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Old 24-12-2013, 10:08   #16
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

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I too have decided on the Zeus Touch 8 inch and the 4G Radar and AIS plus the wifi option.

Tartansail : What are the range limitations of the 4G radar that you speak of?

Not so sure I'll change my mind but if the range is limited, I may as well install it on a pole on the stern rather than halfway up the mast. Pointless having 30 miles line of sight when you can only see 10 hey?

Merry Christmas.
I can't explain why, but several sources, including the person recommending B&G, said that Broadband radar isn't as reliable as pulse radar at longer distances and that a fair amount of tweaking is required to get good results beyond 8-10 miles. It's also supposed to be less effective at seeing rain squalls. My main concern is close up navigation in Maine fog so it's a reasonable tradeoff for me. I'm still going to mount the dome on the mast since the setup is already in place.
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Old 24-12-2013, 10:26   #17
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

Get the conventional radar from Simrad if you prefer . . .

SIMRAD DX64S 4kW Radar Dome Antenna-DX64S SIMRAD - Star Marine Depot
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Old 24-12-2013, 10:58   #18
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

Tartansail - 8 - 10 nm is plenty good enough for me. Like you, I see more value in good short range ability and low(er) power consumption.

I Googled and could find no reference to any unexpected range issues for the 4G Broadband. These guys... B&G 4G Broadband Radar Kit | Technical Marine Support supply specs which seem to concur with the 8 - 10 mile range.

It will be interesting to see if it will be able to "see" channel markers and buoys within a quarter mile or so. If so, this will be most useful.

I'm wondering that if the scanner is mounted too high whether this will have a negative impact on its ultra short range capability? Any ideas?

Caelestis - True enough, but more range usually equals more power consumption.
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Old 24-12-2013, 11:10   #19
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

The 4G is 20w powered up, 3.3 on standby.

The 4kw Simrad is 30w.
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Old 24-12-2013, 13:14   #20
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

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Originally Posted by neelie View Post
Tartansail - 8 - 10 nm is plenty good enough for me. Like you, I see more value in good short range ability and low(er) power consumption.

I Googled and could find no reference to any unexpected range issues for the 4G Broadband. These guys... B&G 4G Broadband Radar Kit | Technical Marine Support supply specs which seem to concur with the 8 - 10 mile range.

It will be interesting to see if it will be able to "see" channel markers and buoys within a quarter mile or so. If so, this will be most useful.

I'm wondering that if the scanner is mounted too high whether this will have a negative impact on its ultra short range capability? Any ideas?

Caelestis - True enough, but more range usually equals more power consumption.
In this thread, Dockhead reports seeing his own bow from 10 meters up: B&G (Simrad) 4G Radar

What ensues is a discussion of vertical and horizontal beam angles which passed over my head with several meters to spare. However, it doesn't appear that mounting on the mast is going to hamper what is seen.
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Old 24-12-2013, 13:20   #21
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

We have a 4G on our mast. On a very foggy day in Maine, I was able to see all buoys no problem, and when we got to the mooring field, I could not only see all the moored ships, I could see the empty mooring balls. They were the large variety and it was calm to be fair.
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Old 23-01-2014, 17:26   #22
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

Hi All
I had Simrad instruments for 6 years when the network collapsed. I have been advised that all the hardware will have to be junked as not NMEA2k compatible. So very Angry with Simrad but if I have to replace all, B&G Zeuss seems better system. As this was new just 6 months ago, do any early adopters have doubts or praise for B&G Zeuss? I am curious as I have spent some time searching the net and cannot find any comments supporting or otherwise.
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Old 23-01-2014, 17:42   #23
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

Networks just don't "collapse" and take out instrumentation. I don't doubt you have some non-functional instruments, but a "network collapse" just doesn't make any sense - either as a physical event or a reason for your instruments not working.

But that is beside the point

The Zeus has been out for 2-3 years now - it is not a new product. If you want higher-end sailing/racing functionality, your only consumer-level choice is the Zeus. Nothing else even approaches the same ballpark for sailing functionality.

