Radar or Not ?

[captain58sailin]

One should use all the tools they have in the box. A good AIS can give you CPA and TCPA on the other vessels that are so equipped. An ARPA equipped radar can do the same, when interacting with large ships both of those pieces of equipment can be a big help. Large ships cannot slow down for you very fast, and it is wise to stay clear of them. Unlit oil rigs and stand pipes are numerous in the northern end of the GOM, a radar comes in very handy when transiting that area especially in the rainy nights. Ask anyone who has navigated the "Rabbit field" in Louisiana. Plotters are nice for efficient navigation. None of this equipment replaces the master computer between your ears.

[xymotic]

Originally Posted by zeehag

in use and derelict sans lights--radar is good for finding these. look in the gps owners manual--most have ais in them just need the hookup with nmea whatsis.....so only "need" is to get radar, but keep eyes off screeens and on your horizons!!!! i have radar--we used it 3 times from sd to mazatlan.

I'm sorry, but this is **JUST** as negligent as not looking.

Mariners are required, by law, to use ALL available means, which includes Radar & ais if you have it.

Coming from Barra De navidad to San Diego, we never 'needed' radar. It did not avert any collisions, and yet we used it regularly especially at night to confirm what we were seeing. Are those two white lights way off in the distance ahead Pangas? nope they are a big ass cruise ship. I knew what it was and where it was heading WAY before my eyes could pick out nav lights. If I had AIS I would have probably also known it's name and IMO that's not a bad thing *IF* I'd needed to talk to em.

**ALL** of that information is useful to a prudent mariner.

It's true that radar is not required, neither is warmth or food for that matter. But having it and not using it is just silly.

[LoveMyWoodie]

"It's true that radar is not required, neither is warmth or food for that matter. But having it and not using it is just silly. "

agreed.ZEE has radar 'cause it was included with her catch for 10 grand.she loves it when she needed it as she said-didn't ya ZEE?

What do ya need oxygen for either-except to breathe and live another day.

PS ZEE how was it when ya needed it ...those three times?

have a doctor friend who doesn't understand addiction either,says he doesn't understand-we are all addicted-told him we should stick a plastic bag over his head to understand he is addicted to oxygen...

he understood.

[conachair]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

Let me start with saying that I actually sailed through the busy traffic lanes of the North Sea / English Channel with just a Garmin 12XL hand GPS (still have it :-). So that would support the statements that eyeballs can replace AIS receivers (never transponders though).

However, this statement wouldn't be complete without adding that we were very worried about all those ships and looking out for them took more than 50% of our time and thus a lot of joy away from these trips. I remember LoweStoft UK to IJmuiden NL where you have to pass 3 (!) of those traffic lanes in 24 hours plus all the ships that go outside of them.

Radar, and for the most part AIS, changes all that dramatically.

ciao!
Nick.

Thanks Nick, That's all I've been trying to say. For not much money you can get a little box which really makes life so much more less stressful and does so much quicker than radar for the things which are transmitting.

Why not have another tool in your toolbox.

Same goes for offshore, considering the low cost of a cheap reciever, arguing against having one onboard is ridiculous.







Edit. PS I fitted one after getting down to canaries so did Channel, biscay , portuguese coast and Gib straits on radar. AIS would really have made life much easier for most targets on that bit.

[LoveMyWoodie]

Radar or not?

ASIS?

Yes-both please.

really in today's world they are both necessary and all things related,,,

with the technology-dirt cheap.

cheaper than insurance ,which IMHO is as as useless as screens on a submarine...insurance that is-easy to hid your pennies in a bag buried in the dirt so no-one can sue ya if ya make a mistake nd don't want to pay for it

since ya were right and...

before ya sail away?

[Dulls]

What are your main worries on the water?
It will change from boat to boat, person to person and area to area.

The issue of radar is in part all in the mind.

Mine are in order of my priority and according to my boat and cruising grounds.

1 being run down by big ships.

2 Weather.

3 battery supply.

I dont worry about being hit by leisure craft. That is my make up. Which means ais before radar. It soothes my mind on the big ship front and soothes my mind on the power supply. If your mental priorities are not the same as mine shop accordingly and put radar to the top of the list.

We have both radar and ais and my ais is on all the time and my radar has had about 2 hours of use all up in the last 3 years. Not much fog here. (Qld australia)

[conachair]

Originally Posted by Dulls

We have both radar and ais and my ais is on all the time and my radar has had about 2 hours of use all up in the last 3 years. Not much fog here. (Qld australia)

Not too far different on my boat , but if anyone tried to remove either from the boat I'd go for them with a scaff pole....

