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Old 07-09-2016, 11:37   #61
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

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Yes a little more here in NH than in VT. In VT it would only be $550/mo of costs for a house I'm not even using. Plus maintenance and utilities of course. And I own a lower end house of $203k value.
I live in a small town, hope to sell for close to $200k. Taxes are about 3200/yr but most towns are well above that. If you wanna play, you gotta pay.

Lately we've been thinking it would be nice to live in a marina close to a quaint town where you don't need a car, or at least go down to one car. Get rid of that damn cable bill, get rid of that damn lawn (not a lover of walking back and forth mindlessly for an hour or so). Let's see, the only other big expense is wifey, but she's cute so...
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Old 07-09-2016, 14:14   #62
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

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Why? I'm selling my house and closing in 8 days. Why should I pay $670/mo in taxes and and fees to keep it (it's pay off) while I'm cruising? Are there not houses all over the world for sale?
Your property tax is $670. a month?
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Old 07-09-2016, 14:28   #63
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

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Your property tax is $670. a month?
No, it's $430/mo. But I also have to pay $240/mo in association fee.

But my last house the taxes were $750/mo and the house value assessment was only about 30% more than the one I have now. But that was a different State where there was also a State income and sales tax.

Either way it makes no sense to me to be paying and maintaining a house you aren't living in.
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Old 07-09-2016, 14:41   #64
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

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No, it's $430/mo. But I also have to pay $240/mo in association fee.

But my last house the taxes were $750/mo and the house value assessment was only about 30% more than the one I have now. But that was a different State where there was also a State income and sales tax.

Either way it makes no sense to me to be paying and maintaining a house you aren't living in.
Wow! And here I was thinking $358 every quarter was a lot for our 6 and a half acres . We don't even have capital gains tax if kept for 2 years before reselling.
We are only thinking about charging foreigners that now and it's being met with opposition from the ruling Party so that ain't gonna happen.
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Old 07-09-2016, 14:44   #65
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

I bet that in the big picture also everyplace one lives you end up paying about the same because govts all work about and charge about the same. But that only applies if you acturally live there so location can matter if you don't really live there.
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Old 07-09-2016, 14:51   #66
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

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Hi Sofie,

I mean no disrespect to anyone who is new at boars. Far from it. I'm pretty new too.
I'm just pointing out that the question is backwards. That, as asked, the op is getting ahead of himself. Many years ago that same thing was pointed out to me and I had a satori. Re framing the question helped me to organize my thoughts to discovering what it was I was really after. It was a huge leap for me, so I am sharing with others. Perhaps the idea will help someone else. Eh, as I age the more I resemble the proverbial "old fogey".
I hear you. Didn't think you were being disrespectful,I was just trying to figure out your point of which I see now. I mean no offence to anyone.....yet
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Old 07-09-2016, 15:32   #67
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

Seems to me you are in an excellent area to sample the sailing life. My Mrs. is from Fort Edward not to far from Lake George. Then of course there is Sacandaga available. Perhaps a smaller weekender would be a possibility. Little money and with a trailer you have the pick of a variety of areas to explore. Catalina, Oday and several others come to mind in the 22 foot range. Keep it simple. The toughest part of cruising across oceans is the mind numbing drudgery. The endless hours of watching water go by. Not sexy by any means but more the norm than exception. This is much of the reason I like Lake Ontario so well. Big enough to throw you a curve and kill you and yet small enough to visit many interesting places within a days' sail. Island hopping and bunches of bays. If international sailing is your thing the US and Canada are good neighbors only a few hours away. Keep it simple at first then if the bug bites go for it. Good luck in your deliberations.
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Old 07-09-2016, 16:11   #68
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

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How many people, on average, would you say have the dream to get into sailing but then realize it's not for them.

I'm obviously asking this because I myself have doubts.

My wife and I have lived in a 1900 sq ft house for 15 years, just wondering if we would enjoy the downsize.

I retire from the military in a little over 8 years. What we are thinking about doing in the meantime is buying a smaller boat for Lake Champlain in a few years and sailing to a friend's camp on the weekends, which is about a 5 to 7 hour sail, and spending the night on the boat (as well as other destinations).

