Pushing the budget

[SeaSiren50]

Hey Chris,

If you can, get the Antares, put it in a yacht charter or SailTime/Airbnb while you get it ready and recoup the extra 150K. Best of both worlds, getting all the bugs out of the way and having the boat of your dreams and a tax write off.

Never compromise.

N.

[JPA Cate]

Chris mentioned they already have rental properties. Possibly it would work for him to turn one of them into the boat, and rent out his primary residence as others have suggested. That would possibly take the inflation of land property issue out of the question.

Where possible (and it is not always a financial "go"), keeping the familiar residence can give people a feeling of having something to fall back on, something to go home to. When the home you love is sold, to where is it that one would "go home?"

Chris' wife has led a business life, and we do not know what she wants/expects. It may be that for her she needs extra space to be able to simply relax. She's worked hard, too, for their lifestyle. And their daughter needs to be launched, as well. Somehow, they need to be involved in the decisions. AND, it isn't all about what they want: it is a family enterprise, which is meant to be good (sustainable) for all of them, without compromising the parents senior years, which usually means declining health, and can mean life saving surgery in exotic locations, or returning to the country of citizenship for the medical care. Go back and read what happened to <wingless>, Fred and his wife.

Ann

[Leakie Marine]

My strong suggestion would be fall out of love with the Antares

The boat you start with will not be your forever boat, start cheaper and smaller so you can get out there sooner and have some coin for things you find you need.
I retired in my mid 40's and had a perfectly capable 40' cruisier/racer. 15 years later I had still not head out on my open ended cruising dream I had to do some upgrades, then found a "better' boat that I then had to upgrade

An old salt said to me a long time ago that the best boat for cruising is the boat you have, just push off and make it work!

My first 2 weeks out proved that I spent too much money on things I thought I would want and not enough on the things that I would like.

Get out there, things will work out

[ixnax]

Originally Posted by chris.burcher

Hi everyone,

My wife and I are in an unfortunate situation. Our launch time is approaching. She is nearly retired and we can exit the proverbial rat race in a few months (summer 2024). We have planned to sell the house and buy the boat sometime in the next six months and it is finally here.

Unfortunately, we fell in love with Antares and it remains alone at the top of our list. Second and third-place contenders are quite distant (probably a Lagoon 42 or Leopard 44 as they are available). The problem is, the second and third place boats are in our budget and more available.

We would love it if a used Antares under $600k comes on the market this spring, but we know those chances are slim. And at that price, it would likely have to be pre-2008 which lowers the probability even more due to numbers.

There is an Antares available now that looks nice, but it blows our budget by $150k as it is a 2014.

So, the classic dilemma arises.

Do we blow our budget and struggle to some degree? We will have the money once we sell our house so it is possible. But we won't have very much in the way of an emergency fund.

Or do we make do with something cheaper, more cheaply made, and that will require more refitting to stay in our budget and maintain a healthier emergency fund?

It seems there are two schools of thought here: 1) you only live once, buy the Antares, and 2) stay safe, stick with your budget, and 'just get out there'.

My wife is less financially risk-averse. I'm a frugal bastard. Is this one of those times to let loose, or to stay the course?

Thanks for any input you can share!

I owned a 2016 Antares. They are great boats and hold their value well. So if you are a proper frugal bastard then you should definitely be thinking about that unexpected cold rainy day at an auction sale price.

[donradcliffe]

Originally Posted by boatpoker

Sold my house in 94' for $475k ...
It would cost me $2.8 million to buy it back today

We rented our house out for $30k/yr for 15 years, and when we sold the boat the house had appreciated another half million. The boat depreciated, but we had a place to come home to.

[gingerclark]

My two cents.
I'd say if you love it, do it. Could be a mistake but you're young enough to financially recover from it, This boat has to potential to bring you great enjoyment and buying it is in error is so much better than being sorry you didn't try. I only say that because you brought in the Wow factor.

[gsuescum]

Lots of options that don’t break the bank

https://www.facebook.com/groups/worl...8773983538684/

https://www.facebook.com/groups/Cata...658068734325/?

https://www.facebook.com/groups/Cata...070484059750/?

