Is Cruisers sailing forum losing it's way

[downunder]

Originally Posted by Rustic Charm

I first signed up with a handle that was my name and Ive always identified as living in Tasmania. I cant remember what the discussion was but i made some comments that were slightly negative of my profession and some moron actually rang my employer about it. My employer was fine with it but just wanted me to know someone had done so. It was then i requested my handle change to my boat name.

And in the last few months ive twice had other CF members pm me with their personal idea of a telling off. One seems to have disappeared from CF. i wont reply to pm's that are abuse anymore, or even polite 'tellings off'. Some people have too much time

The only persons who have told me off here are mods.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by StuM

Problem is that many threads in the multi section of this site start out as straight discussions of interest and relevance to multihuhll sailors. They subsequently become the dreaded "multi v mono threads."

It generally happens something like this:

1. A post about cruising catamarandesign and behaviour in following seas.

2. Enter people who have never sailed a cruising catamaran who then expound at great length on the design of sportive monohulls.

3. Previous useful discussion degenerates into completely off topic discussion along the lines of "I would rather not sail than sail a sluggish boat".

Strangely, we never see this same thing occur in reverse to threads in the monohull section of the site. Maybe that shows where the problem lies.

Or.. it could be the case that cruising Catamarans are still relatively young to the market.. and passed through a teething phase which saw a few capsizes that started the 'Legend'...
When one considers that the UK has been in the Metric system nearly as long and folk still talk in pounds and ounces.. you've a lot of years of wisecracks to go...
As a former Cat owner (Wharram's..!! even Cat owners slag them) I just do not understand the over reaction.. are there not bigger things in life to get stressed about than what someone thinks about your boat or how you sail..?
I would suggest Marley's 'Two little birds.. sat by my window..!! to Chill you out.. but seagulls make a helluva mess..

[monte]

Not around long Phil? Making me feel like a young'n. I seem to remember reading Rosie Swales 'children of Cape Horn' as a 9 yr old.

[downunder]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

Some of the problems I've noticed:

For example, when somebody is told that the way some system on their boat is setup sucks, they start a fight like their life depends on it, without any reasoning or sense... like a red flag in front of a bull. I am very opiniated on most things but if you tell me that something really sucks on my boat then I want to know why and how it's done better. In these cases the mods have told me that I should write a prelude of a couple of sentences about how great their boat is and how well they sail them before making the remark. No thanks, this is not a political forum.

Members who are contributing a lot are often stalked on this forum by those who have called what looks like a Jihad on them. Every post is scrutenized in an effort to try to explain it in a way that makes it wrong or mean... when that is countered by logical reasoning, the fight is continued with a flood of pm's

I think this has stopped after I protested it to the admins but we used to have mods taking part in heated discussions and then continuing to get their way by moderating the thread (deleting posts or part of posts) to how they like it. That didn't go down so well with me. Mods who argue in a thread must ask another mod to moderate it. I believe that became the rule.

pm's. Somebody remarked that you can report pm's to a mod? That must be pretty new because I once posted a funny cat picture with the cat saying "What the F was that?! Where the F was the full word and I got PM's from a mod that were full of hatefull text and with so many times the F word in a bad way, instead of funny, that it was really out of control. It literally said that this was their right and with pm's anything can be said. The bad thing is that you can't block a mod for sending you pm's. Who mods the mods.

When somebody posts something that is clearly, without doubt, wrong, then we can't reply saying "you are wrong", which is considered too rude to post. I have had a countdown by a mod to a permanent ban, even if I tried to say it very nice. The reasoning given was that even people who are wrong must feel at home on the forum and that isn't possible when they are told they are wrong.
That's fine until it is about issues that can get people killed. I will not let that kind of things go unchallenged and when that counted to strike 2 for a permanent ban, I banned myself for a year voluntarily. I was told not to take that kind of posts seriously. Think of people oosting that it's okay to have only outdated flares etc.

The ignore function is broken. You don't see their posts anymore but you still see them quoted by others.

