Conyplex Corporation Contest 33

[TheKurp]

Those just aren't cracks in the gelcoat in the second image. In some spots the cracks go all the way through and the overlapping GRP can be removed by simply flicking it with your fingers.

After removing the port lights as well as the thru hulls I can tell you that the layup is definitely not 1/2 thick. More like 1/4 or 3/8 . This would also explain the flexing on the deck (not cored) - especially on the port side parallel to the head.

I'm still mulling over ideas for the deck to hull joint repair. The one that appears to be winning is applying epoxy to the entire length of the joint. As you've mentioned, the top portion overlaps the hull which required the "step" in the rail you speak of. I hadn't considered that Conyplex would fashion and send me rails on a boat built 44 years ago. I imagine that will cost me a pretty penny. One idea I'm tossing around is to temporarily mount a thin (perhaps 1/8 inch thick) slat of wood horizontally along the entire hull (about 1 inch below the joint) and then apply epoxy, feathering in the top while building up below the joint to the thickness of the slat. Then, once the slat is removed, this would give me the "step", or a flat surface to mount new rails without having to worry about milling them.

Whatever way I choose to go with, I won't make the mistake the previous owner(s) did by applying caulk/sealant to the bottom edge of the rail. I'm convinced that this is what led to water getting trapped behind the rail (no where to escape once the water penetrated from the top of the rail) and caused the damage to the GRP and deck to hull joint.

[Sandero]

Milling the material is not a big deal... I can email you some drawings of several approaches I have contemplated

I suggest that if you get the teak... get material which is rectangular perhaps 1.25" x 2.5" +/- x 12' lengths (6)

You can saw or router our the step.

I would use a lap joint of at least 6".

Apply butyl tape and screw the teak down

put the fore and aft pieces on to the hull. VERY carefully measure the last one which will have two laps to screw and glue to the already placed fore and aft pieces.

If the center is a tad large (OK) screw down the two ends... the center will bulge a bit... and then screw from the center to the bow and stern. This wood will be pulled in perfectly and the joint will be tight.

Screws need to be counter sunk FL flush. Mark all the screw locations on the hull or a piece of tape above the new rail. DON'T space the screws to fall under the ss trim attachment screws.

Now use a router with a radius bit to round over the square rub rail. Sand and then screw the ss trim.

You need some way to hold up the long teak and ss trim when you screw them down... a helper works...

I think the joint can never be sealed from the outside.... but I would caulk or try to epoxy the show box joint nevertheless.

You're done! Well done!

[w1651]

Originally Posted by Sandero

.

Apply butyl tape and screw the teak down

put the fore and aft pieces on to the hull. VERY carefully measure the last one which will have two laps to screw and glue to the already placed fore and aft pieces.
!

What Glue would you recommend for the lap joint Sandero? I was thinking it needs to be able to take wet and oily as teak has oil in it to bond well.

[w1651]

Well I am back from the doldrums per say. I have been extremely busy getting the head on the old girl in shape. To summerize I pulled her and put her on the hard for 2 weeks in April of 2014. I replaced all sea cocks a thru hull, pulled the locked up engine, scraped, sanded and painted the bottom, replaced worn pivot, bushing, and bracket at the rudder, and replaced the prop with a three bladed prop instead of two blades.
In 2015 I added a electric drive and batteries, rewired the salon and added drain piping for the bilge pump exiting out the old exhaust port that wasn't used anymore at the stern.
2016 I have added davits of the transom, and solar panel mountings, I put on two 24 volt 250 watt panels and a tristar 45 controller to charge the 48 volt battery bank.(still needs some tweeking)
I also just got done with adding A new holding tank and toilet in the head. I plumbed it in with pvc pipe 1 1/2 inch a y valve and anti siphon valve above the water line. I bought a deck plate to pump it out and also installed a whale gusher sanitation pump to pump it when off shore. I sanded and varnished the cabinets, painted the head and floor and have a new led light for it so you can see in there at night and day. two light colors red and white.
Pictures are here, https://www.flickr.com/photos/penneys__auto/ if yo want to check it out. It's a ten gallon tank I mounted against the hull behind the toilet. I am making a curtain for the piping and tank to get it out of sight. I made oak brackets and fiber glassed them to the hull and reinforced them so it won't fall.
Let me know how to add a small sink if you have any ides on how and where I can put it. I am thinking about a stainless bowl that flips down from the cabinet via piano hinge and board. I will drain it right out the toilet supply thru hull.


https://www.flickr.com/photos/penneys__auto/

[mitiempo]

Looks interesting. A lot of pvc pipe there.