[chris.burcher]

Hi everyone. Below is a comment from my wife. My thoughts to follow in next post.

Hello all! Chris’ wife here. I would like to thank everyone for taking the time to read, reply, and give us your honest opinions. I would like to add my 2 cents.

First, pushing the bank. In my opinion, this does not break our bank. Our emergency fund is separate from any sailing kitty. Does a more expensive boat leave less of a kitty, sure. But – assume for the next two years we have more than the median American income coming in passively. Outside of any boat purchase. After those two years is a bit to be determined, but we can assume with the rental income and retirement savings we’ll get by just fine. Also, despite the fact that I was a Monopoly dominator in my youth, our house isn’t one we would want to hold on to and rent. Not only due to size and finish, but we would not want to return to such a large house. 3 of the 4 kids are out of the nest and frankly, I don’t want a house this big with as much land to upkeep. We are not ‘fancy’ people – in fact, the fact that our town now has a Walmart is a negative to us! We fly coach. With the exception of once due to circumstance, we buy used cars. We are also younger – I anticipate we will be gainfully employed again at some point in the future (I don’t sit still well). None of our big children plan to return to the town we currently live in, though with kids, who really knows

Second, why I loved the Antares. It felt SAFE. I could see everywhere. I have never sailed on one; that is true. The layout made sense to me for our family. Plenty of storage space (no, I don’t mean for tons of clothes or books - outside of homeschool materials!). Could I go on something smaller/cheaper? Sure, no problem, within reason. I can go backpacking for a week doing nothing but bush wees, have a great time, and love it. The layout made sense to me. There is enough space to get away from each other. Enough space if our big kids come to visit. It felt nice – and frankly, I feel like we deserve something nice after how hard I have been working. There seems to be a nicely connected community of owners. Also, I do not want 4 heads to upkeep LOL.

Health – I want us to go now. I don’t want us to spend 9 months refitting. I have seen enough death and debility to want to make the experiences while we can. Tomorrow is not a guarantee. I’m not sure what Ann is talking about with Fred/Windless, my searching skills failed me, but hopefully he is doing well. I figure if something happens while we are out there we die like the locals do.

MicHughV – I love you J Thank you Ann, Guillermo, Bloodhound, David, and the rest for your thought out opinions.

PS – can you hear me urging you to tell my husband it’s okay to not always be frugal? :P

[chris.burcher]

I appreciate everyone's thoughts, opinions, comments, and prejudices. I don't claim to know which category any of them fall into.

I think I probably asked this question wrong. For me, this isn't about money. And, yes, I realize that is an extremely privileged thing to say. I'm lucky in that respect. In MANY respects. So buying a more or less expensive boat is more about general responsibility than the actual cash - for me.

I realize my family is probably quite 'set' when it comes to finances through and beyond our deaths. It's been over a decade of hard work to make that happen. So much so that it is hard for me to believe. Hard to TRUST. Hard to release my FEAR of money . . . not having enough. . . dying with too much . . . not living my life because I am buried in concerns about, around, and toward money.

I may have an unhealthy attitude about money. I've tried to change that, but I'm not sure I should . . . or want to. This concern for money is mostly something I learned from the world - it isn't mine. I still haven't made peace with the idea that, upon birth, we are required to work and earn money just to live our lives. That doesn't make any sense to me.

Human concerns around money are unhealthy in many ways. Again, to me. I get it that others disagree. That is not an unusual scenario in my world. I wouldn't change it for a thing. My wife gets me. And my kids, it seems, do as well. I wouldn't trade that for all the money in the world.

[ranger58sb]

Originally Posted by chris.burcher

I still haven't made peace with the idea that, upon birth, we are required to work and earn money just to live our lives. That doesn't make any sense to me.

That's not actually a firm requirement. You can grow your own food, cobble your own shoes, make your own clothing, etc... ideally by homesteading (or inheriting) land somewhere...

Or trading labor for land. Or trading labor for shoes... or clothing...



-Chris

[chris.burcher]

If it were just me? Maybe. Right or wrong I consider the other people sharing my life and their own needs/wants/desires/feelings. I try hard not to impose my own needs/wants/desires/feelings on others or assume they are equal.