Then there are those who need to post how something should be done or handled while they have absolutely no clue; they have never done it themselves, they have had no education on the subject, they are wrong (often on purpose just as flame bait) and they get some sick kind of orgasm by posting such nonsense.... and it is allowed by the rules, even when done on purpose.

Then there is boatman... he drinks all your Tanquerey so steer clear of him

Jedi,

I have to agree with the title as there have been posters other than yourself also expert in many areas who have either reduced their posts or left.

Without doubt your non contribution in many areas lessened the value of many threads. I really valued your contribution.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by monte

Not around long Phil? Making me feel like a young'n. I seem to remember reading Rosie Swales 'children of Cape Horn' as a 9 yr old.

Ahahahaaaa... yup.. she was a helluva gal in her time.. a tiny (by todays standards) plywood Bobcat if memory serves.. no EPIRB/GPS/CP's back then.. sailors talked less..

Hey guys..!! one more thing, ScoldaMax is fine with me.. he's just one more gripe in the forum about the Advertiser's...

[tinkrman69]

Originally Posted by Island Time O25

You seem to have an agenda and keep ignoring my caveat. In these examples of young (or not so young) kids committing suicide all of them involved actual known names, cliques, schools, etc. I have yet to hear of any one particular suicide where all parties were anonymous and did not interact in person in any way in real life. I may be wrong on that but so far no one has presented to me even one case of an anonymous "bullying" gone extreme. But I'm sure you will keep telling me these happened but will not know one real example (one more time - where all the parties are anonymous). Thus, IMO the best anti-dote for "bullying" is anonymity and understanding on the part of the parties involved that anonymity will be maintained.

PS And if you ever find an anonymous interaction where one party committed suicide (again "anonymous" is the key word) I will say that there were other than just "bullying", significant emotional and mental health issues underlying such outcome. And there are probably more people killed while sailing or while being on the boat in any given year than people committing suicide after cyber bullying. Would that mean we should not be encourage sailing in general?

if you look a little deeper in to those cases of sucide you'll find that like most kids today the cyber world is all they live in. face to face contact is the healthy way to socialize. this forum is a convenient resource to get information.

socialize with people in the realtime world, at your location and you'll find a more fulfilling life.

Lance

[Polux]

Originally Posted by Rustic Charm

You put a lot of people on your ignore list don't you Rabbit. His suggestion wasn't being spiteful.

Truth is that if there was many like Boatman the forum would be an absolute confusion. That was regarding that possibility and obviously having the opinion that an equal behaviour should be demanded to all, that the poster in question made that suggestion.

But it seems that most of us consider that Boatie is a special case and moderators make allowances regarding his always in topic comments

But I can understand that someone has different opinions and make constructive propositions to maintain, as by the rules, posts on content without losing Boatie contribution, proposing what for him is a good solution, a solution he says it was tested with success in other forum.

It happens that we like things like they are and chose to maintain them, with the complicity of moderators, making of Boatie an exception just to maintain the threads less sterile, more social....and funny.

Not a reason to ostracize who have different opinions regarding that

[Island Time O25]

Originally Posted by tinkrman69

if you look a little deeper in to those cases of sucide you'll find that like most kids today the cyber world is all they live in. face to face contact is the healthy way to socialize. this forum is a convenient resource to get information.

socialize with people in the realtime world, at your location and you'll find a more fulfilling life.

Lance

Bingo!

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Polux

Truth is that if there was many like Boatman the forum would be an absolute confusion. That was regarding that possibility and obviously having the opinion that an equal behaviour should be demanded to all, that the poster in question made that suggestion.

But it seems that most of us consider that Boatie is a special case and moderators make allowances regarding his always in topic comments

But I can understand that someone has different opinions and make constructive propositions to maintain, as by the rules, posts on content without losing Boatie contribution, proposing what for him is a good solution, a solution he says it was tested with success in other forum.

It happens that we like things like they are and chose to maintain them, with the complicity of moderators, making of Boatie an exception just to maintain the threads less sterile, more social....and funny.

Not a reason to ostracize who have different opinions regarding that

Whoa.. no exceptions.. happy the way it is thank you very much..