If you search these forums, a few people have written about their experiences with the Zeus.

You do understand that B&G and Simrad are the same company?

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Old 23-01-2014, 18:21   #24
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

Mark
Thanks for that. More specifically, I have no wind data, I have speed and depth on the combo but not the repeater, the auto pilot and MFD work fine in stand alone but receive no external data. I have been advised that to find and fix the problem is likely to be more costly than replacing all and there is little confidence it won't collapse again. I have tried the trick of resetting the network, unplugging and replugging etc but all to no avail. I have been assured by two marine electricians that it is a network (NMEA0183) problem.
I am from Sydney, Australia and I think the Zeus Touch was only released here about July last year and yes I was aware that B&G and Simrad are the same company.
Thanks again for your help.
Fred
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Old 23-01-2014, 20:39   #25
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

Muddy... Previously, I have had problems with NMEA 0183 (specifically, the Raymarine equivalent) after lightening strikes, or near strikes.. I seem to recall that someone told me the shielding on 183 is used for data or ground??? (Someone please correct me here).. hence 183 was very susceptible to any sort of induced EMF.
Last week, I installed a Zeus Touch 8, the Go Free Wifi, AIS and a 4G radar. I cannot tell you how it actually works because I have not used it in anger yet.

But I like the way the Ipad can control the MFD via wifi. Its fun sitting below and turning the radar on and off remotely. I also like the intuitive touch screen menus. And to date, every component was a simple plug and play. My fingers are crossed that the NMEA 2000 physical layer will be more robust than its predecessor.
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Old 23-01-2014, 20:51   #26
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

How does Furuno's 4kw 24" dome radar compare to Raymarine's?
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Old 23-01-2014, 22:11   #27
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

Neelie thanks for that. I would appreciate if you would let me know of any developments, good or bad.
Thanks again
Fred
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Old 23-01-2014, 22:27   #28
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

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But I like the way the Ipad can control the MFD via wifi. Its fun sitting below and turning the radar on and off remotely..
I drive my wife crazy doing that when she is on her night shift and I'm down below checking on her with the iPad. Ours is the Raymarine system (which is okay), and I bought it two years ago because they were first out with wifi and I didn't think Navico was going to have it with their systems for awhile.... it only took a few months.

I will say that we don't use the WiFi as much as I thought we would. Maybe only 4 or 5 times a year.

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Old 24-01-2014, 08:20   #29
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

Quote:
Originally Posted by neelie View Post
Tartansail - 8 - 10 nm is plenty good enough for me. Like you, I see more value in good short range ability and low(er) power consumption.

I Googled and could find no reference to any unexpected range issues for the 4G Broadband. These guys... B&G 4G Broadband Radar Kit | Technical Marine Support supply specs which seem to concur with the 8 - 10 mile range.

It will be interesting to see if it will be able to "see" channel markers and buoys within a quarter mile or so. If so, this will be most useful.

I'm wondering that if the scanner is mounted too high whether this will have a negative impact on its ultra short range capability? Any ideas?

Caelestis - True enough, but more range usually equals more power consumption.
My experience with 4G radar has been that it is not as much different from good HD regular radar as the hype suggests.

Various reports show the range as about 12 miles. I have actually seen clear images of ships much further -- out to 30 miles or more. Of course the vertical side of a ship is an ideal radar target. But certainly there is plenty of range for my purposes.

The close-up detail shown by 4G radar is wonderful, but I'm not sure it's all that much greater than you get from say the very good Furuno conventional radars. Continuous wave radar doesn't have any "main bang" obscuring the very center of the screen, but query whether that's really all the crucial.

I understand, but cannot verify from experience, that the continuous wave radar (BR24, 3G, 4G) will not show birds (important for fishermen) or storm cells as well as conventional radar will. If either of these is important to you, you might want to think about it.
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Old 24-01-2014, 08:32   #30
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

Always dangerous to quote an advertising brochure!.. But.. they do claim that weather returns are very good. Mind you, dodging cells travelling at 20kts in a boat that does 7 certainly concentrates the mind.
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