Too bad you could not have installed the tank above the waterline. That way the Gusher wouldn't be needed as it would gravity drain offshore. If the inlet to the holding tank is at the top an anti-siphon is not needed either.

Are the inlet and outlet halfway up the side of the tank?

[mitiempo]

This is the photo I should have posted.



It makers no sense to have the inlet halfway down the side of the tank - I think that is how you have it. It has to be at the top of the tank.

This is what I described in my last post.



It is the simplest head/holding tank system of all. Here is a link to a full description: Legal and Simple: Installing an MSD - Chuck Kanter, AMS

Also, you need an anti-siphon between the toilet pump and the back of the bowl - without it the bowl can easily overflow sinking the boat if the seacock is left open.

[HopCar]

Mitiempo, your drawing shows a gravity drain for the tank but you show a pump in the photos. Were you not able to mount your tank above the waterline?

I prefer that the hose from the toilet to the tank slope down to the tank. This usually means that the tank is at least partially below the waterline and requires a pump to empty it. Both methods have trade offs. Both are good ways to do it.

If the installation is per your drawing you won't need a siphon break in the supply hose. The rim of the bowl is well above the waterline, and air can get in the rim acting as a siphon break. If the bowl were below the heeled waterline, a siphon break mounted above the waterline would be a good idea. You are correct in that the supply side siphon break should go between the pump and bowl.

[mitiempo]

The photos are not mine. They are W1651's. The drawing is a rough one showing the simplest system. W1651's head is below the waterline at least when heeled. His inlet is wrong - it is halfway down the tank side. He has created a system that is both wrong and much too complicated.

The tank inlet can slope down if the tank is above the waterline.

The system in the drawing describes both my system and Nigel Calder's. It is very simple and works well. The inlet is on the top of the tank.

[w1651]

Mitiempo you are right. I ordered a tank from a tank company and they screwed up the placement of the two inlets so I couldn't use it. I was going for a gravity system up until that happened. In the mean time I had this tank.
I mounted it at an angle against the hull,so I can get five to seven gallons in the tank before pumping and it is mounted just below or at the water line.
I have two different ways to go as far as tankage now. I can go directly into the tank when pumping head. or I can go directly into the water through the main discharge sea cock which is hardly seen in the pics I just have to turn the y valve mounted below the cabinets above the water line. And I can pump the tank two ways as well.The hand pump is for when it is heeled out off shore and to manually pump out the tank.The pump out goes up through the cabinet above to the deck. I can either go to a pump out or go off shore and use the hand pump that claims to pump 14 gallons a minute.
But your right I need a different tank. I will splice the drain to the head sink into the supply when I figure out the way to mount it in the head, but the tank is just below or just above the water line. When full it will be above as long as there is no heavy heeling going on. I need another fresh water tank on the starboard side of my boat now to compensate for the weight in this one.

Thanks for your input it's a work in progress as so much aboard my boat is.

P.S. The PVC is because I keep reading a lot on here about smell. I think PVC is a lot harder for it to get through and I used black rubber couplers as you can see to help absord shock, stress, and the normal bending and twisting at sea of a boat.

[mitiempo]

Nothing wrong with pvc - there is too much of it though. The simplest way is to pump straight from the head to the top of the tank - no "Y' valve needed. A T at the tank bottom - one side leading to the through hull, the other side to a deck pump-out. "Y" valves are not necessary at all. Close the through hull for deck pumpout.

[w1651]

When I gat another tank I will and I will have gravity on my side.

[mitiempo]

Why don't you build a tank with plywood and epoxy. It's easy to do. There is a good article about this from Good Old Boat, but the pdf is too large to post. You can access it here in the files section of the Albin Vega group on Yahoo.

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/AlbinVega/files

You will have to join but it is easy to do. Worth reading.

