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Old 25-01-2018, 17:13   #91
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

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Originally Posted by estarzinger View Post
Actually El P, it was NOT in HK waters, it was in PRC water. That has been declared (there is a Vestas track, which clearly identifies the location/moment of impact).

I am told there is a pretty intense negotiation behind the scenes at the moment about the structure of the investigation.
Thanks for that.... so PRC jursidiction and a dead PRC citizen......
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Old 25-01-2018, 17:30   #92
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

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Originally Posted by Polux View Post
Do those cameras record all the time? If so they have images and if they are not damaging for Vestas I don't understand why they have not been made public.

Quite the contrary if they are abonatory for Vestas, meaning if it is visible that the other boat had no light at all, then it would help to finish with a lot of speculation that has been damaging for Vestas and for the VOR.
Depends on the DVR they use. That I don't know.
They do care about weight so they probably don't have huge data storage on those DVRs.
Lets say you have 4 hours of data space, the dvr fills it up and then overwrites the older data.
If you have an event you can't push a button and the DVR will not overwrite from a set point. You can tell the DVR to keep 10 minutes prior to event or 20m etc.
They have a crash button.
Maybe it's hooked to the Mayday botton on the VHF.
Ironically this system was shown When Vestas racing crashed onto a reef in the prior edition. By pressing the crash button they ended with the actual footage of the crash.

Why not make public?? It's part of an ongoing investigation in a foreign country with foreign rules.
Coming out publicly and saying it's the Chiness boat's fault might not be well perceived in China.
Let the Chiness authorities come to that conclusion, or not then go public.

I doubt that the VOR is worried about a few sailors speculating on what happened. They have much more important things to worry about right now.
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Old 26-01-2018, 03:57   #93
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

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Originally Posted by Flagman101 View Post
Depends on the DVR they use. That I don't know.
They do care about weight so they probably don't have huge data storage on those DVRs.
Lets say you have 4 hours of data space, the dvr fills it up and then overwrites the older data.
If you have an event you can't push a button and the DVR will not overwrite from a set point. You can tell the DVR to keep 10 minutes prior to event or 20m etc.
They have a crash button.
Maybe it's hooked to the Mayday botton on the VHF.
Ironically this system was shown When Vestas racing crashed onto a reef in the prior edition. By pressing the crash button they ended with the actual footage of the crash.

Why not make public?? It's part of an ongoing investigation in a foreign country with foreign rules.
Coming out publicly and saying it's the Chiness boat's fault might not be well perceived in China.
Let the Chiness authorities come to that conclusion, or not then go public.

I doubt that the VOR is worried about a few sailors speculating on what happened. They have much more important things to worry about right now.
I would be shocked if they don't have full video for the entire leg. Recently picked up a 6 terabyte hard drive that was little bigger than a pack of playing cards, so size is not a restriction and I'm sure they have a tech guy who's better than me.

I can understand we won't see the video because the lawyers will restrict it as much as possible (the authorities will likely get it) but if there was clear cut fault on the fishermen's part you would be hearing a lot of intentionally "leaked" stories making it clear what they were doing wrong but I haven't heard anything of that nature.
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Old 26-01-2018, 10:53   #94
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

It's a bit early to jump to conclusions. Even so one naturally does.
A bit of a change where its a high speed sailing vessel.
In many ways its surprising, some of these extreme machines have not had incidents already.

The Far East local fisherman from mainland China, pretty close to the bottom of the food chain of international seafarers. Getting run down by commercial vessel, Usually no body cares.

The fishing boat's know it. Self preservation is part of their way of life. They keep an eye out for commercial vessels knowing full well what might happen if they don't. Unfortunately while they probably are familiar with commercial vessels, I doubt they will have seen these types of races and racing yachts before.

The VOR brings a bit of interest. The bump in the night a bit more noticeable.
Fortunately after collision, the Vestas boat acted according to the law and traditions of the sea and did what they could. Only one life was lost it
could have been worse.

How will it all play out remains to be seen. There but for the Grace of God go I. I wouldn't want to be in their shoes right now.
I expect any video will have been seized as evidence, BY HK's version of MAIB or NTSB. Unfortunately I expect HK's Version of MCA, and HK police, Coroner will all be involved. Along with the same from the mainland.

If HK law is still similar to UK law. They have a right to remain silent. Except when talking to HK MAIB.
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Old 26-01-2018, 11:11   #95
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

Maybe there's not much of an investigation going on.
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Old 28-01-2018, 08:53   #96
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

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Originally Posted by Davidhoy View Post
Even with commercial vessels traveling in shipping lanes, collisions still happen. I posted a link earlier about just such a collision on the same day as the Vestas incident. One person dead, and seven missing at sea, likely dead at this point. This does not absolve Vestas in any way if they did not exercise all due caution, but we all need to reserve judgment until all the facts are known.


Yes I prefer facts over gossip and conjecture.
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Old 05-02-2018, 13:45   #97
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

The Vestas boat is shipped to NZ to continue repairs. They will miss the HK to NZ

leg.Update from Vestas 11th Hour Racing - Volvo Ocean Race 2017-18
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Old 05-02-2018, 14:29   #98
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

Interesting that they are not holding the vessel hostage.

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Old 05-02-2018, 14:38   #99
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

Why would that be??
There is no confirmation of an ongoing investigation.
Seems that its only on the forums that they would be held hostage and jailed.

Otherwise in China, they all seem to be happy the VOR is there.
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Old 05-02-2018, 14:58   #100
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

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Originally Posted by Flagman101 View Post
Why would that be??
There is no confirmation of an ongoing investigation.
Seems that its only on the forums that they would be held hostage and jailed.

Otherwise in China, they all seem to be happy the VOR is there.
Nothing quite like seeing something that isn't there.........

If you are in a foreign land and you are involved in the death of somebody... a car accident for instance.... there is a very good chance that you will not be leaving the country until the investigation is complete....not locked up... just not allowed to leave the country...

Its the way the world works... https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/cri...sh-near-nelson
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Old 05-02-2018, 15:22   #101
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

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Nothing quite like seeing something that isn't there.........

If you are in a foreign land and you are involved in the death of somebody... a car accident for instance.... there is a very good chance that you will not be leaving the country until the investigation is complete....not locked up... just not allowed to leave the country...

Its the way the world works... https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/cri...sh-near-nelson
Ok.
So I guess we can conclude that, since the Authorities are not holding on to the boat, that none of the crew is being held in China or HK, that team Vestas is not to be blamed or put at fault?!
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Old 05-02-2018, 15:30   #102
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pirate Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

Not necessarily.. could well be they're allowed to leave on licence as only the skipper will be held responsible anyway.
Arrangements can be made..
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Old 05-02-2018, 15:40   #103
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

No.
All you can conclude. Is the vessel has been released. This could involve a bond having been paid by the owner to cover any damages or liabilities which may be placed on the vessel in future proceedings.

The crew being released is different. A bond may or may not be required.

Probably not though.

The Vesta's crew probably participated in the investigation. If so they are no longer needed.
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Old 05-02-2018, 15:43   #104
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

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Not necessarily.. could well be they're allowed to leave on licence as only the skipper will be held responsible anyway.
Arrangements can be made..
No it was the Navigator or at least it was last time. Or actually it was the plotter.
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Old 05-02-2018, 16:54   #105
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Re: VOR boat in Fatal Collision.

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No it was the Navigator or at least it was last time. Or actually it was the plotter.
From memory, last time they hit a reef in the Indian Ocean - navigator failed to spot the reef on the charts. This time they hit a fishing boat - hardly the navigator to blame (assuming someone is at fault, which seems likely).
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