repowering my sailboat- engine selection

[NorthCoastJoe]

Sounds like more trouble than it's worth. But if you want a Yanmar 2gm I have one for sale. Just did a valve job on it and cleaned out the water passages.

I would go with a 18" lift outboard mount. We used one on our Mac25 worked fine.

[Suijin]

I’d go for the 20. It really comes down to fuel efficiency and whether the 20 is going to waste fuel, but the difference will be small in engines that small. If you run the boat at the engine’s recommended cruising RPM you likely won’t be at hull speed and the engine won’t be underloaded.

As someone who has had to run their engine at full throttle for a few hours “in anger” I fully appreciate that it’s better to have the power and not need it than to need it and not have it.

[jen1722terry]

Interesting comments,

It is true that switching from O/B to inboard could be a can of worms. But if you're able and willing to do all or nearly all the labor yourself, we'll that can easily be 50-70% of a repower's cost.

Also, I'm not sure about certain new engines being "drop-in replacements." Even though we bought the same horsepower in our Beta, we had to make significant modifications. For example, the engine mounts had to be moved, the exhaust riser was too high and a special custom part had to be made to allow the shift lever to work normally (not backwards). There were probably more such items that I can't think of now.

Again, I did what you are proposing back in the 1980s on a 26-footer. As I got the diesel for free, it was really my labor and less than $1,000 in parts and materials (1980s dollars). I got as much free advice as I needed from local yards, friends and books. Even the designer of my boat was intrigued by the project and offered much advice. There was quite a bit of carpentry and glass-work to create a (somewhat) quieter engine compartment, 2 new thru-hulls, vents, the battery had to be moved and a fuel tank installed, but nothing all that difficult, just time, which I had back then. I really enjoyed the project but I was in my 30s when I did it. Being 70 now I would not even think of it.

Another bonus was the boat sold quickly when it was time to let her go.

Best of luck with the project.

Terry

[Mike Banks]

A sailboat hull designed for outboard motor propulsion is a completely different design to one for an inboard.

If you want to make life difficult for yourself just for the sake of it, try to convert either to a trimaran. There are all sorts of futile exercises costing big money.

One of my friends recently converted his diesel engined 29 footer worth about twelve thousand dollars to outboard propulsion. It cost him for a 20 horsepower Honda outboard with high thrust propeller and long leg--many times more more than it would have to recondition the Yanmar diesel engine gearbox clutch--all that was wrong with it. All he did was to render the vessel unsafe in a storm.

Apart from the cost of the outboard--he could only get half of what it would have been worth with the clutch fixed and the leaking diesel hoses replaced. Stupid is as stupid does, and the sea does not usually forgive stupidity..

[SteveSadler]

Hey Mike Thats a little harsh advise for a guy who is asking advise on a forum.
You're also wrong about sailboat hulls being designed for in or out motors. Either will work if it can be installed. However a laser may not have room for an inboard. Go sailing!

[Cat36Mahalo]

Go with a beta. I doubt you’ll get much more out of a 20 than a 14. My Catalina 36 only came with a 21hp and even 40yrs later pushes it at Hull speed

[fish53]

First let me say I want others to use what they feel is best. For me I hate outboards, for all the reasons most of us have heard before. There are some advantages certainly but for me they don't equate. Installing an inboard diesel in a boat that wasn't built for one isn't an insurmountable project. More than bolting a hideous bracket on the transom and hanging an obnoxious gas burner on it, of course. But like many boat projects done well you add to the value of the vessel and end up with what I believe is a better product. All this being said it is important that the one attempting a conversion such as this should have some related skills like working with fiberglass and some mechanical abilities. So I don't sound like I'm ignorant, yes I've done this as well as numerous engine installations in large and small
sail and power boats.

[thomm225]

I went the opposite way after two old diesels failed on my $2,000. Diesel to outboard was quite simple.

Rip out all the old diesel cramp then install a bracket and hang the outboard on it. Close raw water intake thruhull and fill in prop shaft thruhull with epoxy

Now to go the other way would be quite a pain.

You would need to buy and install the motor mounts, motor controls, muffler, water intake hose, water intake thruhull, wiring, zinc, prop shaft, stuffing box, prop shaft thruhull, prop, engine and gear box, level engine, fuel tank, fuel lines, start/engine control panel, etc

The OP is doing this on a $1,000 boat so there must be tons of other stuff that needs to be fixed or replaced so that would need to be considered also

[fish53]

Originally Posted by thomm225

I went the opposite way after two old diesels failed on my $2,000. Diesel to outboard was quite simple.

Rip out all the old diesel cramp then install a bracket and hang the outboard on it. Close raw water intake thruhull and fill in prop shaft thruhull with epoxy

Now to go the other way would be quite a pain.

You would need to buy and install the motor mounts, motor controls, muffler, water intake hose, water intake thruhull, wiring, zinc, prop shaft, stuffing box, prop shaft thruhull, prop, engine and gear box, level engine, fuel tank, fuel lines, start/engine control panel, etc

The OP is doing this on a $1,000 boat so there must be tons of other stuff that needs to be fixed or replaced so that would need to be considered also

I recently installed a new Kubota in my boat that I marinized myself and the cost was less than a 25hp outboard. Also I believe you're overstating the ancillary costs and not taking into account the possible increase of the boats value with a job well done. The work part is admittedly much, much more but some find this type of activity onerous and others like myself find it enjoyable and rewarding. A lot of this revolves around personal abilities and motivation, we're all different.

