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Old 06-04-2019, 07:11   #1
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Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

New boat for me (3 months counting now) and very steep learning curve as we all know! I look to the wisdom of the forum for your views on this:

The headsail furlers are old (30+ years) and I can't identify a brand on them. There is no swivel mechanism at top the forestay. The sail is hoisted, it latches at the top of the mast and then a trip up the mast is required to release the halyard. In more detail:

The halyard attaches to a Sliding Piece that rides up the extrusion (but is keyed to and rotates with the extrusion). The head of the sail is attached to the bottom of this Sliding Piece. At the top of the forestay there is a fixed Top Piece with a spring loaded latch. The sail is hoisted until the Sliding Piece latches onto the Top Piece. It is then necessary to climb up the mast and release the halyard to furl the sail. To drop the sail I need to go up the mast, attach a halyard and release the Latch (I've tried to attach a photo).

Has anyone seen a system operate in this way? Did old furlers work like this or might I be missing parts? Is this a reasonable way to handle the sail? A new furler would be nice but I am trying to understand the situation before making such a sizeable investment!

Thank you all for any ideas or comments, and sorry for the longish post!
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Old 06-04-2019, 07:40   #2
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

Two things come to mind. #1 is that some fool tried to save money and rigged a very dangerous system out of something that was not designed for it, or #2, you are missing something in the technique and you can actually lower the sail without climbing the mast. There must be a swivel or you could not turn the foil without wrapping the halyard, and that would not work at all. Thinking that there is no swivel makes me wonder if the bearings in the upper swivel are just rusted solid and it appears to not be made to turn. Bad bearings in roller systems is a pretty common problem. Better photos of both the upper and lower assembly would help someone identify it and help you out. Good luck. _____Grant.
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Old 06-04-2019, 07:44   #3
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

Thought #3. watch the classified section of this forum and craigslist and I think you will find lots of older roller gear for sale. New bearings make many older systems work fine and MUCH LESS COST than a new system. Just a thought. ____Grant.
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Old 06-04-2019, 11:37   #4
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

i have an older style furler - the guy i got the boat from had got as far as fitting it to the forestay but hadnt worked out how to make it work. Your rig is missing a tackle of some sort that allows a halyard up and down within the furl rig - on my one it meant fitting a temporary half of the halyard when lowered and removing it once raised. I doubt anyone has ever designed a furler that required climbing the mast to lower the sail.
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Old 06-04-2019, 17:20   #5
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

If I remember right there is a slide that you connect your halyard to. (You may or may not have it ) it fit on the furler one side was for raising the sail and if you turned it 180deg you would unlatch the sail by hitting the pin on the left side of your pictur. it would push the pin up to hit the latchng dog and you could lower the sail .not a good design
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Old 06-04-2019, 22:56   #6
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

Quote:
Originally Posted by B-Baysailer View Post
If I remember right there is a slide that you connect your halyard to. (You may or may not have it ) it fit on the furler one side was for raising the sail and if you turned it 180deg you would unlatch the sail by hitting the pin on the left side of your pictur. it would push the pin up to hit the latchng dog and you could lower the sail .not a good design


A couple of things to keep in mind:

My sail stays on the furler for years at a time.

It's not a bad idea to go up the mast occasionally and have a look at what's going on up there.

I tend to the opinion that it is not a bad design, keeps from having a halyard which just sits around coiled and deteriorating in the sun doing nothing useful except hold a sail up.
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Old 07-04-2019, 00:02   #7
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

Not a bad design until you are hit by that 50kt squall, a problem in the drum prevents furling, part of the jib blows and the flogging remains compromise the 30 yr old rig...
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Old 07-04-2019, 08:29   #8
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

That roller furler sounds a little inconvenient to me.
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Old 07-04-2019, 09:17   #9
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

