Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 27-12-2014, 00:53   #1
Senior Cruiser
 
44'cruisingcat's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,458
Images: 69
Wide Bay Bar (QLD)

This morning at around 9:00 am we crossed the Wide Bay Bar heading south. I checked with the Tin Can Bay Coast Guard, to see if the waypoints had changed, and was informed they had, recently.

So I took down the details for the two waypoints (used to be three) and loaded them into the chartplotter.

On approach to the first new waypoint I could see that there were breaking waves at what looked like about the exact position of the waypoint.

So we stayed somewhat west of the recommended track, and turned later, north of the new waypoint's position.

Conditions were about as good as you could ask for, a 10 knot NE breeze, maybe 1 metre swell from the East, and well into a rising tide.

I'd suggest anyone crossing the Wide Bay Bar, be very careful, keep your eyes open, and do NOT attempt it at night. At least one of the new waypoints is not right.

But the entrance has definitely shifted, the old waypoints would be even worse.

I'll be sending an e-mail to MSQ.
__________________

__________________
44'cruisingcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-12-2014, 02:21   #2
Certifiable Refitter/Senior Wannbe
 
Wotname's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: South of 43 S, Australia
Boat: Van DeStat Super Dogger 31'
Posts: 7,334
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

Presumably this is the outer bar before you turn S(ish??) for the inner bar or has all that changed as well?
__________________

__________________
All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangereous men, for they may act their dreams with open eyes, to make it possible. T.E. Lawrence
Wotname is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 27-12-2014, 05:44   #3
Senior Cruiser
 
Wanderlust's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: NSW Central Coast
Boat: Lagoon 410
Posts: 499
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

The waypoint of concern is the middle one ... they are now called A, B and C instead of 1, 2 and 3.

We listened to the radio chatter a couple of days after the new waypoints were announced a few weeks ago. A boat was surveying the area in calm conditions and reported that B was right on the edge of a sandbank, and the water was a lot deeper only 10-20 metres to the north and west of it.

A few days later we anchored in Pelican Bay, planning to cross the bar on the next morning's high tide. While there we watched on the AIS as Marine Rescue towed a boat in. There was a bit of swell and the tide was at least 2-3 hours into the runout, so I'm sure there would have been a fair bit of white water around. The rescue crew chose a path about 300 metres north and 100 metres west of the official waypoint.

When we went out the next day the swell had subsided somewhat and conditions were fairly calm. We did not see any breakers at the waypoint but the waves did look a little steeper there.

Note that Marine Rescue can't offer advice that differs from the official waypoints, but did suggest that if we saw white water at the official point we go a little north and west of the waypoint.
__________________
Steve
Wanderlust is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-12-2014, 13:42   #4
Senior Cruiser
 
44'cruisingcat's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,458
Images: 69
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

Yes, it's what would have been the middle one when there were three. But now apparently there are only two.


It's the second one you would come to when entering the harbour.
__________________
44'cruisingcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-12-2014, 14:19   #5
Registered User
 
2Wind's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 312
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

I sailed inbound during late September and outbound in early October using the old waypoint 1, 2 and 3. In bound it was clear that the old waypoint 3 (no doubt the current equivalent #2) needed to be moved east nor east by 100m or more. I surfed the lightly breaking swell approaching it. Outbound three weeks later in calm condition and at 3/4 tide under bright moonlight I made my track slightly seaward of the old #3. I had 3.0m of water over the bar between 3 & 2.

I will be interested to get the new waypoints and see where they lie in relationship to the old. Given 44's comments above, it certainly appears that daylight crossings in good conditions will be the rule until further notice.
__________________
"Second Wind"
Lagoon 440 Hull #30
Brisbane, Australia.
2Wind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-12-2014, 14:34   #6
Senior Cruiser
 
44'cruisingcat's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,458
Images: 69
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

The new waypoints lie pretty much parallel to the old ones, but further north, on the "Second leg" when outbound.


They now only give two waypoints, the "First leg" outbound is dictated by using the entry leads as a backlead. However you need to stay a bit, maybe 50 metres or so west of this course.
__________________
44'cruisingcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-12-2014, 14:37   #7
Moderator
 
JPA Cate's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: aboard, cruising in Australia
Boat: Sayer 46' Solent rig sloop
Posts: 10,718
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wanderlust View Post
The waypoint of concern is the middle one ... they are now called A, B and C instead of 1, 2 and 3.

We listened to the radio chatter a couple of days after the new waypoints were announced a few weeks ago. A boat was surveying the area in calm conditions and reported that B was right on the edge of a sandbank, and the water was a lot deeper only 10-20 metres to the north and west of it.

A few days later we anchored in Pelican Bay, planning to cross the bar on the next morning's high tide. While there we watched on the AIS as Marine Rescue towed a boat in. There was a bit of swell and the tide was at least 2-3 hours into the runout, so I'm sure there would have been a fair bit of white water around. The rescue crew chose a path about 300 metres north and 100 metres west of the official waypoint.

When we went out the next day the swell had subsided somewhat and conditions were fairly calm. We did not see any breakers at the waypoint but the waves did look a little steeper there.

Note that Marine Rescue can't offer advice that differs from the official waypoints, but did suggest that if we saw white water at the official point we go a little north and west of the waypoint.

We came across on the 5th of November. The route the rescue crew took worked for us, with our 2.2 meter draft.

"A little west and north" is not good enough, as everyone seems to understand. What a shame the VMR can't tell us what they know, in advance of formal changes.