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by fish53

I recently installed a new Kubota in my boat that I marinized myself and the cost was less than a 25hp outboard. Also I believe you're overstating the ancillary costs and not taking into account the possible increase of the boats value with a job well done. The work part is admittedly much, much more but some find this type of activity onerous and others like myself find it enjoyable and rewarding. A lot of this revolves around personal abilities and motivation, we're all different.

You average $1000, 40yr old catalina jury rigged with a new diesel will likely be worth less than a new outboard when you are done.

If we were talking about a high end classic that goes for big bucks if in pristine condition maybe... if you just like working on boats...but your basic nothing special production boat, no it's not going add much of anything to the value.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by fish53

I recently installed a new Kubota in my boat that I marinized myself and the cost was less than a 25hp outboard. Also I believe you're overstating the ancillary costs and not taking into account the possible increase of the boats value with a job well done. The work part is admittedly much, much more but some find this type of activity onerous and others like myself find it enjoyable and rewarding. A lot of this revolves around personal abilities and motivation, we're all different.

First off, a 25 hp outboard is way to heavy to mount on the stern of a sailboat. ($4,000/about 200 lbs)

I bought a new 5 HP 4 stroke at $1,550/58 lbs. It's been on the boat now for about 7 years and does fine, but my first 4 sailboats did not have engines which helped me get by with so little horsepower possibly

As was mentioned, the PO's boat was bought for $1,000. It probably needs everything! Sails, halyards, bottom paint, to name a few. If you add the cost of a diesel to that you could have $10,000 - $15,000 in the boat before you ever sail it.

I have maybe $10,000 in mine after 8 years of use and that includes an old diesel, a new outboard, new mainsail, new (this year) dodger and mainsail cover, solar, brackets, controllers, inverters, paints, sewing equipment, autopilots, handheld compasses, Alps Mountaineering Sleeping Pads, etc

And you are not going to make any money on my boat or an old Catalina 27 when you sell it. You'd be lucky do get back half of what you put into it.

In my case though, a Bristol 27 could become THE boat that could take you anywhere if you can adjust to the small interior

[fish53]

Originally Posted by thomm225

First off, a 25 hp outboard is way to heavy to mount on the stern of a sailboat. ($4,000/about 200 lbs)

I bought a new 5 HP 4 stroke at $1,550/58 lbs. It's been on the boat now for about 7 years and does fine, but my first 4 sailboats did not have engines which helped me get by with so little horsepower possibly

As was mentioned, the PO's boat was bought for $1,000. It probably needs everything! Sails, halyards, bottom paint, to name a few. If you add the cost of a diesel to that you could have $10,000 - $15,000 in the boat before you ever sail it.

I have maybe $10,000 in mine after 8 years of use and that includes an old diesel, a new outboard, new mainsail, new (this year) dodger and mainsail cover, solar, brackets, controllers, inverters, paints, sewing equipment, autopilots, handheld compasses, Alps Mountaineering Sleeping Pads, etc

I thought I was clear when I said "I want others to use what they feel is best", you can create any number of scenarios that make owning or working on a boat too expensive. I do all my own work and enjoy it and the result. My current boat is a Cape Dory 28 that I got for free and now have possibly 7-8000 dollars in and it has a new 25hp diesel, new standing and running rigging along with numerous repairs and upgrades. What's it's market value now? I don't really know but I believe it's not less than I have in it minus my labor. Boating is a multifaceted activity, some build, some repair, some just go on the water and have no interest in the other.

[denverd0n]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I’d worry more about what fits and still gives you room to work on the thing and what it weighs.

This ^^^^^^


The other question is how you use the motor. If you're the type who prefers to sail as much as possible, and only uses the motor to get into and out of tight marinas, or for the last few moments when positioning an anchor, then lesser horsepower should be fine. If you want to be able to motor through headwinds and up-current on a regular basis, then you're going to want to go for more horsepower.


In any case, 20 horsepower is not an excessive amount for this boat. It leans towards the high end, but definitely not excessive. I wouldn't really say you're getting into the "excessive" range until you start talking 30 horsepower or more.

[fish53]

Originally Posted by denverd0n

This ^^^^^^


The other question is how you use the motor. If you're the type who prefers to sail as much as possible, and only uses the motor to get into and out of tight marinas, or for the last few moments when positioning an anchor, then lesser horsepower should be fine. If you want to be able to motor through headwinds and up-current on a regular basis, then you're going to want to go for more horsepower.


In any case, 20 horsepower is not an excessive amount for this boat. It leans towards the high end, but definitely not excessive. I wouldn't really say you're getting into the "excessive" range until you start talking 30 horsepower or more.

Not just if you prefer to sail but the area you do your sailing in. I live in Midcoast Maine and we have thousands of islands with narrow passages and quite a bit of tide so sometimes all you can do is motor and frequently against a current or wind. My 9000 lb. boat wouldn't do too well in those circumstances with a six horse outboard.

[thomm225]

It might be cheaper just to buy a Catalina 27 that already has the diesel mounted. There are tons of them for sale from anywhere between $4,000 - $12,000 and up that already have a diesel. (plus lots of other good equipment)

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/198...owse%20listing