[Polux]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Or.. it could be the case that cruising Catamarans are still relatively young to the market.. and passed through a teething phase which saw a few capsizes that started the 'Legend'...
When one considers that the UK has been in the Metric system nearly as long and folk still talk in pounds and ounces.. you've a lot of years of wisecracks to go...
As a former Cat owner (Wharram's..!! even Cat owners slag them) I just do not understand the over reaction.. are there not bigger things in life to get stressed about than what someone thinks about your boat or how you sail..?
I would suggest Marley's 'Two little birds.. sat by my window..!! to Chill you out.. but seagulls make a helluva mess..

You should not make that, it ruins your reputation. You are supposed to be always of topic and do not make constructive remarks.

I believe the big problem with cats and monohulls is them having segregated forums here, like if they were not all sailboats and if one could not have indifferently a multihull or a monohull and change between them as his next boat. I know of cases were changes were made on the two ways.

Segregation is always bad in what regards to create unidimensional and biased views regarding the other group.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Whoa.. no exceptions.. happy the way it is thank you very much..

Boatie, whatever you say you are an exception. There is nobody like you aroundand yes it seems that most of us like the things as they are in what regards you.

[unclemack]

Originally Posted by tinkrman69

"if you look a little deeper in to those cases of sucide you'll find that like most kids today the cyber world is all they live in. face to face contact is the healthy way to socialize. this forum is a convenient resource to get information.

socialize with people in the realtime world, at your location and you'll find a more fulfilling life."



Schoolchildren bully other schoolchildren realtime, workers bully co-workers realtime, managers bully subordinates realtime - the internet isn't the cause of bullying, it's just another arena.

Educating the bullies and providing appropriate sanctions will prevent bullying.
Suggesting the bullied person should avoid the bullies is easier - but a cop-out.

[Gadagirl]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Whoa.. no exceptions.. happy the way it is thank you vegry much..

I am very happy with Boatman's comments, on or off topic they are gems! Always love the off handed, thought provoking, provocative,humorous, insight of his and others as well. To relinquish that would leave us dry, parched like the dry gin he enjoys. This is my opinion and I am not attacking anyone personally.

[Ribbit]

Originally Posted by unclemack

Schoolchildren bully other schoolchildren realtime, workers bully co-workers realtime, managers bully subordinates realtime - the internet isn't the cause of bullying, it's just another arena.

Educating the bullies and providing appropriate sanctions will prevent bullying.
Suggesting the bullied person should avoid the bullies is easier - but a cop-out.

Moving to the City I was a 'Country Bumpkin' as a kid, and had a terrible problem with bullies. I was vulnerable because I couldn't work out what the heck was going on.

Then one day the headmaster spotted what was going on, and called me to his office for a chat. When there, he explained the Real World[tm] to me, and assured me that it was ok to fight back.

So I did, and punched their lights out for them.

That's the ONLY lesson bullies understand. I never had a problem with bullies after, if they started in on me, they'd end up running away and keeping well clear of me from then on.

“The notion that you can somehow defeat violence by submitting to it is simply a flight from fact. As I have said, it is only possible to people who have money and guns between themselves and reality.” George Orwell

George understood the Real World[tm], and when the chips are down, thinking it's all butterflies and rainbows, just gets people killed.

[Rustic Charm]

Originally Posted by Ribbit

Moving to the City I was a 'Country Bumpkin' as a kid, and had a terrible problem with bullies. I was vulnerable because I couldn't work out what the heck was going on.

Then one day the headmaster spotted what was going on, and called me to his office for a chat. When there, he explained the Real World[tm] to me, and assured me that it was ok to fight back.

So I did, and punched their lights out for them.

That's the ONLY lesson bullies understand. I never had a problem with bullies after, if they started in on me, they'd end up running away and keeping well clear of me from then on.

“The notion that you can somehow defeat violence by submitting to it is simply a flight from fact. As I have said, it is only possible to people who have money and guns between themselves and reality.” George Orwell

George understood the Real World[tm], and when the chips are down, thinking it's all butterflies and rainbows, just gets people killed.

Oh dear, , in this day and age and he's actually advocating violence.