Cold Moulded Boats Illustrated Guide

[UNCIVILIZED]

Originally Posted by foufou

At the same period that "hot" molding was going on there were cold molding glues in use that produced good hulls if carefully used. They were resorcinol, aerolite, and sometimes weldwood. These glues did not have gap filling properties of epoxy but were high strength. I have owned and built small cold molded boats and can attest to their strength, stiffness and durability

This is part of why I mentioned Endangered Species, as she was built sans epoxy, since her builder is allergic to it IIRC. These glues are plenty strong, but they don't encapsulate or saturate the wood, as does epoxy. So in addition to needing to do much better joiner work when building things with them, you have to be more judicious about preventing rot in the wood.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED

This is part of why I mentioned Endangered Species, as she was built sans epoxy, since her builder is allergic to it IIRC. These glues are plenty strong, but they don't encapsulate or saturate the wood, as does epoxy. So in addition to needing to do much better joiner work when building things with them, you have to be more judicious about preventing rot in the wood.

The epoxy sensitivity is a real hazard to folks who build big modern timber boats. Gary Macaulay, the chap who built Insatiable II, being kinda young and immortal when he did so failed to take adequate countermeasures and became highly sensitive to epoxies. simply could not work with any quantities of them, so when he built the replacement boat he was forced to work in foam and vinylester, which he hated. His (and my) view of doing either cold mould or strip plank without the benefits of epoxy encapsulation mean too much worry about all the traditional risks of timber boats, things like worm and dry rot, even though the alternative adhesives are strong enough.

That boat, a Ray Beal design, is a beauty, but it lacks the ambiance of our timber hull. Only time will tell if it is as long lived...



Jim

[Snowpetrel]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

The epoxy sensitivity is a real hazard to folks who build big modern timber boats.

Yep, its got me bad too.. I can't work with the stuff now without it messing me up pretty badly.

Full face mask and tyvek suit to even sand fully cured stuff now. Be carefull with epoxy. Its nasty nasty stuff, pure BPA, and a very bad endocrine disruptor. Unfortunately its a critical part of messing with boats these days. Its very hard to find alternative ways of doing things. Be careful!

[Steadman Uhlich]

Originally Posted by Snowpetrel

Yep, its got me bad too.. I can't work with the stuff now without it messing me up pretty badly.

Full face mask and tyvek suit to even sand fully cured stuff now. Be carefull with epoxy. Its nasty nasty stuff, pure BPA, and a very bad endocrine disruptor. Unfortunately its a critical part of messing with boats these days. Its very hard to find alternative ways of doing things. Be careful!

What are the effects? Please describe.

[Delancey]

The most widely recognized effect is contact dermatitis. I have a friend who became sensitized, ended his career. And yes even exposure to fully cured sanding dust would set him off. I got some mixed epoxy in my eye once, knock wood never became sensitied.

I have read that fair skinned and fair haired people are more susceptible but don't know but don't know if there is data to support it.

Supposedly you could drink a gallon of the resin, it's the hardner you have to watch out for. Epoxy systems tend to be classed by their mixing ratio of hardener to resin 1:1, 1:2, and so on. The lower ratio ones tend to be more benign but unfortunately tend to not have as good physical properties.

[Snowpetrel]

^^ the worst pysical symptom is my eyes get very puffy, too much exposure and I can't see or focus properly. I couldn't drive home one day, kept having to pull over and rinse out my eyes.

My skin also itches badly from any dust contact. Even after clothes have been repeatedly washed I can't wear them without itching starting again. I had to throw out a bunch of work gear. Fortunately it doesn't result in any rashes yet, but I dont think thats too far off. My grandfather also had bad reactions, he couldn't go into a room with wet epoxy or he broke out in a rash, so maybe there is a genetic disposition to it?

The worst effects for me are the way it completely shatters me mentally, with a deep fatique, headaches and lack of energy for days afterwards. It took me a while to realise it was the epoxy that caused it, but now the link is pretty obvious.

Just the smell of wet epoxy now is enough to start triggering reactions. A lot of the new research on epoxies long term effects are rather worrisome, especially considering how prevalent these chemicals are in our diets.

[Steadman Uhlich]

DELANCEY and SNOWPETREL,

Thanks for providing the photos and description of the effects or symptoms. I was not aware and what you describe does seem important to be aware of for anyone mixing or working with epoxy.
Thanks!

[Steadman Uhlich]

Here is something I think fans of Cold Moulded boats will enjoy seeing.

It is NOT Cold Moulding. It is HOT Moulding.