[LoveMyWoodie]

"We have both radar and ais and my ais is on all the time and my radar has had about 2 hours of use..."

...please tells us about the 2 hours and how useful were they and did they help ya survive to tell us that they weren't that valuable?

anytime i have flown in a plane into less than VFR conditions-I would have been shot for not having radar-literally!

Radar is the best sail safe invention since the WWII/and peace of course!

What are we arguing about?

Radar? or know radar?

Let me use a good quote,please?


No Radar-no peace

Know Radar-Know Peace!


yep-scarffe pole! keep off my boat!


guns are good too -if ya can hide'em till ya need 'em,eh?

[Dulls]

[QUOTE=LoveMyWoodie;817402]"We have both radar and ais and my ais is on all the time and my radar has had about 2 hours of use..."

...please tells us about the 2 hours and how useful were they and did they help ya survive to tell us that they weren't that valuable?

It was not a survival issue just a usefull tool for going up a foggy river and we could not see the banks. If radar saves my life i will let you know asap. and may then recomend everyone has 2 radars...

I have sailed in the busy foggy shipping lanes of europe but i am not there at the moment. So my priorities are different.

Most yachties have to juggle costs, power supply, crew supply etc. This has more bearing on having or not having radar. Some of the debates are from big ship people and have limited use to the small boats. They argue about tuning and correct use etc but the set ups on the ships are more powerfull, expensive and they have the power and crew etc to use it. This is not an argument about keeping the perfect look out with all gear it is a practical use of radar on small boats with all the problems it entails. I dont search the seas like a warship in ww 2 looking for subs, i just do the best i can in keeping a good look out and juggle fatigue etc like everyone else. Some times radar is usefull and sometimes not. If i could chose i would have ais because my personel issues are with the big ships. It is on all the time and does not require the attention or power of radar. I have a steel boat so that helps the other fellow see me.

The argument here comes down to personal requirements and safety etc is further down the list. If i had unlimited funds that would be different.

[xymotic]

Everyone has differing priorities I guess. I find it interesting those that are most concerned about ships. they are my LEAST worrisome thing around Puget Sound. I know where they are, they are manned by at least somewhat serious and professional folk (and a pilot) and they also have Radar

Jet-skis and 45' motor yachts are FAR more frightening to me.

[svWindfall]

Surprisingly, jet skis and 45' motor yachts show up on the radar quite nicely...it's those Doug Fir logs floating around the Sound that don't.

[xymotic]

Originally Posted by svWindfall

Surprisingly, jet skis and 45' motor yachts show up on the radar quite nicely...it's those Doug Fir logs floating around the Sound that don't.

Well, that's why I got AIS for those! lol.

Seriously though, check out this video: Broadband 4G

I'm totally sold by that PVC demo. AMAZING!! I bet a dead head big enough to be a problem, probably would show up on that bad boy.

[LoveMyWoodie]

Yep-broadband 4g up close is almost as amazing as having an iPhone .

Guess now we need radar and 4g broadband,and asis.

Sonar forward will be the next topic?

going to bed covered with all this wonderful technology and this wonderful forum of wisdom.

cheers! no more banging my head up against the wall in the dark

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by xymotic

Well, that's why I got AIS for those! lol.

Seriously though, check out this video: Broadband 4G

I'm totally sold by that PVC demo. AMAZING!! I bet a dead head big enough to be a problem, probably would show up on that bad boy.

I have never watched a video with more nonsense than this. "unmatched short range performance"... Ok, they continue to explain this like a conventional radar will show you targets from 80' away while the 4g will perform better from 50' away... a whopping 30' difference. Then next sentence it'm suddenly perform right up your bow which is like 0' away... You think this really is true? That you can see a dinghy that is right under your bow?

Also, they continue to explain that all collisions occur in that range right at your boat (duh!) so that is why you must have a 4g radar.

Well okay, let them have it and everybody falling for that. Us who have a bit more grey matter watch targets way out and steer clear so that we don't pass at 10' from each other. Also, when they are rig upon us, we'll use eyes.

Cheers
Nick.

[psneeld]

A big difference I see in this discussion is the use of radar/ais or any other tool in the navcen is I see some arguing the "offshore" need and some the "inshore" need.

Anyone with experience and are actively cruising (or marine work in some posters situation) see the clear difference not only between AIS but regular and broadband radar. I have no personal experience with broadband but a very trusted friend with a sightseer boat just got one and gave me his personal opinion of it's close in use.

I was disappointed in the video as it made no mention of performance in rain.