Gender roles in sailing and cruising

[S/V Alchemy]

My previous boat was mine alone. When we got a boat capable of oceanic passagemaking, we got it in both our names and sized to the largest size suitable to purpose, which my petite wife could handle at a 0300h watch in a part-gale. Because that's the reality of the sea: one's plumbing is of no concern to an indifferent sea that will drown both sexes with alacrity should their skills and experience be lacking.

[atmartin]

The worst boating sexism I've seen is from weekend warriors with lousy docking skills. 99/100 it's a scared, incompetent husband driving while berating his terrified wife who's stuck handling the dock lines. It's super uncomfortable to help these people dock. You want to give the guy a piece of your mind, but since they're a 'customer', you're not supposed to.

I've seen these roles reversed only once, with a repeat customer. Middle-aged couple on a 50-ish ketch. The husband drove, but the wife was very much in charge. She would equal parts emasculate and direct him from the foredeck. Fun change of pace to see the abuse run 180.

For our part, all logistical decisions and ownership are split as partners. I perform most of the traditional "men's work", but she brings home most of the bacon. When she's working full time, I work less hours (because I earn less) so I do most of the domestic chores: maintenance, cooking, provisioning. For our generation, soft skills pay higher than the trades, so it's better for only one of us to specialize in each.

[gamayun]

Guys, just ask yourselves this - would you let your partner take the boat out by herself with her friends? If you can say, heck yeah, then that's parity.

[Macblaze]

Originally Posted by gamayun

Guys, just ask yourselves this - would you let your partner take the boat out by herself with her friends? If you can say, heck yeah, then that's parity.

Let?

That's definitely not parity.

[gamayun]

Originally Posted by Macblaze

Let?

That's definitely not parity.

You're starting to get my point about most couples that I meet who have a boat.

[Franziska]

Funny enough in our case it's the reversal of the usual, which provides amusement from time to time.
My boyfriend is crew and still growing his sea legs while I'm owner and skipper.
Striking that people always think the man is the owner and captain...

[lordgeoff]

Originally Posted by Jammer

About a year ago, I was reading a well-known book, and introduction to cruising. The author was one of a well-known man-woman couple who have been cruising for years. It was an enjoyable read, and there were little hints here and there that the author was part of an egalitarian, highly functional couple. There was a section on decision making and on how the two of them dealt with the inherent tension between the need to have only one captain and the importance of both being involved in decisions.

That sort of stuff really warms my heart. I read on.


There was a section about emergencies where the author revealed that part of their contingency plan was a notarized document stating that she would have the authority to operate the boat worldwide in the event he were to become incapacitated. That was necessary because, well, the boat belonged entirely to him.


Reading that, for me, was sort of like finding out that there isn't really a Santa Claus.


So, is that what it's like out there in cruising land? Traditional male-led relationships? Sometimes carefully papered over with a thin layer of egalitarianism and feminism?


Is that a reflection of society at large?


Or is there something about cruising that attracts strong men and women who are willing to accept a voyage where they are not a full partner?

Pink and Blue jobs.
Same as on shore.
For example anything to do with clearing blocked dunnies is always Blue.
Not sure how or why.
It is just a Fact of Life.
Like Gravity and stuff.

[Souzag818]

Originally Posted by Jammer

About a year ago, I was reading a well-known book, and introduction to cruising. The author was one of a well-known man-woman couple who have been cruising for years. It was an enjoyable read, and there were little hints here and there that the author was part of an egalitarian, highly functional couple. There was a section on decision making and on how the two of them dealt with the inherent tension between the need to have only one captain and the importance of both being involved in decisions.


That sort of stuff really warms my heart. I read on.


There was a section about emergencies where the author revealed that part of their contingency plan was a notarized document stating that she would have the authority to operate the boat worldwide in the event he were to become incapacitated. That was necessary because, well, the boat belonged entirely to him.


Reading that, for me, was sort of like finding out that there isn't really a Santa Claus.


So, is that what it's like out there in cruising land? Traditional male-led relationships? Sometimes carefully papered over with a thin layer of egalitarianism and feminism?


Is that a reflection of society at large?


Or is there something about cruising that attracts strong men and women who are willing to accept a voyage where they are not a full partner?

WHAT??? Whadaya mean there isn't a Santa Claus???

[Shrew]

My wife and I have been together for so long, we literally started together with nothing. Everything is in our names except the boat. The boat isn't in her name because whenever we pass papers, she is usually not present. It's OUR boat. She is insured as an operator of the boat as well.

It's as simple as that.

