Buying boat long distance through Broker

[LeeV]

Having just bought our boat through a broker, and on the other side of the country (!), I can tell you two things from reading your post:
1. The broker is not your friend, and if the survey had been glowing, he'd have delivered it overnight.

2. Consider that in that price range there surely are similar boats available closer - search, search and search.

If you are dead set on this boat (we were, as only 15 were made, this one was in great condition and the owner had issues that forced the sale), the first thing to do is fly out and see it. Hire a surveyor to meet you at the boat (NOT the same surveyor from the last time) and have him survey it with you watching/asking. Well worth the $$. Take your time; it's an investment you don't want to regret.

[Tom and Maje]

If you decide to do this, get your own broker. That broker works for the boat owner.

[Mithril Bham]

I have known some great brokers so the idea that they are all bad is not true. Obviously some are not good. Sounds like you should find a new one or choose another avenue.

[LeeV]

Originally Posted by magellanyachts

I have known some great brokers so the idea that they are all bad is not true. Obviously some are not good. Sounds like you should find a new one or choose another avenue.

Agreed; I must add to what I said above...we bought our boat in British Columbia Ca, which made the process more difficult, but the seller's broker was helpful, understanding, and interestingly enough, almost impartial in the sale. In case anybody's looking in B.C., look up Mike Carkeek at Yacht Sales West and tell him Lee sent you! By far the best broker I've come across.

[FollowingCs]

Originally Posted by zeehag

role of broker--sell you boat yielding greatest commission.

Role of Broker = close a deal (i.e. pair a buyer and seller) with the least amount of work.

Brokers typically aren't going to try to upsell for just a bit more commission, they make money when the deal closes. Their job is to convince the seller their boat isn't worth as much as they thought, and to convince the buyer that the boat is worth all that and a bag of chips. In some cases, the seller doesn't want to hear it, so the broker just lists the boat at the higher price, knowing it probably won't sell, but doesn't cost him much. In these cases, he won't do much work because he knows it won't close at that price. If he thought it would close at $50k, you'd be darn sure he'd be all over your questions.

My 2 cents. And given my wife is a Realtor, I've seen this all too often in a down market.

~ Following Cs ~

[wunderluster]

I am also a broker and owned a marina for years before becoming a broker. I agree the broker the OP is referring to is not doing his or her job. As a broker in Florida, the majority of my buyers are out of state and often outside the US. I would not be doing a good job for my sellers if I didn't answer questions fully. However, I am not a surveyor and will not make absolute statements as to the condition of the boat. I will give my opinion and recommend a survey before purchase. I have sold several boats to people site unseen and a few without a survey. I'm uncomfortable doing either but I do what the client wishes.

In this case I recommend a buyer's broker and find surveyor yourself through SAMS. I don't even like recommending a surveyor, although I know several that are excellent, but a broker puts himself at some risk of liability if he suggests a certain surveyor.

I agree to look for a broker through the Yacht Broker's Association or the CPYB association. I belong to both and I prefer to share business with other member brokers.

[alback]

Hi, Lots of good advise here. The best advise, be prepared to walk away from any boat or anyone you feel/see/hear/touch that does not seem right. There are many boats to chose from.

We made a long distance purchase 2 years ago, fortunately I do not mind driving and we made a 10 hr drive each way over multiple weekends. This boat was the 4th long distance one we visited over a 2 year period.

Like you we found the broker to be less than straight up about anything, that was also our experience with several brokers in our area where we walked away from finalising an offer.

We laid it out clearly to the broker that anything mis-represented by them in the listing or in conversation, regarding equipment, or condition would be deducted from our perceived value of the boat. I find it remarkable how many listings have equipment listed that is out of date, or repair.

In our situation, there was several items, such that after we made our original offer, subject to a survey and in water sail, we reduced our offer by over 10%.

The mistake we made was the surveyor, we asked them for a list of recommended surveyors and their first choices. In hindsight we should have used one that wasn't on their list as we believe he was not always working on our behalf.

Fortunately, I also felt confident about my own ability to recognize serious issues vs. cosmetic. The seller accepted our offer which was considerably less than their asking. We are pleased with the boat and have worked hard since to bring a 20 year boat up to super condition. A few surprises, yes, but really pleased with our boat.

Another bit of advise is the broker wants to maximize their take from the sale. Be careful to seek advise from others who made purchases in the area, and take advantage of lower costs for shipping, fees and paperwork. We saved over $1500 from the broker quoted costs for paperwork fees etc - and everything done completely and properly according to laws of both countries.

I hope this helps, and good luck.

[jrbogie]

Originally Posted by musher

Yes I did tell them I was ready to make an offer & just was waiting for answers. Didn't really help.

I plan a survey and rig inspection on whatever I buy. I'm struggling a little with how to get enough info to decide if it's worth paying for the plane flight and inspections.

