders]

Originally Posted by Euro Cruiser

Thanks for the clarification, Anders. What I was trying to say - but didn't - is that a 'rating' that says the boat is suitable for any sea conditions above 4m seas is over-promising.

I agree but class A excludes "abnormal conditions" but I don't think they define what abnormal conditions is.

Originally Posted by Euro Cruiser

Yes, copper tubing is in fact not routinely used by some builders. As one example, a Spanish chap that bought an Island Packet direct from the USA (vs. joining a 2-year waiting list with his local Spanish dealer) mentioned that changing out the propane system (tubing for hose) was one of the changes forced on him by the Spanish inspectors.
Jack

There should not be any need for him to do anything since Island Packet states "Every Island Packet model built since the introduction of these CE standards complies with and is certified to the highest rating available, Category A-Ocean."
Island Packet Yachts

[Weyalan]

Originally Posted by xxuxx

This boat is certified CE A-Ocean. Hull has kevlar stringers. Should I???

Could I????

This may sound harsh, but this is one of those questions where if you need to ask the question, then the answer is no.

You can sail around the world in pretty much anything. The limiting factor is not the boat, the boat design, or the boat manufacture, but the sailor. If you understand the limitations of your boat and the limitations of your sailing ability then you can sail around the world in almost any boat. If you don't then there isn't a boat in the world that is good enough.

[jdoe71]

And the problem with high quality propane hose properly run and supported is what compared to copper pipe that will corrode away in a salt marine environment?

[Bash]

I have the aft-cockpit version of that same hull. They were built like tanks. And it wasn't just the stringers that were kevlar reinforced--it's also the entire bow and the keel joint. Indeed, there's kevlar reinforcement all the way from bow to stern running down the centerline of the boat. Whatever problems you might have, they won't be with stiffness.

[Sailmonkey]

FWIW, I've sailed a passage 42 offshore GOM. While the ride was less than spectacular in steep confused seas, the boat is more capable than the crew.......
My biggest complaint about the boat is the huge salon. I'm not tall, and cannot reach the handholds on the roof, nor am I able to brace on anything on the other side of the boat a good 12 feet away. There is only one good seaberth on the 42 also.....keeps everyone else sleeping on the sole next to the huge queen in the aft master.