Confused. Should I buy a Raymarine E7 chart plotter? or just stick with a IPAD??

[hoppy]

Originally Posted by cards26

The first chart plotter came out in 1985, so the use of an ipad is relatively new in comparison.

The history of iPad and all other tablet computers can be traced back to the Apple Newton which was first released in 1993. There were earlier but the Newton was the first one that was widely marketed and in the public eye. The Newton and other tablets have been fads or failed technologies and have faded away and then reborn.

There is nothing new about tablets, it's just that the use of them as an ancillary navigation device is a recent happening.

[noelex 77]

An interesting discussion.

Like many, we use both chart-plotters and iPads, which of course is the best of both worlds.

The one killer application for the chart-plotter is radar. Radar overlay on the charts is a very useful check that the maps are correct. Radar also proves the easiest means of using a second independent navigation source. There are radars that will work without a chart-plotter, but currently the models that do this are limited and the radar units themselves are not state of the art. I am sure this will change in the future (perhaps it already has, it is difficult to keep up with current marine electronics).

Of course there are many chart-plotters that will transmit a radar (and charts) to an iPad. So even if you install a chart-plotter it can be a model with a smaller screen and there is less need to consider multiple units, like one under the dodger and one at the chart table.

These days I would skip the second chart-plotter and just use an iPad. If technology improves and state of the art radars become available I would happily skip the chart-plotter completely although a PC running open CPN would be nice.

Many people have raised the potential unreliability of iPads in a marine environment. I think it is a valid concern, but both my wife and I have just updated our iPads so we now have 4 aboard. I think 4 iPads way more reliable than 1 chart-plotter especially as each iPad has its own GPS and battery supply. Not many boats will have 4 iPads, but as older units are naturally replaced I don't think this will be very unusual, especially if you throw in phones, which today are mini tablets.

[TeddyDiver]

Originally Posted by ramblinrod

Cut the BS. Navionics stating they are not as reliable has nothing to do with me, I just passed along the info. I didn't once slam any product. I've stated several times that iPads are great mobile computing devices and a great back up tool to have aboard. I have two myself. I've also had 2 iDevice failures in the last year. I replaced them, they are so useful to have. But I would never choose one as the primary electronic navigation tool. I have the right to this opinion as you do yours.

Could you find a quote for us from any chartplotter manufacturer that their devices are perfectly accurate and you can allways rely on them as a primary device navigating a vessel?

[Hooked]

We did Mexico in 2013 and I was worried about the charts throughout that whole area as Appa draws 8 foot or so. Money was getting tight after the new running and standing rigging, autopilot etc so we decided to go without a dedicated chartplotter. I bought a couple iPads and the iNavx program and the Garmin app. Had a computer with open cpn on it as backup with a Garmin handheld with charts installed also. Paper as the ultimate backup. Blue latitude press offered charts from Shawn and heather that loaded into the inavx program. They were brilliant. Absolutely the best. The people we met down there all were amazed at the accuracy.


We also have the vesper vision that talks to the inavx program. The vesper also talked to the raymarine instruments that we had. Except the autopilot.
All the good that people have mentioned on this thread about iPads is spot on. All the bad is also spot on. Except the update issues. Never had that problem. Or the notifications.
We had the battery die coming into an anchorage. My fault should have charged it. It did overheat couple times. The screen got wet and it was irritating to use then. We lost it under cushions couple times. When coming into a new place it would have been nice to have a display in front of the helm and always on but we made it work. The kids ALWAYS wanted to hold the iPad and "help" me navigate. Sometimes you have to make compromises and not having a chartplotter at the helm was ours. But most of the time the iPad was great. And again, those charts that Blue Latitude have are just awesome. BTW I am a RN not a salesman for anything.
Once we got back to Seattle via Hawaii I waited awhile and just bought a refurbished raymarine e7. Here is one good reason why I did that. Updates to the raymarine instruments and autopilots. Software updates. The p70 head unit and the s30 (I think it is a s30) had some glitches that a new update would take care of. Without a chartplotter, I'd have to take the instruments out of the boat and to the dealer. That is how I understand it anyway. Been wrong before and I will be wrong again.
I put the e7 in at the nav station. I don't like big bulky objects at my helm. My boat, my choice. Anyway, got it hooked up to my internet via a hotspot on my phone. That e7 saw everything on my network. The i70, i50 wind and depth, p70, and the brain of the autopilot. It then downloaded a huge update to everything. Glitches gone. Pretty amazing really.
I can also plot something on my phone or tablet and transfer it to the e7 who then tells the autopilot where to go and all that crap. I won't do that as I don't really trust it that much but it is cool to think that it CAN do that. Technology. And my kids are never impressed by it. Louis CK has a great bit on how awesome everything is and how nobody is happy. Google it. I laughed.
Anyway, very entertaining thread. The fights on here can be almost as good as on SA.
I cringe when I see people take what they get off the internet and then spew it out as gospel. The above info is only based on my experiences. Your mileage will vary.


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum

[Ramblingman]

I just caught up on this thread since my last comment.

Wow it's taken a life of its own and times, I swore it was a "Cat vs Mono" thread for a bit.

It really comes down to all the variables, application and personal choice.

Honestly - if we were not sailing beyond the bay, I'd probably not bother with a chart plotter myself. Cruising guide, charts, depth finder and iPad would do all for me. Even now we use the iPad and the Skipper app the most. The MD cruising guide sits in its sleeve next to the helm seat as a backup. Glancing at times at the depth finder display.

