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Old 18-01-2011, 19:32   #16
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i doubt that it would be an intentional design change but it could be an unapproved construction method, poor quality control and installation...it oculd have been a BLUE Monday boat... it happens. but the builder should be steppin up, or the insurance should pay.. one or the other...

there is a lot of unknown here, but the broker, builder, and designer should have been in that court room, and the main issue to the court would have been for the insurance company to prove thier position....

but a good leagl team would have brought sufficient evidence to prove that the boat was built to specs and there for a laten defect, or to prove the builder OR designer oooppsss

it is a formidable challenge but the responsibile defendants would have figured it out and settled, but as the case is seperate, it leaves a lattitude for the defendants to baffle by confusion and use the system and process to create financial hardship..
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Old 18-01-2011, 19:51   #17
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interesting that this hatch is about 2 feet above the water line
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Old 18-01-2011, 21:54   #18
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The devil is in the details and I've a feeling we're not being told a number of important ones. Like the manufacturer of the vessel and what country they are incorporated in.

And how the builder and sales agent complied or didn't comply with US state and fedearl warranty laws, in particular regarding latent defects.
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Old 19-01-2011, 00:03   #19
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what i find odd is the lack or warranty.... at the least, unless of operator err or other vnedor equipent, there would be warrnty/liability involved....i wish i knew how to search for leagl stuff, and get the case and read it...

I really want to emphathize with the op, but there is a lot of issues here that should have supported him...
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Old 19-01-2011, 11:13   #20
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The boat is an Aventure. We had a one year hull warranty but the builder has not accepted that the hatch just failed. He also denied that there was a warranty in an affadavit but we had an email and proved that there was one. We have been in litigation against the builder for 2.5 years and he has refused to particpate. A year ago tomorrow we were granted summary judgement against the builder and we are still waiting for the award order from the same Federal District Court that found for the Insurance Company. We will try and collect from the builder but don't hold much hope.
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Old 19-01-2011, 11:38   #21
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I can't comment on this particular case, but I have talked to numerous cruisers, using various insurance companies, who have had great difficulty with major insurance claims and/or warranty claims.
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Old 19-01-2011, 11:59   #22
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the good news, if what you say is correct, is that the boat builder will owe interest on the money when you do collect from the date of the judgement...

He should also be liable for court costs... your attorney should be more then happy to go after him on contingency basis, unless there is fear of BK or going out of business...

A judgment in hand is gold to atty...

You should be able to go to court and get demand order and be able to get lien rights, (based on US laws), which if the boat builder is selling in the US would need to comply..

btw: what did the boat builder believe was the cause??? and did the court agree? Seems the builder might have lost some credibility with the warranty issue....


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The boat is an Aventure. We had a one year hull warranty but the builder has not accepted that the hatch just failed. He also denied that there was a warranty in an affadavit but we had an email and proved that there was one. We have been in litigation against the builder for 2.5 years and he has refused to particpate. A year ago tomorrow we were granted summary judgement against the builder and we are still waiting for the award order from the same Federal District Court that found for the Insurance Company. We will try and collect from the builder but don't hold much hope.
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Old 19-01-2011, 12:51   #23
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interesting that this hatch is about 2 feet above the water line
It seems, but clearly when running it was getting a steady stream. Clearly, it was getting some serious impact. I have never seen a hatch in that location (generally aft and on the hulls). Most cats, at least once in a while, take serious hits there.

I'm not in favor of hatches. I think the risks outweight the perceived benifit, unless the hatches are much better engineered than those I have seen.
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Old 20-01-2011, 04:43   #24
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the good news, if what you say is correct, is that the boat builder will owe interest on the money when you do collect from the date of the judgement...

He should also be liable for court costs... your attorney should be more then happy to go after him on contingency basis, unless there is fear of BK or going out of business...

A judgment in hand is gold to atty...

You should be able to go to court and get demand order and be able to get lien rights, (based on US laws), which if the boat builder is selling in the US would need to comply..

btw: what did the boat builder believe was the cause??? and did the court agree? Seems the builder might have lost some credibility with the warranty issue....
I would not get my hopes up just because you have a judgment does not mean your gonna collect a dime, the compney can go out of biz tomorow and reopen the next day under a different name and you get nothing
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Old 20-01-2011, 07:10   #25
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The devil is in the details and I've a feeling we're not being told a number of important ones...
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interesting that this hatch is about 2 feet above the water line
Indeed.
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Old 20-01-2011, 08:20   #26
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I would not get my hopes up just because you have a judgment does not mean your gonna collect a dime, the compney can go out of biz tomorow and reopen the next day under a different name and you get nothing
im not sure what purpose editing my comments out and then retyping them again in your own words serves, but I will repost my origina unedited comment..

Quote:
He should also be liable for court costs... your attorney should be more then happy to go after him on contingency basis, unless there is fear of BK or going out of business...
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Old 21-01-2011, 02:21   #27
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You may have noticed that the moderators have removed the link to our blog that gives the details of what happened to us at the hands of this unscrupulous insurance company. I can't really see what good is served by preventing you the cruising community from knowing these predators are out there and properly identifying them. We stand to lose a fortune and I would like nothing more than to know none of you will ever buy insurance from this company again but I would feel remiss if I did not do all of I could to at least warn you of their practices. If you want the link to our blog and the whole story PM me and I will provide it.
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Old 21-01-2011, 03:07   #28
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BTW - the boat is now for sale

National Liquidators - 2005 Aventure Catamaran Bahamas 50, 50 ft. - National Liquidators
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Old 21-01-2011, 09:44   #29
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I took Intentional Drifter's advice and sent an email to Lavranos Designers. We'll see if they respond. Thanks for the help.
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Old 21-01-2011, 12:03   #30
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i am sorry that you are having to go thru all this.. you really seem to have dont nothing wrong, but, again, the devil is in the details, and your blog seemed to be less then fair.. which is why i am guessing the link was removed...

if you could post actual court documents with 'facts' as determined by courts, that maybe your blog would be ok, but as it is, it was only filled with your 'side'... which i understand, and understand your intent to warn others and or minimize the companies income...

pretty much what i would do to be honest...

anyways, I wish you the best, and hope that you can recover from teh builder and broker that sold you the boat... I really think you need better attorneys...btw

bill
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