Plus, the scenario you propose is very oversimplified. I know people trying to live that lifestyle and it doesn't represent a viable alternative to me.

[Kinkircating]

Originally Posted by chris.burcher

I appreciate everyone's thoughts, opinions, comments, and prejudices. I don't claim to know which category any of them fall into.

I think I probably asked this question wrong. For me, this isn't about money. And, yes, I realize that is an extremely privileged thing to say. I'm lucky in that respect. In MANY respects. So buying a more or less expensive boat is more about general responsibility than the actual cash - for me.

I realize my family is probably quite 'set' when it comes to finances through and beyond our deaths. It's been over a decade of hard work to make that happen. So much so that it is hard for me to believe. Hard to TRUST. Hard to release my FEAR of money . . . not having enough. . . dying with too much . . . not living my life because I am buried in concerns about, around, and toward money.

I may have an unhealthy attitude about money. I've tried to change that, but I'm not sure I should . . . or want to. This concern for money is mostly something I learned from the world - it isn't mine. I still haven't made peace with the idea that, upon birth, we are required to work and earn money just to live our lives. That doesn't make any sense to me.

Human concerns around money are unhealthy in many ways. Again, to me. I get it that others disagree. That is not an unusual scenario in my world. I wouldn't change it for a thing. My wife gets me. And my kids, it seems, do as well. I wouldn't trade that for all the money in the world.

If you've truly have enough money to live comfortably the rest of your lives and leave a nice nest egg left over, I'd highly suggest reading two books, (1) The Psychology of Money and (2) Die with Zero. These will help put some framework to your concerns.

Now my rule of thumb is depreciating assets should not make up more than roughly 10% of your Net Worth in order for things not to get uncomfortable financially. Maybe stretching to 20% if you are over the age of 55. So, if your income producing assets are over $6 million and you are debating between getting the boat you want or settling for less...get the freaking Antares. If not, I think you will be happier with less boat and not feeling that financial burden you are communicating that you currently feel.

Good luck and go have fun!

[ranger58sb]

Originally Posted by chris.burcher

Plus, the scenario you propose is very oversimplified. I know people trying to live that lifestyle and it doesn't represent a viable alternative to me.

Certainly. Hence the typical choice to earn money doing whatever, using the money in exchange for whatever.

Earning money is generally optional. Folks could just instead curl up and die, instead. Many don't chose that option, though.

Just commenting about your stated inability to make sense of why people need "to work and earn money just to live our lives." Maybe an option for some might be expecting parents (or somebody... or "the State"?) to do/provide everything... forever...

Otherwise, I don't have much of a dog in the discussion...

-Chris

[nofacey]

You’ve been shopping for 5 years, and are tired of waiting…….sounds like you’ve already decided you can’t afford the Antares, or you’d own one.

There is NO boat that is cruise ready - they all take something, or develop a need in short order; true ocean cruising is hard on boats.

You haven’t said where you’re starting from or cruising thru in the first year…….I’d get less of “the perfect Antares” and head for where the sailing is easy (Caribbean). Work up your boat & crew, then decide how to proceed. It takes less boat to bounce between islands than circumnavigate

[JPA Cate]

I’m not sure what Ann is talking about with Fred/Windless, my searching skills failed me, but hopefully he is doing well.

Hello, Mrs. B, I must apologize. I made a typo. Fred from Wingless. Long story short, they were in Mexico, Judy went in hospital for a routine procedure, something went wrong, and he decided after about 4 wks, more or less, to take her off life support. They had been one of those really good fit for each other couples, and someone started a gofundme for her. It was very sad, indeed.

If you can afford the loss of the Antares, and both of you're in love with it, go for it. You only go around once, so far as we know. It is a very large boat for a first boat, but to me, if it's your heart's desire, then go for it. It is only yourselves that get hurt if it all turns pear shaped. What you don't know about it being at sea in a boat for days; you don't know if your bodies will accustom well to catamaran twitching, but most seem to not mind. You don't know about the ocean at large and crossing oceans, but I once was seasick for 21 days on a 24 day passage, and I didn't stop sailing, so that's only an unknowable personality/perseverance question.... If you're content to go backpacking (bush walking to our Ozzie mates), chances are you'll do for sailing.

Ann