I also use the sun shade from the drone to reduce the glare/brightness issue. Once the new bimini is in place we probable won't need it as we will generally be in the shade at the helm.

So depending upon the application and ones choices, an iPad could be the better choice. If you know the waters, have paper charts and other navigation tools, a chart plotter may not be your choice.

We are seeing the early stages of the world being networked. There are cars without dedicated stereo and information systems because it is expected to that the buyer will have a smartphone to connect and perform those functions. How long before marine systems are the same? We are getting there, a head unit with WiFi and other networked items is already available.

The marine environment is harsher but the right case solves most of it. Glare, again can be solved.

In the end, we will use the current technology of the chart plotter, radar, camera systems and more when we upgrade electronics this Winter as our last refit item. Guess what? iPad minis will be a major part. They are our remote screens. We will still have paper charts, standalone depth sounders, the pedestal compass, a hand bearing compass, and much more. Why? Well we plan to go all over the globe and I will not rely on a single system, that includes a chart plotter. We will have one but I suspect we will use our tablets as the main interface.

In the end if I had to pick only one, I'd probably pick the integrated system but... if all the other goodies are not included, give me the iPad, it is far more functional and I will go olde school with the charts, compass, sextant and such.

To put all of ones eggs in any one basket is foolish.

[Boathooked]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

Go ahead, live in the past. I prefer the future, which is mobile devices. Traditional chartplotters will go the way of the buggy whip within 2-3 years.

I absolutely, totally disagree. There will ALWAYS be a place/need for dedicated, hard-wired chart plotters/MFD's.

Of course I could be wrong so let us look back on this threat in 2-3 years! LOL

[Sandero]

Mobile devices CAN do lots... because of their powerful processors. But they are not designed for the challenges of the marine environment. If I had to choose a mobile or a marine type MFD... I would chose the latter. But as I have a mobile phone I can use it to SUPPLEMENT or in addition to the marine MFD.

Of course others don't bother with tech... and use DR, dividers and a compass. THAT is not the issue. BTW we had a massive "failure" of a new S7 and this was not the first mobile device to go belly up pretty quickly.

[Lantau]

Personally, I think the radar argument is a strong one. We have the new eS75 with Quantum radar on our Pacific Seacraft 37, and the radar is (to me at least) absolutely amazing. We were sailing on Saturday and the radar proved to be very useful in determining what rain storms were doing around us. Our previous radar (Simrad) was not nearly as sensitive. Also, our iPad (which we have completely stopped using since installing the new chartplotter) can't do any of that (at least not out of range of cel to connect to a shore-based radar website).

I'm inclined to say that you should have both if you plan to sail offshore, at night or in bad weather.

[Mystic38]

Pretty much zero chance i would trust primary navigation duties to a general purpose consumer electronic anything.

as a backup, or route planning device, sure..

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Hooked

We did Mexico in 2013 and I was worried about the charts throughout that whole area as Appa draws 8 foot or so. Money was getting tight after the new running and standing rigging, autopilot etc so we decided to go without a dedicated chartplotter. I bought a couple iPads and the iNavx program and the Garmin app. Had a computer with open cpn on it as backup with a Garmin handheld with charts installed also. Paper as the ultimate backup. Blue latitude press offered charts from Shawn and heather that loaded into the inavx program. They were brilliant. Absolutely the best. The people we met down there all were amazed at the accuracy.
Attachment 126713
Attachment 126714
We also have the vesper vision that talks to the inavx program. The vesper also talked to the raymarine instruments that we had. Except the autopilot.
All the good that people have mentioned on this thread about iPads is spot on. All the bad is also spot on. Except the update issues. Never had that problem. Or the notifications.
We had the battery die coming into an anchorage. My fault should have charged it. It did overheat couple times. The screen got wet and it was irritating to use then. We lost it under cushions couple times. When coming into a new place it would have been nice to have a display in front of the helm and always on but we made it work. The kids ALWAYS wanted to hold the iPad and "help" me navigate. Sometimes you have to make compromises and not having a chartplotter at the helm was ours. But most of the time the iPad was great. And again, those charts that Blue Latitude have are just awesome. BTW I am a RN not a salesman for anything.
Once we got back to Seattle via Hawaii I waited awhile and just bought a refurbished raymarine e7. Here is one good reason why I did that. Updates to the raymarine instruments and autopilots. Software updates. The p70 head unit and the s30 (I think it is a s30) had some glitches that a new update would take care of. Without a chartplotter, I'd have to take the instruments out of the boat and to the dealer. That is how I understand it anyway. Been wrong before and I will be wrong again.
I put the e7 in at the nav station. I don't like big bulky objects at my helm. My boat, my choice. Anyway, got it hooked up to my internet via a hotspot on my phone. That e7 saw everything on my network. The i70, i50 wind and depth, p70, and the brain of the autopilot. It then downloaded a huge update to everything. Glitches gone. Pretty amazing really.
I can also plot something on my phone or tablet and transfer it to the e7 who then tells the autopilot where to go and all that crap. I won't do that as I don't really trust it that much but it is cool to think that it CAN do that. Technology. And my kids are never impressed by it. Louis CK has a great bit on how awesome everything is and how nobody is happy. Google it. I laughed.
Anyway, very entertaining thread. The fights on here can be almost as good as on SA.
I cringe when I see people take what they get off the internet and then spew it out as gospel. The above info is only based on my experiences. Your mileage will vary.


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum

Hey.... a fellow male nurse RN cruiser guy using ipads!