I sure hope no one tries a night time entry at this stage, and of course, then sands keep moving north.

Ann
__________________
Ann, with Jim, aboard US s/v Insatiable II, in Oz, very long term cruisers
JPA Cate is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 27-12-2014, 15:50   #8
Registered User
 
Wrong's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,702
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

Ah, yes. The Wide Bay Bar. Been over that rascal three times. In the first episode, I'd created waypoints to a spot just outside the bar on the recommended track. Plan was to use, from there, physical references supposedly located on the land beyond. Problem is when I was on approach with the wind 20+- knots aft, haze and a setting sun obscured my view. Well, lucky for me a sailboat had just crossed the bar ahead. Unsure though of its precise track, I ran parallel of the entrance to the crossing to more closely observe the waves. Then, based upon my observations I was reluctant to proceed without further confirmation. Called VMR who based upon my given position said I looked to be spot on... So... The depth sounder displayed about 3' under my shoal draft keel which draws 3.5'. Almost broached but all's well that ends well.

Then VMR officially closed the bar for two days.

Second two experiences were 'pins & needles' events and were accomplished without anything more than coming away with an appreciation for the confused, rough conditions.

Not particularly my most fun thing to do.
__________________
Wrong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-12-2014, 00:41   #9
Registered User
 
Mirage Gecko's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Sunshine Coast Hinterland
Boat: Seawind 1200 TEC 3
Posts: 430
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

In the last week of November we were given Emailed the coords from VMR which were a little differnt to my Navionics by about 40 metres that I had used to cross northerley about five months earlier BUT was advised to head West and Nth a bit as well.On the day we crossed it was in very good conditions but a reasonable swell was running and way point two which is the one you basically turn right at and head out to sea had white water spot on the waypoint mark so we took the verbal advice and went west and north in unbroken water.What gives with this advice is VMR bound by some crazy regs to give you co ords they know are not correct?

How does the VMR close the bar?
Chris
__________________
Mirage Gecko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-12-2014, 02:00   #10
Registered User
 
Mirage Gecko's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Sunshine Coast Hinterland
Boat: Seawind 1200 TEC 3
Posts: 430
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

Apologies prior post should have been last week of October.
Chris
__________________
Mirage Gecko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-12-2014, 03:56   #11
Marine Service Provider
 
Factor's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Brisbane Australia
Boat: Corsair Dash MKII
Posts: 4,086
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirage Gecko View Post
How does the VMR close the bar?
Chris
It doesn't - It has no regulatory or enforcement authority, it can only offer quite specific advice.
__________________
Factor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-12-2014, 09:08   #12
Registered User
 
Wrong's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,702
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Factor View Post
It doesn't - It has no regulatory or enforcement authority, it can only offer quite specific advice.
)

I can state uneqivocably that in 2001 on my first crossing of the Bar toward the Great Sandy the bar was declared closed over the VHF. Mine was the last boat over before the closure. Whomever or whichever agency had the power and authority to decalare closure I don't know. It was not advisory. Of course there's no way to interdict a crossing by a determined boater willing to take the chance. I was to put it mildly, lucky. But then the Bar was not yet closed when I crossed.
__________________
Wrong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-12-2014, 13:13   #13
Moderator
 
JPA Cate's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: aboard, cruising in Australia
Boat: Sayer 46' Solent rig sloop
Posts: 10,718
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

In terms of strategy for the WBB crossing for entry, I'm thinking it's best to arrive for the morning tide: trying to see the leads into the setting sun is very difficult. To me, it's worth it to roll around at Double Island Point at night, in order to arrive in the right place at the right time.

Ann
__________________
Ann, with Jim, aboard US s/v Insatiable II, in Oz, very long term cruisers
JPA Cate is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 28-12-2014, 13:18   #14
Senior Cruiser
 
44'cruisingcat's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,458
Images: 69
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirage Gecko View Post


What gives with this advice is VMR bound by some crazy regs to give you co ords they know are not correct?


Chris
Yes, I think they are. They know the current waypoints aren't right, but they're the waypoints MSQ has given them. So all they can do is add the advice to be ready to go west and north.

It's a shifting bar, so at some stage every set of waypoints will need to be amended, but the problem is these new ones seem to have been wrong from the time they were issued.
__________________
44'cruisingcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-12-2014, 14:05   #15
Registered User
 
Wrong's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,702
Re: WIDE BAY BAR (QLD)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
In terms of strategy for the WBB crossing for entry, I'm thinking it's best to arrive for the morning tide: trying to see the leads into the setting sun is very difficult. To me, it's worth it to roll around at Double Island Point at night, in order to arrive in the right place at the right time.

Ann
Arrrrg, Aaak, Yuk! I did that on my second crossing toward the Great Sandy in 2011, and 'rolling around' is an understatement. Double Point is one the anchorages at the top of my list to avoid. Still, you are right. My second crossing was blessed with calm conditions, no breaking waves and excellent visibility. Me thinks from your comment you've rolled around a bit yerself at Double Point.
__________________

__________________
Wrong is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How Wide is Too Wide? nimblemotors Multihull Sailboats 40 18-04-2013 06:00
Botany Bay to Thursday Island QLD Flybridge 31 Pacific & South China Sea 9 17-07-2011 07:32
Piano Bar in Biscayne Bay . . . Literally TaoJones Fishing, Recreation & Fun 3 27-01-2011 14:48



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 15:31.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.