It is titled "GOB Head Rebuild.pdf"

[Captain Manny]

Hello everyone,
I just registered as a member, but having read in this forum for quite some time, when I was looking for a sailboat to purchase, because advices here are always great and from experienced boaters.
Now I got one, six weeks ago and it's a 1972 Contest 33 Hull #78.
I know, you guys talked about the Contest 33, 5 or 6 years ago, but now the boat is new to me, I just want to make sure I didn't buy a lemon.
I like the Contest 33, because she has a solid hull and deck, and her behavior in choppy waters is just fine. I sailed one long time ago.
To make a long story short, when I was in the process of the purchase, hurricane IRMA was just around the corner and only a couple of days away and the boat was still on the mooring in Miami.
While checking the boat with the previous owner, he told me that all boats have water in the bilge. That's what I found out on this Contest as well. Water in the bilge and oil. Engine oil. I accepted all that, made the purchase anyway and thought by myself, that I'm going to fix everything, what spills liquids into the bilge.
First thing I did, I cleaned and dried the bilge. Still on the mooring ball, the bilge stayed dry after a week, but a little compartment, actually the second towards the bow, had a little water and.... I thought it would be sand from the beach, not uncommon here, but when I touched it, it had a slimy consistency.
In the mean time I got this blog-post from Dick Zaal (Contest designer for modifications), where he is explaining the encapsulated keel of the Contest 33, how it's build and what needs to be done to improve and make it watertight.
One thing is left. The encapsulated keel, is really encapsulated from all sides.
Please see the picture, where the red arrow shows a cracked line, where floor joists are laminated to the hull. Out of this crack is coming salt water and that slimy brown stuff.
My question: Does anybody made the same experience to get water into the boat from the encapsulated keel?
Can anybody tell me, where this slimy brown stuff is coming from and what it actually is?
There is work on the hull scheduled, where the keel and the underwater hull gets new fiberglass and epoxy. My concern is, that I can't ignore the water in the encapsulation as this might make it impossible that the new fiberglass and epoxy will make a decent connection and stick.
I thought about drilling holes into the encapsulation, then flush with fresh water and dry it with a hot Vac.
BUT - I will not do a thing, before I know exactly what I'm doing.
That's where I hope you guys are coming into play, because I've always read great advice in this forum and hope, I can get the same for my case now.
Thank you all in advance.

[eeeasy]

Contest 33 is very solid ship as I own one and have done extensive restorations to her. It is not possible for any problem with the way the keel was laminated unto the hull to cause leaking as the hull of the boat is separate from it and attached later. Even if the keel fell off, which it won't, the boat would float (maybe upside down but still float). The fiberglass tabbing of the stringers to hull in the picture is not the best part of the boat, it is a common trouble and a simple fix. The brown stuff in your bilge looks to me to be oil unrelated to the delamination of the hull to stringer tabs. Upon close survey of the bottom the keel to hull joint on my boat was visible to me and there was some poor fillers in the job. Not really a structural problem I ground them out and filled with fresh polyester and glass mat. Better than new for next 43 years.

[w1651]

Okay this may be a long explanation. My boat hull #106 has a cement keel. Under the whit paint in your pic should be cement and possably metal keel. There are no bolts because as you wrote the keel is encapsulated entirely with fiberglass. My first question is have you checked the thru hulls carefully especially in the head? If I am seeing this correctly it is to port on your boat according to the picture. My thru Hulls were leaking around the gkts they used in the 70's and I had to reseal them with 5200. Also check them closely as they have a liner inside the hull where the water can seep in and drip down under it along the hull.
If that is all good then the keel itself as I said is encapsulated and there is an issue where it meets the hull under the water line. Earlier in this thread it is addressed. They encapsulated then fiberglass the keel to the hull. Along the seem where the two meet is where Dick Zaal said there could be a problem. He said they use a filler that comes out or goes away over time and needs to be refilled. I used a simple putty made from resin and powder to do it when I pulled her two years ago. If you look back a few pages in this thread the posts are there from Dick Zaal as well as the link to the site with the info.
You really need to pull her out on the hard to do it right and fix what ever the problem is. Also some one put screws into the hull on mine to hold a scupper over the thru hull in the bilge itself. Don't do that and if it is done remove it and seal the holes. Mine had a pinhole leak after all the work I had done to her. Best of luck and if you need some more info feel free to write me. I will help all I can. These are great old boats.