7 Pitfalls with Buying a Boat in Europe

[robert sailor]

Originally Posted by JulieMac

Robert, the operative word you use is, "these days". The boats we're looking at are 1990's vintage. A close look at Yachtworld pics, show most Scandinavian boats have screws.

As we will have to replace those decks in time, properly plugging those holes will be critical in keep the deck coring from water intrusion.

Yes you are right the older boats did screw them into the deck. I personally am not a fan of teak that much that I want to set myself up for a deck replacement. The old growth teak that was originally put down on these boats was a better product than is currently used for replacement and you can expect a shorter life the second time around. Having said that if I was shopping for a boat with teak decks I would try to find one that had been replaced recently. Regular care ensuring bungs are nice and tidy and the chalking renewed as required will add years to the life of these decks that and never putting anything on them but salt water will also help.

[ALAIN97133]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

Yes you are right the older boats did screw them into the deck. I personally am not a fan of teak that much that I want to set myself up for a deck replacement. The old growth teak that was originally put down on these boats was a better product than is currently used for replacement and you can expect a shorter life the second time around. Having said that if I was shopping for a boat with teak decks I would try to find one that had been replaced recently. Regular care ensuring bungs are nice and tidy and the chalking renewed as required will add years to the life of these decks that and never putting anything on them but salt water will also help.

Before buying Sundance, I survey a Hood 38 built by Wauquiez. The old lady had been around the world & her owner removed the original teak deck & had the teak on the cabin roof replaced in New Zealand. He told me he regrets that he didn't put teak back on the deck also as it was cheap to do so down there. I can't comment about the quality of the replacement teak but it looks quite nice to me

[robert sailor]

Originally Posted by ALAIN97133

Before buying Sundance, I survey a Hood 38 built by Wauquiez. The old lady had been around the world & her owner removed the original teak deck & had the teak on the cabin roof replaced in New Zealand. He told me he regrets that he didn't put teak back on the deck also as it was cheap to do so down there. I can't comment about the quality of the replacement teak but it looks quite nice to me

That must have been a while ago as replacing teak decks is very expensive anywhere although I did hear in parts of Asia it is cheaper but I don't know about the quality as there are about 7 different grades of teak used on yachts and the price difference is a lot.

[Suijin]

Julie I think you need to find a good buyer's broker in the US at this point. Any of them worth their salt will have done a good number of deals with european boats and can answer your questions. Certainly I think relevant conditions and issues, such as taxes, regulations, financing, titling, and exchange rate are different from country to country and are constantly shifting. A professional who deals with these issues on a routine basis would be your best source of information.

I think you're experience looking at boats here in the States should point up a very serious challenge; pictures, descriptions, and assurances from brokers regarding the condition of a boat are "directionally accurate" at best.

Not sure if I related this story here before or not, but I recently met a couple that has almost "professionalized" this process in reverse. My home port marina is where the office of National Liquidators is located, and a boat showed up slipped next to mine a couple of months ago. The couple on board was british and they had just bought it through NL and were about to take it down the ICW. Evidently every year they buy a boat in the states and cruise the Caribbean, using it as a floating condo for themselves, there kids, and friends. They eventually ship the boat back to England and sell it at a profit, paying for most of their costs of travel for the whole year. They do it with a new boat every year. Fascinating. Really nice couple too.

[Moody46CC]

Look at a Moody. The 46, 47 and 49 foot boats (1999-2005) would suit your needs. Look at the English Moodys, not the German ones. The German-built Moodys are different. The English Moodys are heavy displacement boats, solidly built, and designed for heavy weather. My 46' Moody displaces 15 tons. One could get a shoal draft keel--mine draws 5'3" which works well for us in the Chesapeake. The hull is solid for a foot above the waterline, then cored with balsawood. Deck same. Good layout below decks; center cockpit boats. Teak decks (glued, I believe. Mine are except the outer ring which has bungs/screws). Cutter-rigged (most were) preferable in my opinion. A number are on Yachtingworld for sale including some nice-looking models in the Med. OEM is standard brands and usually their higher end stuff. No problem with replacements. Moodys were sold in the states, although not many, but I hosted a little get-together in Annapolis during the boat show on hasty notice and got a half-dozen owners and spouses.

