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Old 08-06-2013, 13:01   #16
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Re: when it comes to Liferafts can too big be a problem

liferafts and comfort, not words I normally expect to be discussed together
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Old 08-06-2013, 13:07   #17
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Re: when it comes to Liferafts can too big be a problem

i had valais protected in a locker, and heard deck mounted ones are wave bait only makin' neptune hungrier after munching down the tasty appetizer.
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Old 08-06-2013, 13:22   #18
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pirate Re: when it comes to Liferafts can too big be a problem

I'd recommend a Survival at Sea course as well.. if you've never done one... its odds on when the raft opens it'll flip upside down... the knowledge and ability to right it is not some thing you want to be learning the hard way... at a bad time...
If your going offshore any distance go for the Ocean... how cheap is your life..? you need a raft with an accessible good strong point you can attach a drogue to... The main cause of life rafts being rolled is spinning... stop that and your good.. your also not thrown about so much...
another good reason for big is there may be times you have someone else with you for a weekend sail or something. CO'2 builds up quick in there when your all zipped in to keep the weather out... and you spiral down fast..
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Old 08-06-2013, 13:25   #19
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Re: when it comes to Liferafts can too big be a problem

Lets keep the squabbling and bickering to when we have to actually get into the liferaft

I have edited and deleted some posts. If you are not sure why the CF rules are here:
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Old 08-06-2013, 13:44   #20
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Re: when it comes to Liferafts can too big be a problem

So it seems that the consensus is that bigger is OK!

I have 2 hopes 1) That I never have to find out.
2) If I do I can report here

Thanks for the input!
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Old 08-06-2013, 14:14   #21
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Re: when it comes to Liferafts can too big be a problem

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Originally Posted by NorthPacific View Post
So it seems that the consensus is that bigger is OK!

Thanks for the input!
Put me down in the "they can in fact be too big" camp. . . . . For three reasons (all already mentioned) . . . (A) simple lifting/launching weight, (B) less stable in big seas/winds . . . This is a real and actual concern . . . Was a problem with the bounty rafts for instance, and (C) your ability to relight the raft if it inflates upside down . . . Which they can and in fact do do.

Now, where the line is for "too big" on point(A) will depend on crew strength and life raft mounting. Where it is for (B) will depend on the raft's own ballast system (some have significant water ballast bags and others have none). And where it is on (C) will again depend on crew strength/weight/skill.

I would guess, but don't have enough knowledge to say for sure, that "one size up" would usually be ok on all three points.
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Old 08-06-2013, 14:31   #22
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Make sure everyone on board can lift the raft where it is stored. I purchased a 4 person raft and removed my water heater to allow storing it in a deep lazarette.... Well, I then had my wife try dead lifting it out of there with horrible results. I tried myself and struggled to lift the thing up and out.... Not safe!

Now the dang raft has to ride on the cockpit floor while we are on passage and only gets stored when we are in port. I want my cockpit floor back! I really wish I purchased a canister and mounted it on the stern of the boat. In ten years when it's time to replace, I guess I'll have my chance to correct this issue

Anyone want a 5 month old Revere offshore 4 person?
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Old 08-06-2013, 14:50   #23
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pirate Re: when it comes to Liferafts can too big be a problem

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Originally Posted by funjohnson View Post
Make sure everyone on board can lift the raft where it is stored. I purchased a 4 person raft and removed my water heater to allow storing it in a deep lazarette.... Well, I then had my wife try dead lifting it out of there with horrible results. I tried myself and struggled to lift the thing up and out.... Not safe!

