Boat Swapping with other Yacht Owners?

[Pelagic]

I have heard of this and checked the web to see a few commercial sites.

I don’t know if they act as a booking agent as I would prefer to discuss cruising logistics, experience details/(with or without a local crew as helper?) , cruise suggestions etc... directly with a potential boat swapper

I hate anyone getting in the middle between the 2 beneficial owners as you need to develop a mutual trust.

1/ Has anyone ever done this with other similar valued or sized boats?

2/ With or without an Agency?

3/ Would you do it again?

I also wonder…. Is this perhaps a section to be identified in CF to bring likeminded cruisers together so they can PM each other with details?

Sounds like a great way to enjoy other areas and meet new friends

Just some thoughts.

[Ex-Calif]

This comes up periodically around here. Here are some recent threads.

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...mme-16137.html

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...wop-10064.html

Because your thought is specifically having a section to hook up with another like minded boater, I don't see any reason you could not post in the classifieds that you are interested in a boat swap.

[Pblais]

We have had numerous attempts at slip swapping threads. If you own the slip then it's perhaps a useful thing. Swapping boats seems a bit too much to me. Charter boats are designed to be used that way and they come more standard than custom.

Given that little things are always an issue on any boat even if not expensive or difficult. I don't know how you deal with problems encountered during a trip or after the trip. If you charged money it would be a charter so no insurance coverage, but if you did it for free I'm not sure what you would have.

[Pelagic]

Thanks Dan,

I read thru those Threads and found some other links within….. All with mostly positive enthusiasm about the potential of this concept, but with posters not sure how to get it started.

I am not suggesting just one kind of scenario with a boat to boat swap, or boat to condo swap, or whether it would/should be bareboat or accompanied, as there are too many variables to consider for each situation.

What I am suggesting is providing a “Meeting Place” within this active Forum.

Where likeminded people can look for and make initial contact with any private yacht Owners who expressed similar interest to swap for a limited period, recreational assets, rather than pay for commercial rental in a distant land, that usually gets heavy public use.

I am not suggesting a forum for chartering as that would be a commercial vendor and is not in the spirit of what this meeting place would be all about.

Perhaps Admin could consider adding a new directory to “The Fleet” (or wherever they preferred) called something like “Private Yacht-Time Swap”

Interested Parties could start individual threads about what they have to offer using a standard title = “Type-Location” format.

Then explain, Size, Age, cruising area with photo of boat or condo. Poster would then simply describe what interests they have in swapping with, level of marine experience and request that anyone interested with a suitable time-swap, SEND THEM A PRIVATE MESSAGE!

I would also suggest that we post a “Sticky” at the top giving advice on how to individually set this up in a secure and professional manner with others, but that CF takes no responsibility for any outcome (standard stuff).

For example; I am pretty much retired now but still quite active; I have a well found Schooner based in Subic Philippines as well as a private beach front Condo situated at a famous Dive Resort area in same country.

Both are quite unique and I would love to exchange some time with a boat/condo in a well placed situation anywhere in the world.

I am happy to start the ball rolling if Admin is willing to create a Meeting Place, where we could find each other, rather than them being lost under vague titles.

Look forward to feedback and consolidating these various Threads.

[David M]

I like the concept in general. The greatest downside I see is having a third party in the middle potentially blocking the communication of important information between the owners. The third party would need to allow the owners to freely communicate information to each other about the particulars of each others boats. Boats all have their differences and peculiarities that each party would need to know. A checkout with the owner of the boat onboard would also be a good thing.

Boats are not like cars where you can just go rent one and assume that they all work pretty much the same and if you don't know something you can look it up in the owners manual. Most private boats have been customized in some way to the owners tastes unlike charter boats which in general are left simple and easy for a charterer to come aboard and understand relatively quickly the different systems.

There is also the issue of insurance which might be difficult to obtain for such an arrangement. The insurance companies may charge a lot more possibly making the arrangement not cost effective. Charter companies have standardized boats and probably get lower rates because of economies of scale with insurance. Just speculating though.

I think the key would be the allowance of good communications between the two parties and being able to obtain relatively low insurance.

I could see someone starting an internet based business for this. Someone already has boatexchange.com

[Pelagic]

I googled and found a couple of businesses already trying to set up subscribed links between owners. (70 euro a year)


Like you, I’m not much into middlemen for the reasons you mentioned and I only hope we can consolidate this interest under one Directory and keep it simple!

Allow the beneficial owners to freely contact each other via PM

They will work out the details if interested to their mutual satisfaction, with some arrangements being more formal than others.