I am looking locally as well, but very few boats on the market here right now.

Sounds like maybe I'm going to need some specific strategies to deal with brokers. I like the idea of making them answer questions while at the boat.

I've talked to a couple of owners from craigslist ads, and could hardly keep them from talking--very different dynamic.

the survey belongs to the owner and it's rare that brokers will provide them. they can and often do answer questions about what was found during the survey. pictures are not hard to send and if the owner is internet challenged, as i am, he can always ask his grandchild to help him out, as i do. i have little problem dealing with brokers. bought all my boats through them but if you are having problems maybe best to move on.

[Cheechako]

I've worked well with brokers, but mostly when I was there in person.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by musher

Hi,
I'm in the process of considering the purchase of a boat that is advertised through a broker. This is my first experience dealing with a broker. My previous boats I've purchased directly from the owners.

I'm very interested in the boat, but it is thousands of miles away. I want to be pretty sure it's a candidate before making an offer, paying to travel, and engaging a surveyor.

The broker has told me that there was a survey done last year, but has so far declined to provide a copy to me. His explanation is that he didn't want me calling the surveyor and asking questions about it.

I encouraged him to redact the surveyor contact info and send it, but so far he has not done so.

I also asked for some additional photos. The broker has indicated that the photos were taken, but that it's very confusing/difficult for the owner and broker to figure out how to email them to me.

The broker also claims ignorance on many of the questions I've asked. Things like "does the boat have blisters or a history of blisters or any blister treatment". Many of my written questions have gone unanswered. The broker seems to just ignore the question. I get the impression the broker does not want to write any of his answers down.

Is this normal behavior from a broker, or should I be listening to the little alarm bells that are starting to go off?

I'm thinking about asking to speak directly with the owner. Would that be a legitimate request?

The boat is in the neighborhood of 50K if that makes any difference.

Run! Find something closer to home.

[Joyful Noise]

Originally Posted by zeehag

broker= used car salesman. RUN>>>>>AWAY!!!!!
get looking at something closer to you.
and good luck with your used car salesman. he will try to show you boats outside your budget because he wants a larger commission.
oh yes and boats he cannot sell..... enjoy searching- hope you do not lose your assssssssss..


role of broker--sell you boat yielding greatest commission.

if you have option on a close by boat without broker--- run To it.

RUN REALLY REALLY FAST!!

[BobLoucks]

Originally Posted by musher

Hi,
I'm in the process of considering the purchase of a boat that is advertised through a broker. This is my first experience dealing with a broker. My previous boats I've purchased directly from the owners.

I'm very interested in the boat, but it is thousands of miles away. I want to be pretty sure it's a candidate before making an offer, paying to travel, and engaging a surveyor.

The broker has told me that there was a survey done last year, but has so far declined to provide a copy to me. His explanation is that he didn't want me calling the surveyor and asking questions about it.

I encouraged him to redact the surveyor contact info and send it, but so far he has not done so.

I also asked for some additional photos. The broker has indicated that the photos were taken, but that it's very confusing/difficult for the owner and broker to figure out how to email them to me.

The broker also claims ignorance on many of the questions I've asked. Things like "does the boat have blisters or a history of blisters or any blister treatment". Many of my written questions have gone unanswered. The broker seems to just ignore the question. I get the impression the broker does not want to write any of his answers down.

Is this normal behavior from a broker, or should I be listening to the little alarm bells that are starting to go off?

I'm thinking about asking to speak directly with the owner. Would that be a legitimate request?

The boat is in the neighborhood of 50K if that makes any difference.

I had my deposit fraudulently stolen by a so-called Broker in North Carolina. He sold the vessel to another buyer and kept my deposit.
Apparently he was not registered as a broker, Yachtworld subsequently delisted him. I found out later that he had done this before.
BEWARE of CROOKS!!!!

[jwing]

Originally Posted by Moody46CC

... Call another brokerage in the area and engage a broker to represent you. The listing agency will hate that, as it cuts their commission by 50%. Instead of getting 100% to split two ways (brokerage house; agent), it is split 4 ways (each brokerage house; each agent). Won't cost you any more as the seller pays the commission. If you engage a buyer broker, that broker by law has to represent your interests.

If the seller is paying a broker, then the broker is the seller's agent and represents the sellers interest.

If a buyer wants to engage an agent, then the buyer must pay the buyer's agent's fees. A smart buyer will engage a buyers' agent that gets paid whether the prospective buyer buys a boat or doesn't.

[FLLCatsailor]

Where is the yacht located? Maybe someone on here is near by and can take a look for you?

[kennyarmes]

It would help to if we knew what boat u are looking at. There are a lot of knowledgeable people on this site. And just maybe the owner is on here and will see your post. I sure hope it is not my broker vid so he is fired on the spot!!!! And yes I do have one forsale in that price range with a servey a little over a year ago