I wanted to provide an update as I've learned some hard lessons through the "process" of buying
an Origo stove/oven through the Defender website. Sorry in advance for the long post, but it has been a long time coming.
At first, Defender was very cheerful and helpful in helping me with my order. The first unit was scratched from one side to the other so I contacted Defender and asked if I could just get a replacement faceplate as this was scratched and I would be happy to replace it myself. They very courteously contacted Origo to learn that the faceplate was not a replaceable unit and worked with Origo to have them send me a replacement.
The replacement was in much worse shape than the original as not only was the box damaged, but the unit had a corner bent (pushed in), scratches, obvious damage, etc.
On the second time around that I contacted Defender, I spoke with a lady that was pleasant and said that I should have received paperwork for shipping the units back to Origo. I advised her that I did not receive this paperwork in either box and she said that she would get the info from Origo and contact me back.
After about a week I called Defender back and they acted like it was news to them that there was no paperwork for the return, but again advised that they would get the shipping info and get back with me.
I called again and spoke with a gentleman that I said I should ship the two units back and buy the Origo 6000 locally. He was very ugly about it so I said that I would be happy to do so, but didn't know of any place locally where I could purchase
Origo products. I advised him that I still had not received the paperwork for shipping the units to Origo and asked where I could buy an origo unit locally. He said that he would check on both of these questions ... drum roll ... never heard back from him.
Having Defender's phone
number now added to my phone
contacts, I called them several days later and spoke to a woman in customer service
that asked me if I knew what it cost to ship these units. I explained that I did since I had paid for the original $150 shipping charge. She then actually told me that with the shipping costs that Defender had lost
its profit margin and that it was a huge trouble to handle shipping these units. I did mention that she was in customer service, right? She told me
that I had to buy the units locally. We left the very nasty conversation with her letting me know that she would find the shipping information and call me back with it. Drum roll .... never heard back from her again.
At this point, I decided to contact Origo directly. My first E-Mail went to Kay at Swego, which was the wrong place, but was kindly forwarded to the service/warranty department. Now, so far the only information that Origo had received was from Defender so the first response was what one would expect under those circumstances.
I'm copying and pasting the E-Mail directly here:
Kay & Mr. Sanderson, I have spoken to Cassy at Defender extensively on this issue. (Remember everything being discussed here is being based on the information that I have been provided.) The first oven
the customer received according to Cassy only had a slight mark (ding) on the front so to be fair I sent another replacement. The second stove according to Cassy only had a mark on it made from the Styrofoam that could have been buffed out? At that point (see below) Defender made the decision to
ask the customer to purchase
from another (local) source so he could visually inspect it and be satisfied that it was OK. This has nothing to do with the cost of shipping as mentioned. Mr. Sanderson, I can not send you another oven until you ship back the two ovens you received through Defender. I need you to return the two stoves to us so we can examine them and make a determination for ourselves as to what is going on. We need to determine that there is a packaging problem/quality issue and will be glad to replace the oven with a new one and have our quality team solve the issue. BUT WE MUST GET THE OLD STOVES BACK FOR EVALUATION FIRST. The fact that you're still holding onto both units is causing a lot of problems. Please use our Fedex account# (Provided, But Deleted Here) to ship them back so you don't incur any shipping cost. Please write on the outside of the boxes Attn: Warranty Department, RA (# Deleted Here Too).
Here is my E-Mail response on a Thursday:
Thanks for the information. There was no paperwork in either of the units regarding return shipping and Defender said that they needed to get that information from you and would contact me with it. I didnít hear from them so I contacted them yesterday. They seemed surprised to learn there was no paperwork in the boxes even though I had mentioned that to them during a previous conversation and was told that I would be contacted with this information. Again, they said that they were going to get with you to get that information and contact me back. I have yet to be contacted by them on shipping Ė just so we are clear why I have both units onboard my boat. Trust me, on a boat they are quite in the way and Iím happy to send these back to you.
I just called a Fedex shop close to where I work and learned that they are open on Saturday from 9am Ė 4:30pm. I will deliver both units to this Fedex location on Saturday and will give them your Fedex account# (Fedex account# **Deleted**) to ship them back. I take it that I need no additional authorization or paperwork for them to bill the shipping to your Fedex account?
Federal Express Corporation
3736 Salisbury Road, Jacksonville
, FL 32216-6112
Saturday 9am - 4:30pm
Should that be shipped to your Florida
location? From your website I see that it is located at:
2000 North Andrews Avenue Ext.
Pompano Beach, Florida
How would you recommend that I ship the units back to you, i.e. ground, registered receipt, two-day, overnight, etc. Ė I donít want to incur unnecessary expense to your account and I believe from my experience with shipping that ground shipping to a commercial
location usually only takes two days, but you may want this shipped with receipt tracking.
As you note below, Iíll make sure to label the outside of the boxes with: Attn: Warranty Department, RA **Deleted**.
Iíll tape up the first unit and have already made sure that the damaged box is very well taped so it just needs the outside label.