Now the dang raft has to ride on the cockpit floor while we are on passage and only gets stored when we are in port. I want my cockpit floor back! I really wish I purchased a canister and mounted it on the stern of the boat. In ten years when it's time to replace, I guess I'll have my chance to correct this issue

Anyone want a 5 month old Revere offshore 4 person?
Just fit a shelf on the stern where you'd mount the canister type.. and strap I on there.. then your ready when your canister comes
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Old 08-06-2013, 15:17   #24
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Just fit a shelf on the stern where you'd mount the canister type.. and strap I on there.. then your ready when your canister comes
I was thinking of that, but not sure how the salt water will impact the valise case and contents before I get it repacked into a canister. The raft is suppose to be vacuum sealed, and the hard canisters aren't waterproof, so not sure what the real difference is.... Maybe just UV and puncture protection?

When I have to repack it in three years, I'm sure I can purchase a canister at that point.
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Old 09-06-2013, 08:36   #25
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Re: when it comes to Liferafts can too big be a problem

Please relax and roll with the punches
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Old 09-06-2013, 08:48   #26
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Re: when it comes to Liferafts can too big be a problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by estarzinger View Post
Put me down in the "they can in fact be too big" camp. . . . . For three reasons (all already mentioned) . . . (A) simple lifting/launching weight, (B) less stable in big seas/winds . . . This is a real and actual concern . . . Was a problem with the bounty rafts for instance, and (C) your ability to relight the raft if it inflates upside down . . . Which they can and in fact do do.

Now, where the line is for "too big" on point(A) will depend on crew strength and life raft mounting. Where it is for (B) will depend on the raft's own ballast system (some have significant water ballast bags and others have none). And where it is on (C) will again depend on crew strength/weight/skill.

I would guess, but don't have enough knowledge to say for sure, that "one size up" would usually be ok on all three points.
I'm also in the go smaller camp for similar reasons as Evans.

As it is, 4 man is twice what you need while a 6 man is three times. Why compound potential problems!
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Old 10-06-2013, 10:21   #27
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Re: when it comes to Liferafts can too big be a problem

Wotname,

I agree with Evans, too. People find the "2 Man" size EXTREMELY cramped, and comfort over the [not too well known] increment in safety.

The extent of safety one chooses comes for me under the heading of individual choice of acceptable risk. It is difficult for people to weigh a not too well known increment in safety....so they choose comfort, and likely will never have to test it. Actually, one might have to huddle together for warmth!

If one is extremely dedicated to safety, one carries a raft; some countries don't require it, others do.

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Old 10-06-2013, 11:38   #28
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Re: when it comes to Liferafts can too big be a problem

in my experience , 4 in a 4 man is two small, a 6 man is about right, any bigger an there isnt enough weight

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Old 12-01-2014, 16:05   #29
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Re: when it comes to Liferafts can too big be a problem

Really though, who cares about comfort? If you're at the point where the weather / sea state is that bad you've lost your boat being cramped in a 4 or flying around in a 6 is the least of your worries. (I'd take cramped).

I've done the Sea Survival course and they are HORRIBLE places to be. Rafts actually work better when you are tightly packed in there, you roll around less and feel better because of it. The last thing I'd want on top of being in a crazy storm is being thrown around / rolled in a larger raft.

We're talking about pure survival at this point, not somewhere nice to hang out for a few hours and play cards.

After 30mins in that raft (and this was in a swimming pool) everyone felt sick, tired and horrible. I can't imagine what it would be like trying to survive in one in bad seas, but trust me comfort isn't going to be something you have regardless of size.
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Old 12-01-2014, 16:11   #30
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Re: when it comes to Liferafts can too big be a problem

Quote:
Really though, who cares about comfort? If you're at the point where the weather / sea state is that bad you've lost your boat being cramped in a 4 or flying around in a 6 is the least of your worries. (I'd take cramped).
Have you every been with 3 other men in a 4 person liferaft, I have, its not pleasant or even safe in my opinion. Yes everyone gets seasick in a raft. its why its not recommended to drink or feed someone right away.

even a 6 man isn't that big for four "big lads" . but its about the most you want to handle in a blow to re-right.

PS if your life aft doesnt have ballast pockets and a drogue, consider it useful for sailing in a swimming pool. Theres a very useful icelandic review/study on life rafts that informed SOLAS.

dave
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