Major drawback to getting one in Europe would be the wiring--it will be 220V. A plus would be sailing back via the ARC or something like that. There are a couple of Moodys in it every year.

[goboatingnow]

The wiring is not an issue. The breakers will protect the circuits. Instead of 3kw sockets you'll just have 1kw5 circuits. You can update the Immersion if you want. Most battery chargers these days are dual voltage


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Eleuthera 2014]

Most of the world is on 220 V...

[Moody46CC]

The receptacles inside the boat would have to be changed from whatever English or continental version was installed; the receptacles for the entry of shore power would have to be swapped out as well. Any appliances with electric motors (laundry set-up; a/c units, coffee maker, etc.) that use shore power will not work or work well. As for battery chargers, not sure if the ones made ten-fifteen years ago had dual voltage. The newer the boat, the more likely it is to be wired for 110V and 220V, but somewhere along the line the lady making the posting talked about boats from the 1990's.

I used the adjective major. "Major," like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder. There will be some cost involved, and whether that is a major drawback or not depends on the buyer. If the difference between European and USA prices for used boats is that great, then the term "major" might recede to nothing. And as I said, one gets the pleasure of sailing the boat back.

Anyway, might not be major or even an issue at all, but it is worth considering.

[Eleuthera 2014]

CustomInk.com design eric3 created by r.labrador

Looky looky Julie...

Too much teak .... But it's your thing..

[Eleuthera 2014]

Here is another bundle of teak but it seems well cared for...

1992 Hallberg Rassy 49 Sail New and Used Boats for Sale -

It's time you flogged your stuff and left Chicago..

[Julie Mor]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

That must have been a while ago as replacing teak decks is very expensive anywhere although I did hear in parts of Asia it is cheaper but I don't know about the quality as there are about 7 different grades of teak used on yachts and the price difference is a lot.

One quote I got from a FL company said new teak decks run about $200 sq/ft, start to finish. That includes inside storage, making the templates, tearing off the old, preparing the deck, and installing the new.

This particular company gets all their teak from Asia and pays local wages. So I'd imagine it's a lot cheaper to have it done in Asia. As for quality, I read an article where a boat manufacturer's rep said they had to have their own full time supervisors there for quality control and they had their hands full.

BTW, the FL decking company said the price would be higher if the work was done in Ft. Lauderdale.

[robert sailor]

Your price seems about right at $200 per sq ft...did you do the math on a typical 50 footer including the cockpit? I spent quite a bit of time helping a friend price out teak deck replacement and all teak is not the same, it is graded and the price difference is a lot. The labor in Turkey is quite low and a decent replacement runs around $150 a foot and the workers are top notch so probably less in Asia but you would sure have to be careful about the grading of the wood.

[Julie Mor]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

Your price seems about right at $200 per sq ft...did you do the math on a typical 50 footer including the cockpit? I spent quite a bit of time helping a friend price out teak deck replacement and all teak is not the same, it is graded and the price difference is a lot. The labor in Turkey is quite low and a decent replacement runs around $150 a foot and the workers are top notch so probably less in Asia but you would sure have to be careful about the grading of the wood.

No doubt there are different grades of teak. The most expensive is usually quatersawn with a very straight grain. In furniture making, highly figured woods command the highest prices but for something like a teak deck, you want stability and lots of figure in the wood or flatsawn woods are not stable.

I make guitars and when picking out the wood for the neck you want something stable. But guitarists want something aesthetically pleasing. That usually means a lot of figure. While quartersawn maple makes a great neck, it's pretty plain looking. So I try to find high figure with a reasonably straight grain. Then you have to slowly take the tension out of it so it doesn't twist or warp. It's time consuming and can create a lot of waste.

[robert sailor]

I know the plantation teak is softer as it grows faster and it is what is sold in most places, not sure how easy it is to get old growth teak any more.

[JulieMac]

Originally Posted by Eleuthera 2014

Here is another bundle of teak but it seems well cared for...

1992 Hallberg Rassy 49 Sail New and Used Boats for Sale -

It's time you flogged your stuff and left Chicago..

That's for sure! It's been cold winter so far.

HR's are nice, and this one is priced well. The draft is pretty deep at 2.2M.
Since we're looking to do the Bahamas, we want to keep it below 1.8M.

I do appreciate your thoughtfulness, however!