I don't know, just so many ideas and fears running through our heads. Seems like a big risk for some reason.

As a reminder to all the miserable bastards out there - Be nice! lol
Why would there be fears? Are you talking money wasted if you don't like it? Sea sickness? Fears of the water and storms?

If it's money, don't overspend on your first boat. I paid $2,000 for mine. Then put in a few more thousand learning....engines, stuffing box, etc. My boat could easily do what you have in mind.

My prior sailboats were beach cats without engines or anchors that I sailed in races up to 100 miles. I did have prior experience though since age 16 on small power boats

Many people don't last in sailing because after you learn the basics, it gets a bit boring (like flying after the trim is set correctly) unless you are a certain type of person. There are guys on here that love to work on their boats constantly whether they need it or not Then as a break watch anchor setting videos.

For me, racing kept me interest for about 15 years.

I'm still adjusting to the slow pace of cruising but it is nice to get away from the craziness of at least 5 military bases within a 50 miles or so area
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Old 07-09-2016, 17:09   #69
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

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Why would there be fears? Are you talking money wasted if you don't like it? Sea sickness? Fears of the water and storms?
Yes, I would have to say it's about 90% financial concerns. Overly cautions in that regard.


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There are guys on here that love to work on their boats constantly whether they need it or not Then as a break watch anchor setting videos.
lol

Thanks for the advice. Love this forum!
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Old 08-09-2016, 00:11   #70
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

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Originally Posted by m2244 View Post
How many people, on average, would you say have the dream to get into sailing but then realize it's not for them.

I'm obviously asking this because I myself have doubts.

My wife and I have lived in a 1900 sq ft house for 15 years, just wondering if we would enjoy the downsize.

I retire from the military in a little over 8 years. What we are thinking about doing in the meantime is buying a smaller boat for Lake Champlain in a few years and sailing to a friend's camp on the weekends, which is about a 5 to 7 hour sail, and spending the night on the boat (as well as other destinations).

I don't know, just so many ideas and fears running through our heads. Seems like a big risk for some reason.

As a reminder to all the miserable bastards out there - Be nice! lol
i am going to answer the implied reason for this thread, rather than the actual question. sorry. it sounds as if you've not yet sailed. rather than buy a boat big enough to sleep on, perhaps, it would be wiser to buy a smallish daysailer and ;earn to sail and see if you enjoy the activity of sailing.

having done that, if you decide you enjoy sailing, then a smaller cruising sailboat isn't that much of a risky investment. even if you decided that staying overnight on your boat wasn't for you, you'd still have a nice boat to daysail with an added bonus of having below deck accommodations.

trying to decide if cruising...even limited cruising...is for you without learning to sail and seeing if you enjoy sailing is kind of futile.
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Old 08-09-2016, 00:51   #71
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

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i am going to answer the implied reason for this thread, rather than the actual question. sorry. it sounds as if you've not yet sailed. rather than buy a boat big enough to sleep on, perhaps, it would be wiser to buy a smallish daysailer and ;earn to sail and see if you enjoy the activity of sailing.

having done that, if you decide you enjoy sailing, then a smaller cruising sailboat isn't that much of a risky investment. even if you decided that staying overnight on your boat wasn't for you, you'd still have a nice boat to daysail with an added bonus of having below deck accommodations.

trying to decide if cruising...even limited cruising...is for you without learning to sail and seeing if you enjoy sailing is kind of futile.
Cruising can also be done on a powerboat as well, so it's not all about sailing. Due to lack of wind or wind coming from the wrong direction, most cruisers need to motor much of the time.