But I think it would be nice to provide some standard advice on how to protect oneself via a sticky.

I truly believe this could take off and become a nice feather in CF’s cap as a way for members to really share their passion for fun.

p.s Insurance issues can easily be handled by swapping parties putting up a security deposit (In Escrow) to cover damages or additional deductble issues

[Pblais]

But I think it would be nice to provide some standard advice on how to protect oneself via a sticky.

I think is more than a sticky. If people can work out the arrangements then that may be enough. CF really has no interest in endorsement of much of anything related to any deal that might work out. It's basically a mutual contract and the details are the burden of the parties. If it's not something you can handle on your own then I'm not sure a stickie note is really enough.

I do know of a house exchange that was started by a group of teachers. They swap homes and cars for periods of time like a month at a time. That organization charges a one time $100 fee and we have neighbors that have done it and thought it worked fine.

[Pelagic]

Originally Posted by Pblais

I think is more than a sticky. If people can work out the arrangements then that may be enough. CF really has no interest in endorsement of much of anything related to any deal that might work out. It's basically a mutual contract and the details are the burden of the parties. If it's not something you can handle on your own then I'm not sure a stickie note is really enough.

Not suggesting it is enough Paul, just some basic points for a member to consider (same as talk about wiring sizes) with the reader making their own judgements and taking full responsibility.

CF's role is nothing more than providing the medium

[Ex-Calif]

Pelagic - As you know I am just down the road in Singapore. I'd gladly swap my 25.5 footer with Stargazer. The only problem is I might never swap back - LOL.

My concern is that I have been to the couple of registries in the previous threads and the boat list never changes and so I really wonder about the viability of setting up a whole forum section on this.

I mean setting up the forum is not a big deal as the admins can always close it down if it doesn't work.

However - maybe it would be beneficial to get input from other memebers - You could set up a poll with something like:

I think swapping my boat with some one is a great idea
I would never swap my boat
I would only swap for a similar size and well found boat
I would be interersted but I have big reservations about damage
I would be interersted but I have big reservations about insurance
I would be interersted but I have big reservations about qualifications of swapper

You get the idea.

[Pelagic]

Dan, I am sure we will sail together one day!

I think the reason the commercial sites for this don’t grow is that the 50 and 70 Euro annual fee is hard to justify for something that is only an option if you find a comfortable Match with another owner (Also size or value doesn’t matter as you can always offset time… if the swap appeals to you)

By doing this freely via CF, where many of us have a posting history, the volume of boats/condos will build up as the choices become more attractive.

DavidM asked me to be patient so I won’t start a poll yet but if I did .....it would be much simpler than yours and not filled with so many negatives.

• Yes: I would like CF to create a Meeting Place for members to offer their private yacht as a holiday exchange option.
• No: I think it is a complete waste of time and I would never look at that site
• Maybe Yes: But I am concerned that I do not have the knowledge to carefully screen and securely set up an exchange first and would need some examples.

Dan I think that addresses the nitty-gritty and would be easily quantifiable

[David M]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

DavidM asked me to be patient so I won’t start a poll yet but if I did .....it would be much simpler than yours and not filled with so many negatives.

I don't mind at all if you start a poll. I would be curious to see the results as well.

[Pelagic]

Ok should I add it to this thread for continuity or start a new one?

[Ex-Calif]

Pelagic - You are asking a different question.

You ask - Should the mods set up a forum for this (why not? I don'thave to do anything)

I suggest the right question is:

Yes I would swap my boat
No I would not swap my boat
Maybe I would swap my boat

Without the need to swap boats there is no need for a forum - I know its a fine line.

Suggest you start a new thread with the poll.

[Pelagic]

You are right Dan and I will go with that …. I was focussing on getting an organised medium so that yacht owners can review possibilities and then make an informed decision.

But as you say...You need to show interest and intent before anything else.

Never done a poll on here before so hope I don’t screw up

[nautical62]

I know this isn't quite the kind of swap the OP here is looking for, but just thought I'd point out that owner's who purchase boats and put them into charter (with some companies) in fact swap with other owners in other locations regularly as a part of the agreement. Insurance is taken care of and there is a mutual understanding and procedures as to how boats are outfitted and maintained, even though they are privately owned.

You are obviously restricted to beginning and ending at charter bases but don't have to stick to the normal charter boat cruising areas. Two days after departing Road Town, Tortola, I was in Culebra, Spanish Virgin Islands. In the Bahamas, I've sailed north of Green Turtle Cay, the normal northernmost point for charter boats twice now on trade yachts.