Let me further explain the damage on both units since you donít seem to be getting the full story from Defender. The first unit had vertical scratches on the faceplate from the far left side to the far right side about a ľĒ high, which was clearly caused by packing due to the symmetrical vertical lines from one side to the other. The depth
of the grooves was my concern since you could feel the depth
with your fingers so I contacted Defender and asked if perhaps I could just get a replacement faceplate and would be happy to install it myself. Defender advised me shortly thereafter that they had checked with you and the part was not a replaceable one. I asked if the metal was stainless steel all the way through or plated as I would be concerned with rust in a marine environment
. They did not answer my question, but instead said that they would ship me another unit.
The second unit was received at my parentsí house, just as the first unit was (I live on a boat and this is the best location for delivery) and my father noted that the box was damaged. This was noted on the delivery
slip, which should be easily pulled for verification. I saw the damage and tried to look into the unit through the hole, but I really couldnít see the unit well that way. When I took the unit to the boat and opened it up, the top stove section wouldnít close and lock. I looked further and noticed that the right side was crushed in a bit. There were the same scratches on the front and also on the back, but the grooves were not deep to the touch so those could easily be buffed out, but the other damage from shipping made me want to ship the second unit back.
Defender said that they would check with you and get back to me, but again days went by with no word so I contacted them and was told to consider buying
the unit locally. I asked if there was a place where I could purchase the product locally as I wasnít aware this was an option for me, but no direct answer was given with only the usual deferment that the gentlemen with whom I spoke would get with the lady with whom I initially spoke and they would get back with me. The lady that initially
helped me was very friendly and helpful so I donít know if the message wasnít relayed to her or why I didnít receive a call yet again for several days.
Iíve purchased thousands of dollars of merchandise from Defender in only the past couple of years, but havenít dealt with them for a long timeframe like West Marine
and other maritime merchants with whom I have decades of relationship. The irony is that I was about to place an order for a good bit over $10,000 to finish outfitting my sailboat with them, but West Marineís prices are close enough that Iíll continue to buy from them instead after this experience. Iíve been pleased with your help, but Defender has been so focused on this single sale
that theyíve actually become harsh in dealing with me, alienating me as a customer. Theyíve actually pointed out to me that theyíve lost
their profit margin with the shipping costs and now just want me to return everything and buy from someone else. Iím inclined to agree with them, but I want to work this out one way or another as I really do believe you have the best product on the market and want to buy it.
After you have had a chance to inspect the units and are ready to ship a new unit to me, since you are so close to Jacksonville
perhaps I can help make delivery
easier for you. If you have a driver coming through Jacksonville, Iím happy to make arrangements to meet with them or work with you in any way to facilitate shipping to keep your costs down on this. If I know the day of delivery, I should be able to take another day off from work to meet the driver wherever would be most convenient.
Please feel free to call me Dennis. Again, I appreciate all of your help with this !!
- Barry replied:
Dennis, Please ship them back to the address below my name, Attn: warranty department RA **Deleted**-Two day or ground is sufficient.
I'm sorry for all the problems you've had with shipping damage to the ovens. When we receive the ovens they will be evaluated by our warranty technicians and quality manager to see how this can be corrected.
Origo products are stocked in the Elkhart Indiana warehouse so the replacement oven will ship the best method from there. Once we evaluate the ovens and determine what's going on, I will have a new oven shipped to you. Please provide the address that you want the oven shipped to including a phone number in case the carrier needs to contact you.
- I replied that I had the boxes taped and labeled and gave him my contact info for mailing the replacement unit as well as my phone number
- Once the units were received a few days later, Barry replied:
The ovens arrived and were inspected and your concerns were verified. I noticed the dents to the front, bottom, sides and the scratches, but also noticed that the outer glass was not centered causing the door to not open all the way. I have put in a new order (**Deleted** see PDF) that will ship tomorrow. I put in the notes to double box and strap to a small pallet for added protection. Please make sure to inspect the oven when you receive it and please let me know if you have any questions or concerns.
You should see your new oven by Monday. I put your phone number in the order notes in case the shipper needs to contact you.
- I received the unit and it was in excellent shape so I sent Barry the following E-Mail:
I wanted to touch base with you to let you know at just how pleased I am with my new Origo 6000 unit that arrived this week. It is not scratched up or damaged and I already have it onboard. Iíll be working this weekend to sand and varnish
some wood to install it on the gimbals. In the meantime, Iím going to go through your dealers list and find someone besides Defender to buy all of the accessories for it. This gave me a chance to check out your website to learn that you make the Cruisair
that I have aboard and have been enjoying trouble-free for almost a half decade now. The quality of your products makes buying them an easy choice, which is often not the case with marine merchandise. I canít begin to express my gratitude for how you stepped in, connected directly with me and made a loyal customer. I will gladly be sharing my experience and my enthusiasm for buying from your company both in forum thread and personal contact. Thank you so much for all of your help !!! Please
thank your team for their help in making this such a pleasurable experience !!!
- Barry replied:
I'm glad that you received your oven in good shape and this is finally a done deal. You may want to check out firstname.lastname@example.org
for you oven accessories. Your contact at that e-mail address will be Kay. I have had good luck dealing with them. Also thank you very much for your kind words. Being that I work in the service/warranty department, it is a rare thing to get a positive response. I understand that when people call or contact me they are already upset. Being a consumer myself I understand this. But in my years here I have always tried to stand behind my company and support the customer at the same time. May you have many years of use out of your Dometic products.
Again if you ever have any need to contact me, feel free to do so.