Is this "liveaboard" for insurance purposes?

[andypag]

Hi. Newby question. I've searched but can't find an answer.


I'm looking at buying my first boat, and as soon as I do I'll move onto it, ideally in the med, and spend a few months getting used to living on it. If I like it as much as I think I will I'll continue to live on it full time, but not based out of one spot.


I'm looking for insurance quotes at the moment, and was thinking that would class me as a "liveaboard". But is that right? Now I have a doubt that liveaboard is someone who lives out of a marina, or moored up in a canal. Am I asking for the right cover? Maybe what I need is cruisers insurance?


What if I change my mind and decide to only spend a few months onboard and then haul out and continue the journey the following year?



Also I'm hoping to get down to Greece and Turkey. Is there a reason insurance asks you how far east you're planning on being? Is there increased risk the further E and S you go?



I want to describe my situation accurately, but don't want to use the wrong terminology that leads to a higher premium for the wrong coverage. Any help/advice/expeirence/links welcome.



I'm getting quotes that are about 1% of the value of the boat. Does that seem right?

[hellosailor]

You already know the answer. If you have a residence somewhere on the land, you are not a liveaboard. If you're moving aboard the boat--as you say--and that's your primary or sole residence, then you're a liveaboard.

If you're a liveaboard but you maintain something that passes as a paper residence on land...you can fool the paperpushers but if you have to place a claim, they can cut you off for insurance fraud.

[andypag]

So are liveaboard premiums more expensive than cruising ones?

[SV Bacchus]

You should tell your insurance broker exactly what you told us and let him/her tell you what they think and why. You can then go with it or shop around for another broker.

We do have a house in Florida and we have a 42' cat. Our insurance broker asked if we are liveaboards. I explained we have a house but our plan was to take the boat and head to the islands. I explained this class of boat would accommodate us for 6 months, 9 months or possibly a year and that when we left we had no solid plans of when we would return. I speculated it would be at least 6 months but probably less than a year.

The broker listened intently and said "We are listing you as a liveaboard, safer as you will be covered in your somewhat fluid state of travel." I think he made a pun at the end but hey, we got the coverage to best suit us by laying it all out.

[Nicholson58]

Good advice above.

Are you an EU citizen? If not, you will have trouble staying in the EU for an extended time. Longer than 90 days is the issue. Many other threads on this here on the CF.

You will also need to pay VAT or buy a boat that has already paid it if you propose to keep it there.

[LACHLANC]

Originally Posted by Nicholson58

Good advice above.

Are you an EU citizen? If not, you will have trouble staying in the EU for an extended time. Longer than 90 days is the issue. Many other threads on this here on the CF.

You will also need to pay VAT or buy a boat that has already paid it if you propose to keep it there.

I agree with your point that if the OP isn't an EU resident he/she may have difficulty staying in the EU for longer than 90 out of any 280 day rolling period.

I disagree with your suggestion that he/she will need to buy a VAT paid boat to keep it in the EU. For s non-EU resident you can temporarily import s non VAT paid boat for up to 18 months and all you need to do is have a receipt of being out of the EU for a day and you can start the 18 meth period again. If the OP chose to become an residentin an EU country (& this was granted) he/she would effectively be required to have a VAT paid boat.

[Nicholson58]

Originally Posted by LACHLANC

I agree with your point that if the OP isn't an EU resident he/she may have difficulty staying in the EU for longer than 90 out of any 280 day rolling period.

I disagree with your suggestion that he/she will need to buy a VAT paid boat to keep it in the EU. For s non-EU resident you can temporarily import s non VAT paid boat for up to 18 months and all you need to do is have a receipt of being out of the EU for a day and you can start the 18 meth period again. If the OP chose to become an residentin an EU country (& this was granted) he/she would effectively be required to have a VAT paid boat.

You can temp import. Unfortunately you cannot stay as long as your boat (non citizens)

The rule on people is not 90 of 280. It is 90 of any rolling period of 180. This makes staying legally for a full annual cycle for safe hurricane transits impossible unless you spend extended periods outside the EU zone. Morocco, Israel, Croatia, Turkey or other. Many scofflaws ignore this at their own risk and tell you No Problem. Getting nabbed will cost a lot. There are a few treaties on which Americans can stretch the time if they stay in the correct countries in the correct order. Cary a copy of the treaty with you.

[sailorboy1]

I’m paying a little over 1% for insurance. Never have been asked if I was a live aboard or cruiser.

[LACHLANC]

The 280 day number was a typo - it was meant to be 180 and I should have checked more carefully. My point was that you made the claim that the boat was required to the VAT paid which was incorrect (unless the OP became an EU resident and your schengen point became null & void).

With reference to staying in the Med without residency in a Schegen country, many people do it easily using countries like Croatia & Turkey without having to revert to crossing the Atlantic.

P.S. Croatia is in the EU - I think you're confused with it not being part of the Schengen area.