It's about lifestlye not sailing to most, unless one is in the yacht delivery business or just enjoys the "getting there" part. We spend most of out time "being there."
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Old 08-09-2016, 00:55   #72
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

People keep saying that a boat is a $$ hole, etc. But this is more of an attitude than anything else. Any place which you rent (and often, or lately especially, the ones which you own) is also a $$ hole. But if it satisfies your lifestyle needs/wants you don't look at it like that and still continue to sink more $$ into one. Same with boats. If you compare all the $$ you wasted in your life renting apartments/houses, $$ you will never get back, it turns out to be no more or not much more than the $$ you would've spent living on a boat during that same time. Similar with owned houses - you will never get back your property taxes, insurance costs, most of your repairs/improvements and you'd be lucky to buy and sell in the right moments to get back the initial purchase price plus the interest. I don't see how a boat is more expensive as an alternative.

Once you have a paid up boat in the 30-40ft range the seasonal running costs are in the $3K-4k range (assuming a good amount of DIY and learned knowledge) including servicing the mooring, permits, insurance, haul outs, dinghy dock costs, etc. Of course if you have to have it docked or do not wish to be bothered by DIY or want to store her over the winter in the heated indoor place the cost goes up considerably. But making an analogy to non boat living - if you have to live in a penthouse or can't bring yourself to cooking your own meals every night your living costs also go up considerably.

Funny how with land living most people see a half filled glass as half full but if it concerns a boat it immediately becomes half empty in their mind.
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Old 08-09-2016, 02:53   #73
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

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People keep saying that a boat is a $$ hole, etc. But this is more of an attitude than anything else. Any place which you rent (and often, or lately especially, the ones which you own) is also a $$ hole. But if it satisfies your lifestyle needs/wants you don't look at it like that and still continue to sink more $$ into one. Same with boats. If you compare all the $$ you wasted in your life renting apartments/houses, $$ you will never get back, it turns out to be no more or not much more than the $$ you would've spent living on a boat during that same time. Similar with owned houses - you will never get back your property taxes, insurance costs, most of your repairs/improvements and you'd be lucky to buy and sell in the right moments to get back the initial purchase price plus the interest. I don't see how a boat is more expensive as an alternative.

Once you have a paid up boat in the 30-40ft range the seasonal running costs are in the $3K-4k range (assuming a good amount of DIY and learned knowledge) including servicing the mooring, permits, insurance, haul outs, dinghy dock costs, etc. Of course if you have to have it docked or do not wish to be bothered by DIY or want to store her over the winter in the heated indoor place the cost goes up considerably. But making an analogy to non boat living - if you have to live in a penthouse or can't bring yourself to cooking your own meals every night your living costs also go up considerably.

Funny how with land living most people see a half filled glass as half full but if it concerns a boat it immediately becomes half empty in their mind.
Excellent...Hobbies cost...as you say houses cost, furniture, maintenance...taxes...vacations, recreation, cars... no free lunch as they say. But an advantage to a boat is that it is not only a vacation that you experience all the time, but it is therapeutic and keeps your mind engaged in problem solving. Sailing and boats have been a huge learning lab and teacher of so many things. The costs of "stuff" related to boat ownership/use is like tuition! If you have a dirt life AND and boat the boat may seem like a very expensive toy that constantly needs money. And as a part time "thing" it could very well be.

You get what you pay for...
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Old 08-09-2016, 06:46   #74
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

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trying to decide if cruising...even limited cruising...is for you without learning to sail and seeing if you enjoy sailing is kind of futile.

I do know the basics of sailing, but very limited. Been out a total of 9 times so far, including a 5-day course.

Thanks for the advice.
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Old 08-09-2016, 08:48   #75
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Re: The sailing dream - How many people...

There is no risk in trying.

You try it.
You like it, you stay.
You do not like it, you tick sailing off, go for next best thing.

That simple.

There are multiple risks in not trying. Just imagine your father not trying to pick up your mother and all the consequences. You would not be asking this question, any question, boy!

Back to your original question though ;-)

Out of every 1000 people who fancy it, 10 ever try it, maybe 1 sticks with it.

Sailing, paragliding, gardening, pretty much the same base rates and dropout ratios.

https://www.statista.com/topics/1138...ional-boating/

BTW Why do you people have to make 8 years' life plans is somewhat beyond me. In the Soviet era, the USSR made many 5 years' plans. None of them met. The country in ruin. Learn the story.

Stop planning, start acting.

Cheers,
b.
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