[alaskaflyfish]

Why anyone would concern themselves on how other people conduct their interpersonal relationship is beyond me. I didn't realize there was a relationship rule book. This post seems like a bunch of beta males conspiring on how to best save a damsel in distress. Here is a hard fact: people are in relationships because they want to be, and they like it that way. Their inter-relationship roles are decided by them and work for them based on strengths and deficits. Nobody else's business.

[Macblaze]

Originally Posted by alaskaflyfish

This post seems like a bunch of beta males ...

This phrase always make me seriously wonder about the world. And grunt. I always grunt just reassure myself I can still play with the big boys.

[jasbee]

Obviously going on the huge number of posts on this subject, it is certainly one that resonates with very many cruising couples.
In our case, I had owned the boat for 6 years before I met my partner 10 years ago. I had had much more sailing experience, so it was natural that decisions that related to navigation and sailing were usually made by me, but often not without discussion. In some situations such as anchoring she takes the helm and I deal with the anchor and windlass, simply because of the physical differences and relative strengths. We have an arrangement of hand signals which works well and is infinitely superior to the stereotypical he and she shouting at each other from a distance and which neither of them can hear!
She looks after all the domestic arrangements and I defer to her decisions - although I share some of the chores.
As regards repairs and maintenance, we share these. However, where there are repairs needed, I usually take the initiative using my very limited knowledge, but she is an enthusiastic helper. Obviously in some situations, 4 hands are better than 2 - especially when one of them is supporting one's body when leaning over a bilge!! In boating this is not an unusual phenomenon!
Sometimes we disagree but we always resolve the differences before they could put the boat in jeopardy. And I am not always right!
We sailed the NE New Zealand coast before going offshore in 2011. Since then we sailed eventually to Thailand and, although the experiences were not all beer and skittles, we are grateful to have had the experience and will remember it all (good and not so good) for the rest of our lives. This shared experience has brought us closer together.

[thomm225]

Gender roles in Sailing are definitely changing with the ties.

Back in the day (1992-2006) in Beach Cat Racing you might see one or two Female Skipper in an entire season over say 25-30 regattas both buoy and long distance 100-300 miles

Many of us had female crews but today you have Female Skippers with Female Crew, Female Skippers with Male crew, and Male Skipper with Female Crews

This on boats that pitchpole, flip, and have tremendous amounts of sail area as compared to displacement and that can hit of speeds near 25, 26 knots.

Example:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSYCz7gePBU

[Souzag818]

I don’t really understand how a cruising couple can function with ‘blue’ and ‘pink’ jobs. When there is only two of you on board, I think it’s dangerous to not have both crew equally able to perform ALL tasks. This doesn’t mean being equally capable in all functions, but I just shake head in disbelief when I hear about cruising couples where “he” must be on the helm, and “she” can’t steer, reef or manage the anchor. This seems like a formula for disaster.

I worked at a marina for two years and witnessed many a docking going wrong. In all of them-yes ALL of them- the man was at the helm, and the woman was tying off, and was physically unable to prevent a crunch. Usually it ended up with the husband yelling at his wife cause it had to be her fault. I actually intervened once when this woman looked like she was ready to burst into tears after her husband berated her. I told her she didn't do anything wrong and he screwed up the approach, then told him the same thing in a little more stern voice. He wasn't too happy about it, but I couldn't just sit there... Never saw a woman at the helm screw docking up. I believe women tend to finesse a boat in, men tend to horsepower it. Had one couple come into a dock when it was blowing pretty hard. The woman was at the helm and I asked if she wanted any help and she didn't even look at me she was so focused. She brought that boat in perfectly, stopped it a foot from the dock, and her husband stepped off and cleated it. Neither one said a word to each other. They both knew their roles, and when they were secure I told them how refreshing it was to see a couple so in sync. They both looked at me with dis-belief and laughed. He said they figured out a long time ago that she was the better helms-person, so every docking was her job. Told them they should give lessons...

[Shrew]

Originally Posted by alaskaflyfish

..... This post seems like a bunch of beta males conspiring on how to best save a damsel in distress.

I think maybe you're not using 'beta male' in the correct context here. A Beta Male wouldn't be in the business of 'saving a damsel in distress'.

Also, a POST is an individual contribution. A Thread is a collection of posts on a subject. One cannot have a 'bunch' of males contributing to a single POST. That would be a series of posts in a thread.

Also, I don't see any 'Alpha Male's posts in this thread either. I'm not at all clear at what you're getting at.

Yes, these words have meaning and their meaning is important in the context of a discussion.