This archive video or newsreel shows the production of the Firefly dinghy at the Fairey Marine plant in the UK back in the 1950s. It does a very good job of explaining the process, very quickly. http://youtu.be/X6hgRQuvg60

Notice the "rubber vacuum bag" (not sure what else to call it, though vacuum may not have been used) and use of the large autoclave (oven) to heat set and conform the strips of wood to the hull mould.

I enjoyed watching this and hope you will too. If so, post a comment with what you learned from it or observations.

Fairey was also the manufacturer of other notable wood boats such as the Fairey ATALANTA (more on that later).

https://youtu.be/X6hgRQuvg60

Unfortunately I cannot understand why when I copy a Youtube link using my ipad, that it does not embed here on CF with a viewer here, and only posts the link. ???? IF anyone knows what I am missing or doing wrong or can suggest how to copy the link from Youtube, while viewing using the Youtube app on an ipad, such that it DOES embed the viewer here on CF, please let me know (a PM is OK). NOTE: I am using the Youtube APP and I simply click or touch on the "share/link" button on the app to copy the URL to the video. But, when I paste that into my post here on CF, only the link shows. Thanks.

[dberdou]

Originally Posted by smj

That's one nice looking catamaran. Where is she located?
Our cat is a John Marples designed Searunner 36HT that was stretched by the original builder to 38'. We bought her pretty much as a sailable shell, and have done enough work on her in the last 2 months to make her comfortable enough to move south for the winter. Much work still left to do!


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

hello
the cat is located in northern france, in la turballe on the dry
i attach photos showing some hull repairs
hope this helps

[Steadman Uhlich]

S/Y SOPHIE
Bruce King/ Doug Beebe/ John England
cold-molded 90' sloop, in the slings

[Steadman Uhlich]

Howdy Sailors!

"Cold Moulded Warms My Heart!"

Show Your Cold Moulded Boat Sailing!

Now that the summer sailing season has started in North America, I think it is time for this thread to show some Cold Moulded Boats (CMB) in the act of sailing!

Please post a photo of YOUR boat sailing, or of your favorite Cold Moulded Boat model sailing.

Whether it is your own Pride and Joy, or your Dream Boat, let's show the CF members what makes the Cold Moulded Boats so special.

Perhaps you have a photo of your Cold Moulded Boat Boat gunk holing in the Chesapeake. Or a photo showing your boat being built. Or showing your boat's special features. Or a photo showing some of the wood interior. Show us.

Let's put in some more photos to illustrate the Cold Moulded Boat world here in this thread.

IF you don't have a photo of your own boat sailing, then do a Google image search and find a sistership. Or post a photo of another Cold Moulded Boat you admire.

And, if you have been doing some cruising on your Cold Moulded Boat, take a photo from your blog or own site and share it here, with some comments about what you liked about your boat on your cruise. Tell others about YOUR boat or your model. Post a link to your blog if you have one.

Share your love of Cold Moulded Boats.

Let's see some sails! Let's see some boats!

[BWSJWS]

So here are a few pics of INGENIUM from when we first bought her to now sailing and living in the Sea of Cortez. She is a cold molded (4 layers of cedar) Bruce Robert 370 (modified) 37.5ft 40ft OA. Centre cockpit Cutter rig, with three anchors, 600watts of solar, wind generator, fridge, VHF and SSB radios, Katadyn 160E water maker (6+gallons an hour) Cheery wood flooring 35hp Isuzu 3 cylinder diesel engine, Honda 2000 gas generator, Raymarine instruments including autopilot. Built by Don Campbell in Edmonton Albert, originally launched in 2010 and we purchased her in 2015. Fantastic sailing vessel and it is our full time home. We are currently in the Sea of Cortez and will make our way further south after Christmas.

Any questions?

[Steadman Uhlich]

BWSJWS,

Thanks for adding your boat to the mix.

[topmast]

Epoxy fume reaction seems to grow from barely noticeable to the skin falls off your face . Probably do'ing nasty stuff at a cellular level too. Careful limited contact from the getgo.

[carlo de leo]

Hello all!
I'd like to share with you info about my cold moulded boat.
It's a 38 feet one off project by Nestor Volker, an argentinian engineer that used to work with German Frers.
It was built in 92-93, with mahogany laminate fiber glass vennered by a well renowed wood shipyard in the very south of Brazil. The ribs (infrastructure) are all laminated with carbon fiber. The builder used, at that time, Cascofen as glue (what you can say about?), i discovered this recently.
I bought the boat 2 years ago with very little use (300 hours motor!) and she never been in salt water untill last summer (south hemisphere). It has a shallow draft with a short keel and centerboard. It's provided with a pilot house as you can see in the pictures attached.
Cheers!