Quote:
Originally Posted by charliehows View Post
i have an older style furler - the guy i got the boat from had got as far as fitting it to the forestay but hadnt worked out how to make it work. Your rig is missing a tackle of some sort that allows a halyard up and down within the furl rig - on my one it meant fitting a temporary half of the halyard when lowered and removing it once raised. I doubt anyone has ever designed a furler that required climbing the mast to lower the sail.
Any furler system that requires one to climb the mast in order to hank on or remove the sail would be anti thematic. The entire idea of the furling system is to simplify the sailing experience. I have a 35 year old sailboat with an original furler on it. The biggest problem I ever had was re-running the halyard as I redid the sheets across the board. The halyard for the furler jumped track and I had the yard retract it for me. The sail was run in a track on the furler and other than cleaning up the hanks, we have never had a problem.
Worst case scenario, I would suggest buying a new/older system to replace the one you have currently (provided you do not find the missing link). I’d also suggest that even if you are able to refurbish what you have, do a very thorough job of cleaning and regreasing the entire unit. Nothing like having a solid working furling system (especially one with sheet run to the cockpit). Definitely a lazy man’s dream but it also provides safety in given instances for crew that is asked to run forward when unexpected foul weather pops up. Of course, this is all just my perspective and others may have an entirely different point of view. Good luck with your efforts. Fair winds and following seas. Bruce V
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Old 07-04-2019, 09:28   #10
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

You are missing the trip line.
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Old 07-04-2019, 09:58   #11
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

I had a similar problem, result-wise, but the cause was different. Dry bearings. They were so dry that hauling on the furler line with a winch broke the stanchion block. No furler has ever been designed to work that way, though. Something like a trip line is missing. It doesn't look badly corroded, so I would imagine it can be made to work. Mine, I finally found a tiny hole in the swivel body where I could squirt some rigging oil and now it works GREAT! It is an ASAHI, old Japanese make, so there were no manuals, etc. to look up online.
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Old 07-04-2019, 11:52   #12
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

I have come across one of these and they are pretty useless . The is like the guy above said, a 3/32" trip line which goes up the second groove and you pull on it to release your jib. But you will sill have to attach a small halyard to that wire that is attached to the hook that holds the sail and swivel up the mast. So if there is no line you are in a dangerous situation in a big blow when you want to get rid of it . once pulled the sail should come down then the wire goes up the groove for re hoisting.
Get a new one as they are old as dirt and as dangerous. If you ever hit dirt it's the same result.Bad!!!

Bruce
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Old 07-04-2019, 15:35   #13
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

I used to work for a furler manufacturer.
I thought I’d seen them all, but this one is new to me.
The best cheap fix (other than adding the trip line) would be to get a used halyard swivel from another furling system, pull out the plastic inner slide/liner and make a new slide out of epoxy. You’d have to find a swivel large enough to fit over your extrusions, but that shouldn’t be hard.
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Old 07-04-2019, 15:39   #14
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

There is NO top swivel on this system, the design never included one.
what's missing is the trip mechanism to lower the sail.
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Old 07-04-2019, 16:15   #15
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Re: Older style furler requires climbing mast to lower sails?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bambooboat View Post
New boat for me (3 months counting now) and very steep learning curve as we all know! I look to the wisdom of the forum for your views on this:

The headsail furlers are old (30+ years) and I can't identify a brand on them. There is no swivel mechanism at top the forestay. The sail is hoisted, it latches at the top of the mast and then a trip up the mast is required to release the halyard. In more detail:

The halyard attaches to a Sliding Piece that rides up the extrusion (but is keyed to and rotates with the extrusion). The head of the sail is attached to the bottom of this Sliding Piece. At the top of the forestay there is a fixed Top Piece with a spring loaded latch. The sail is hoisted until the Sliding Piece latches onto the Top Piece. It is then necessary to climb up the mast and release the halyard to furl the sail. To drop the sail I need to go up the mast, attach a halyard and release the Latch (I've tried to attach a photo).

Has anyone seen a system operate in this way? Did old furlers work like this or might I be missing parts? Is this a reasonable way to handle the sail? A new furler would be nice but I am trying to understand the situation before making such a sizeable investment!

Thank you all for any ideas or comments, and sorry for the longish post!
Hey Buddy - google "Spin Tec Roller Furling" they used this "halyard lock" system (I have one on my boat) and it sounds like yours is just set up wrong. Hopefully, you will find a diagram to set yours up right. It is well worth the trouble as they are bloody marvelous. Good luck mate!
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